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10 ex freedom 900's go to asa not mesaba

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heres another one from the old crystal ball.....dc9s and md88s will be parked and larger RJs will be added to DCI. Not quite up to 100 seats but really REALLY close.

some time in the not too distant future, DCI will handle all flying below 100 seats and Mama D will handle anything over 100.

Bank on it.
 
sweptback said:
Why, ALPA doesn't make business decisions?
Click to expand...

Another ALPA talking point....

What are scope sections? They impose business decisions on airlines....don't they?

ALPA may not make the actual business decisions...but you can't actually believe that ALPA contracts don't influence business decisions....
 
sweptback said:
Why, ALPA doesn't make business decisions?
Click to expand...

Well, let's see - someone mentioned how this all went down: Mesa to Comair to Pinnacle to Mesaba to ASA.

See anything in common there, perhaps something along the lines of pilot representation?

Now... Comair was furloughing, Mesaba was hiring. Mesaba requires new hires to resign seniority from their previous airline.

What do those two airlines have in common? See anything wrong with this picture?

How many airlines are flying as Delta Connection?

Now... ALPA will tell you that there is nothing they can do about it. I tend to disagree, but then again, what do I know...
 
ohplease! said:
heres another one from the old crystal ball.....dc9s and md88s will be parked and larger RJs will be added to DCI. Not quite up to 100 seats but really REALLY close.

some time in the not too distant future, DCI will handle all flying below 100 seats and Mama D will handle anything over 100.

Bank on it.
Click to expand...

DAL pilots would have to vote and agree to this, somehow I doubt they would ever do that.
 
Freight Dog said:
Well, let's see - someone mentioned how this all went down: Mesa to Comair to Pinnacle to Mesaba to ASA.

See anything in common there, perhaps something along the lines of pilot representation?

Now... Comair was furloughing, Mesaba was hiring. Mesaba requires new hires to resign seniority from their previous airline.

What do those two airlines have in common? See anything wrong with this picture?

How many airlines are flying as Delta Connection?

Now... ALPA will tell you that there is nothing they can do about it. I tend to disagree, but then again, what do I know...
Click to expand...

Of those 5 airlines, the 900s only actually operated at 2 so far. And, they never would have left Freedom if their company could have operated them within the range of their DCI contract. Just because a company announces that they're getting new airplanes doesn't mean a thing, just like the old saying goes.

I don't really blame ALPA for all of this, I knew what I signed up for when I came to ASA. We're at the beck and call of Delta and the DCI network, everybody here knows this.

If the Delta pilots cared about DCI, this would get fixed. But they don't, so they gladly have 7+ carriers operate Delta passengers on former Delta routes so they can keep their widebody pay high.

I don't think anybody would doubt that Delta management's wet dream is to have a ton of contractors all fighting for their piece of the DL code pie. Every time the Delta pilots have drawn their line in the sand (turboprops, then 50 seats, then 70 seats, then 76 seats) it's ended up moving once they get close to the scope limit. At what point is the DAL MEC going to stand up and say, no more?
 
outtahere said:
Just like they would never vote for 76 seaters right!
Click to expand...

Sorry, lots of guys on property now that were not there last time. Tide is changing at DAL. Not gonna happen, BANK ON IT! DC-9's and MD88 not parked(at least over next few years). Any replacement WILL be flown at mainline, period! IMHO, you will see more shuffling of 900's to non W/O. That way DAL can park W/O 50 seaters and trade 900's for 50's(not 1 for 1 just like this deal) at non W/O, therefore enabling more 50's to be parked.
 
Freight Dog said:
Well, let's see - someone mentioned how this all went down: Mesa to Comair to Pinnacle to Mesaba to ASA.

See anything in common there, perhaps something along the lines of pilot representation?

Now... Comair was furloughing, Mesaba was hiring. Mesaba requires new hires to resign seniority from their previous airline.

What do those two airlines have in common? See anything wrong with this picture?

How many airlines are flying as Delta Connection?

Now... ALPA will tell you that there is nothing they can do about it. I tend to disagree, but then again, what do I know...
Click to expand...



Indeed-not much... Of course, the village moron usually doesn't.

-"Truthiness," indeed
 
MJ42 said:
Sorry, lots of guys on property now that were not there last time. Tide is changing at DAL. Not gonna happen, BANK ON IT! DC-9's and MD88 not parked(at least over next few years). Any replacement WILL be flown at mainline, period! IMHO, you will see more shuffling of 900's to non W/O. That way DAL can park W/O 50 seaters and trade 900's for 50's(not 1 for 1 just like this deal) at non W/O, therefore enabling more 50's to be parked.
Click to expand...
right up until they get furloughed....then its the same old bunch.

dont worry too much though. Mainline is going to get quite a few widebodies out of the deal.
 
ohplease! said:
right up until they get furloughed....then its the same old bunch.

dont worry too much though. Mainline is going to get quite a few widebodies out of the deal.
Click to expand...

That's funny! You actually believe your fantasy land theory. We have no plans to furlough. Our entire list is changing its tune. Mid seniority level will not let it happen again, junior guys will not let it happen. Some senior guys might not care, but they will be grossly outnumbered. Keep dreaming, and have fun flying rj's the rest of your career!

P.S. I forgot you know it all, and have everything figured out. Thanks for enlightening us with your wisDUMB.
 
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MJ42 said:
That's funny! You actually believe your fantasy land theory. We have no plans to furlough. Our entire list is changing its tune. Mid seniority level will not let it happen again, junior guys will not let it happen. Some senior guys might not care, but they will be grossly outnumbered. Keep dreaming, and have fun flying rj's the rest of your career!
Click to expand...
nobody ever has plans to furlough dumbass...right up until "oops! we need to furlough".

your entire list has caved every time it came down to it (not a bad thing...smart plays actually) and after losing 50% of their pay and their retirement....theres no way in he!! they're going to sacrifice even more to fly 85-90 seat RJs.

9's/88's will be replaced with 73's, wide bodies and bigger RJs at DCI.
 
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ohplease! said:
nobody ever has plans to furlough dumbass...right up until "oops! we need to furlough".

your entire list has caved every time it came down to it and after losing 50% of their pay and their retirement....theres no way in he!! their going to sacrifice even more to fly 85-90 seat RJs.

9's/88's will be replaced with 73's, wide bodies and bigger RJs at DCI.
Click to expand...

Like I said, you know it all(at least you think you do). Tell me oh wise one, why are we bringing DC-9's out of the desert? Why did we award a lot of DC-9 CA on this last award? Why was a memo sent out to DC-9 CA and F/O's looking for instructors? RA likes the DC-9 if fuel costs are low. RA hates 50 seaters and is doing what he needs to thin the fleet. RA does not like that there are so many DCI carriers, there won't be as many soon. Please teach me, I'd like to learn from some Auburn punk ass hick...

You seem very bitter towards DAL, kinda makes me think you wanted to work here. Must have been problems with the psyche test. :nuts:
 
Last edited:
MJ42 said:
Like I said, you know it all(at least you think you do). Tell me oh wise one, why are we bringing DC-9's out of the desert? Why did we award a lot of DC-9 CA on this last award? Why was a memo sent out to DC-9 CA and F/O's looking for instructors? RA likes the DC-9 if fuel costs are low. RA hates 50 seaters and is doing what he needs to thin the fleet. RA does not like that there are so many DCI carriers, there won't be as many soon. Please teach me, I'd like to learn from some Auburn punk ass hick...
Click to expand...
I've already sent the tablets down the mountain for you to live by...you now have the vision.

nope. If I were to be bitter, it'd be toward NWA and RA. I've never had any desire to go to Delta. Just can't see myself beside such a pampas ass like yourself for more than just a few minutes.
 
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ohplease! said:
I've already sent the tablets down the mountain for you to live by...you now have the vision.

nope. If I were to be bitter, it'd be toward NWA and RA.SO WE TURNED YOU DOWN, TOO? I've never had any desire to go to Delta. Just can't see myself beside such a pampas ass like yourself for more than just a few minutes.
Click to expand...

Since you modified your post I'll have to quote you again.

I AM FORMER NWA DUMBASS!
 
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MJ42 said:
That way DAL can park W/O 50 seaters and trade 900's for 50's(not 1 for 1 just like this deal) at non W/O, therefore enabling more 50's to be parked.
Click to expand...

This wasn't 1-for-1, it was 1-for-2.
 
sweptback said:
Of those 5 airlines, the 900s only actually operated at 2 so far. And, they never would have left Freedom if their company could have operated them within the range of their DCI contract. Just because a company announces that they're getting new airplanes doesn't mean a thing, just like the old saying goes.

I don't really blame ALPA for all of this, I knew what I signed up for when I came to ASA. We're at the beck and call of Delta and the DCI network, everybody here knows this.

If the Delta pilots cared about DCI, this would get fixed. But they don't, so they gladly have 7+ carriers operate Delta passengers on former Delta routes so they can keep their widebody pay high.

I don't think anybody would doubt that Delta management's wet dream is to have a ton of contractors all fighting for their piece of the DL code pie. Every time the Delta pilots have drawn their line in the sand (turboprops, then 50 seats, then 70 seats, then 76 seats) it's ended up moving once they get close to the scope limit. At what point is the DAL MEC going to stand up and say, no more?
Click to expand...

Everyone has their Rez O. Lewshun....here at ASA ours is Sweptback...

At least you now admit that the Delta mainline pilots don't care about us....Given that, why should we care about them.....Given all of that....Are we really "fraternal brothers"?

Save the ALPA talking points for Rez.....
 
You know after a maelstrom of bad news from every corner nowadays, this announcement, as a junior FO, gave me a reason to smile and relive the expericence of jumping up and down on a bed.

Thanks to all you guys who have been busting your butts to push back on time and to make A-14 on arrival.
 
blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

So there!

And another thing; blah blah blah blah blah!!!
 
USCtrojan said:
And don't forget. We don't know the scheduled "retirement" date for these 50 seaters. It may result initially in a net gain, then over a period of time ASA slowly removes them from service. Smart if that's the way it works out, perhaps ASA won't have to furlough, then can find another home (Carrier) for those 50 seaters going out of service.

Trojan
Click to expand...
The way Delta worked it with us was all 50 seaters were scheduled for return immeditely. We did a one for one, but you guys got hosed on the deal. So as soon as you take delivery of one -900; two 50 seaters are taken off the line for return. Delta wants to shed 50 seaters as fast as possible. We got hosed becuase we returned 14 50 seaters and only got 13 -900s in return.
 
Seaknight1 said:
The way Delta worked it with us was all 50 seaters were scheduled for return immeditely. We did a one for one, but you guys got hosed on the deal. So as soon as you take delivery of one -900; two 50 seaters are taken off the line for return. Delta wants to shed 50 seaters as fast as possible. We got hosed becuase we returned 14 50 seaters and only got 13 -900s in return.
Click to expand...

Alot can happen between now and the date the 50-seaters are supposed to be retired, which is 2nd quarter 2010. The fact that we are not wholly owned allows us to use those airframes for someone else. I wouldnt say we got hosed on the deal.

That bid we had in for United might come back on the table now.
 

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