Southwest Nose Gear Collapse LGA

[filejw]

Things are gettin' real ugly in mhea. Simmah dahn nah.

It appears that this LGA crew really dorked the landing, but the airline-wide broad brush painting of systemic piloting shortcomings is really petty and just looks like sour grapes over personal grudges.

SWA, being the largest domestic airline, obviously has the highest opportunity for mishaps. Given that, their safety record is damned fine.

For sure this. Plus some of you with the can't happen to me attitude maybe in for a rude awaking some day cause it can. I have had some pretty sharp folks point me in directions on landing they themselves wonder about.Including pushing he nose way over after bouncing.Fly safe guys and girls.

 

[HA25]

Metal fatigue caused by years of taking 90 degree turns at 40 knots?


Just kidding guys.

I'm sorry, but that's funny... had to laugh.

whole thing sucks tho... added to Asiana's "landing" I expect the FAA and Ms. NTSB will have all sorts of "suggestions" for "improved safety" for ALL of us to comply with shortly...

 

[rumrnr78]

Really, dumbass?

In the last ten years, Southwest has wrecked exactly ZERO jets. That's zero. In fact, in over 42 years of operation, only ONE jet has ever been written off (BUR overrun in 2000, an accident involving an older -300, with zero fatalities, and zero serious injuries), because it wasn't cost-effective to repair.

Southwest has NEVER killed a passenger, and has only had one fatality attributed to our operation (6-year old Joshua Woods in the 2005 MDW accident, who choked to death after the overrun plane hit his parent's car and he was stuck inside). Aside from the BUR plane, this was the most serious damage ever done to a Southwest airplane, and the airplane was repaired and returned to service, and is still flying today.

What airline do YOU work for, Xanderman? Would you like to compare safety records? Or would you just prefer to keep talking out of your ass? You ARE right about one thing, however--talk IS cheap. And somebody SHOULD take a closer look. At how ignorant and stupid your remarks are.

Bubba

Easy tiger. Do you remember Amarillo in 2003? Ok, a tiny bit outside 10 years but as I was a 3 1/2 month CRJ captain who knew better to hold until the storms past whilst SWA shot an approach to the most convienient (not appropriate) runway and ended up off the runway then back on losing the nose gear in the process:

http://investigativereportingworkshop.org/flying-cheap/incident/20030603X00763/1/

I can also recite a time where I decided to hold at Okmulgee (due to T-Storms in Tulsa) while SWA shot an approach into Tulsa only to go missed and join us in the hold.

I have some dear friends at SWA so I am sorry too sound negative. SWA has a great customer spirit I like but from the outside looking in I would not fit in the flight ops side.

Cheers-

Rum

 

[SWA Bubba]

You arrogant SOB, you ran into a gas station in Cali and killed an innocent bystander in MY city, Chicago. You bitches have just been lucky.

-I'm- the arrogant one? Your pretend outrage is laughable.

Let's see... You work for USAir, right? From Sept 89 to July 94 (a just-under five year period), your airline crashed (and completely destroyed) FIVE airplanes, killing a total of 232 passengers and crew. And this doesn't count minor stuff like off-runway incidents with only minor or no damage. And then you have the actual nutsack to bash OUR safety record. Nice.

I'm not trying to say that Southwest is perfect, but rather that our safety record is one of the best in the world. We fly more passengers in the US than any other airline, and have never killed or seriously injured any of them. How many of you anonymous blowhards, working for other majors, can say the same thing?

Yet every time something happens, no matter how minor, and no matter how many times it happens more often to other airlines, the same Internet dumbasses jump all over Southwest and bloviate like we're some third-world airline killing people left and right. All the while pretending that their airlines are perfect. And they do it with glee; that's the sickest part.

Like I said, I'll put Southwest's safety record up against any of your airlines'.

Bubba

 

[Noserider76]

Why are we such d**ks to each other on internet web boards? We're all out there doing the best we can and it's pretty damn good. It's a credit to every one in the industry that any event at all gets the attention it does.

 

[SENECAII]

Why are we such d**ks to each other on internet web boards? We're all out there doing the best we can and it's pretty damn good. It's a credit to every one in the industry that any event at all gets the attention it does.

Because 'we' are hiding behind keyboards with screen names and not sitting next to each other in the cockpit talking about poon-tang.:beer:

 

[scoreboardII]

So they say it could happen to anyone, but why so many for Southwest?

In recent years:

1455 @ BUR
1248 @ MDW
1919 @ MDW
345 @ LGA


then not to mention sliding off the Taxiway twice last year:

1905 @ DEN
4695 @ ISP


Things that make you go hrmmm...

post up a few places you work or worked, let me see what I can google...

 

[Hpilot]

How many planes have we "taken off-roading compared to everyone else"? Well, fewer than Delta (and its Delta Connections) in the last year alone. The last five or so such incidents have been them. We don't make such a big deal about it, because minor sh1t like that happens to everyone. However when it happens to us, all the forum idiots like you go on for 20 pages on FI about our "safety culture" and "dangerous" taxiing. Do you know how many incidents of any kind at Southwest, in our history, that have been attributed to taxi speeds? Zero. Your Southwest "evidence" of safety culture is just anecdotal BS ("I've got a friend at Southwest who says..." Yeah, sure you do.)

Tell us about YOUR airline, HPilot. Seriously. I'd be happy to compare safety records. How many passengers we each fly, and how many passenger fatalities we're responsible for. Our head is not in the sand, and we don't "ignore" safety issues. And the way we do business isn't "gonna get people killed," no matter how much you blabber about it anonymously, and no matter how much you'd obviously like to see that happen just so you can say, "I told you so."

Bubba

The way you react speaks volumes. If I'd have to guess, you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

 

[Hpilot]

You arrogant SOB, you ran into a gas station in Cali and killed an innocent bystander in MY city, Chicago. You bitches have just been lucky.

He'll bring up everyone else's safety issues and ignore his company's own. It's like talking to an alcoholic. Complete denial and it's everyone else?s fault.

 

[Hpilot]

When I first got to SW in the mid-nineties, some of the statements above were basically correct. I remember thinking to myself "are these guys for real?". That was then and this is now. Now, it's polar opposite. Seriously. I can't speak for what happened in LGA but "SLOW THE F DOWN" has been a mantra for some time now. Go-arounds are mandatory if you do not meet stabilized approach criteria by 1000' AGL. No wiggle room there. I'm still shaking my head trying to figure out how this could have happened.

I'm glad to hear that. The conversations I had with a friend about go-arounds were back around 00'-04'. I had heard things had improved.

 

[Dornier 335]

Let's see... You work for USAir, right? From Sept 89 to July 94 (a just-under five year period), your airline crashed (and completely destroyed) FIVE airplanes, killing a total of 232 passengers and crew. And this doesn't count minor stuff like off-runway incidents with only minor or no damage. And then you have the actual nutsack to bash OUR safety record. Nice.

Why don't you calm down and read up on those five accidents before you start making comparisons?

Quick description of those five accidents:

20 September 1989, Flight 5050, B734, Deflection of rudder during takeoff

01 February 1991, Flight 1493, B734, ATC controller separation error

22 March 1992, Flight 405, FK28-4, Improper deicing procedures, pilot error

02 July 1994, Flight 1016, DC-9-32, windshear during missed approach

08 September 1994, Flight 427, B733, uncommanded rudder deflection

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

Why are we such d**ks to each other on internet web boards? We're all out there doing the best we can and it's pretty damn good. It's a credit to every one in the industry that any event at all gets the attention it does.

This ^^^^^

Think what it would be like if we saw each other in the hotel bar and started yelling at each other this way. I'd prefer to chill and have a beer.

 

[kwick]

Accidents happen, but when you always taxi faster than everybody else,
and you always fly the approach faster than everybody else, you have to
accept responsibility for accidents, when they happen.

When you you don't hire the best pilots available, you have to accept the
consequences..

The "Buddy system" doesn't work when it comes to safety!

 

[vixin]

Funny I had only been at SWA for two months and told a CA to GA even started to push the power up for him. I won't go into details but he thanked me once we got to the gate. Lets wait for the details before we linch these two. There isn't an airline flying that has a perfect record for whatever the reasons. Unfortunate circumstances happen. Just hope you are never the one in this situation.

 

[Jetjockey]

What a flight number......5050......I don't think I like those odds.

 

[Black Sheep]

Accident: Southwest B737 at New York on Jul 22nd 2013, nose gear collapse on landing
​

By Simon Hradecky, created Tuesday, Jul 23rd 2013 01:53Z, last updated Friday, Jul 26th 2013 04:41Z
On Jul 26th the NTSB reported that the cockpit voice recorder contained 2 hours of good data including the entire flight from Nashville, the flight data recorder contained 27 hours of data including the flight from Nashville. According to the flight data recorder the flaps were extended from 30 to 40 degrees 56 seconds prior to touch down, the aircraft flared reaching 134 KIAS and an attitude of 2 degrees nose up at 32 feet AGL, then dropped the nose to 3 degrees nose down at touchdown at 133 KIAS about 4 seconds later. The aircraft stopped about 19 seconds after touchdown. Flight data as well as evidential videos suggest the nose gear made contact with the runway prior to the main landing gear.

 

[zymotic]

Think what it would be like if we saw each other in the hotel bar and started yelling at each other this way.

It would be like an East and West crew typical encounter.

 

[Remington]

Have some downtime here at the FBO. Looks like SWA flies 1,200,000 legs a year. As a percentage, they are pretty darn safe. Ten years is 12,000,000 legs.

 

[DCAA320]

It would be like an East and West crew typical encounter.

You are incorrect. Ran into a west crew on some island, one of their guys bought us dinner, we bought them drinks afterwards.

Contrary to popular belief, not all east guys hate west guys, and not all west guys hate east guys.

Hopefully the typical encounters will be positive.

We are eventually gonna start flying together.

FI is not an accurate sampling of professional pilots.

 

[SWA Bubba]

He'll bring up everyone else's safety issues and ignore his company's own. It's like talking to an alcoholic. Complete denial and it's everyone else?s fault.

Nice post. Too bad it's complete crap.

I don't bring up "everyone else's safety issues" while ignoring Southwest's. I only brought up DCA's company record after his ridiculous post feigning outrage like we killed a kid (in HIS city, by God!) on purpose or something. That doesn't sound like "everyone's" safety record to me. Can't you count any higher than one, HPilot?

A lot of you haters (and you're one of the biggest in this regard, HPilot) go on and on about Southwest's safety record, and act like it's the worst. Then they somehow neglect to mention or remember that their own company's record is much worse, which is of course exactly what you accused me of. A pathetic attempt at deflection, by the way.

I'd be happy to talk about our safety record. Not that I need to, because I can count on one of YOU guys to bring up everything you can think of no matter what happens. However, you always seem to forget to talk about other airlines, when something happens to them. Gee, I wonder why. Hey, I have an idea--let's talk about YOUR airline's record when we're done talking about SWA, okay HPilot?

Southwest's "worst accidents" in our entire 42-plus year history:

BUR overrun (#1455)-- zero fatalities or serious injuries; plane was written off after it was determined it wasn't cost-effective to fix. And despite DCA's inexplicably angry accusations, we did NOT "hit a gas station in Cali[fornia]."

MDW overrun (#1248)-- one fatality on the ground, zero fatalities or serious injuries (on the plane); aircraft repaired and returned to service.

AMA depart the side of runway during landing (#2066)-- zero fatalities or injuries of any sort; aircraft repaired and returned to service.

LGA hard landing (#345)-- zero fatalities or serious injuries; aircraft will be repaired and returned to service.

And of course a handful of "off the pavement" incidents with no fatalities or injuries, all with minor or no damage (#1919, 1905, 4695).


Anything ELSE you'd like to talk about? If i've missed anything, please let me know. i'd hate to be accused of sugar-coating anything. The sum of all the accidents in Southwest's entire life history totals one aircraft written off and parted out, and one ground fatality from the most unlikely method imaginable (and yes, I know we're still responsible regardless), and most importantly, ZERO passengers or crew ever killed or seriously injured.

Yet the few of you take a disturbing amount of glee in gloating anytime something happens to Southwest, and then pretend that we have the worst safety record out there. The fact is, that by all measures quantifiable, Southwest has one of, if not THE, best safety record out there.

Okay, all you equal-opportunity professional safety inspectors, let's all line up to compare your company's record.... Who wants to be first?

Bubba