9E Wins Race to Bottom

[COOPERVANE]

A good review of our history. We are playing checkers on a chessboard

http://www.culturewars.com/2011/Pilots.htm

 

[Av8rPHX]

From pubic Infomation:

81 posts and not one comment on this?? You guys are slipping!!!

 

[livin'thesim]

Go research "pattern bargaining" and the history of contract negotiations under the RLA and get back to us.

Go study economics. That will trump pilot-think mythology any day of the week.

The contracts from those days were negotiated in an entirely different economic environment. The so-called "bar" effect appeared to be valid due to the environment at the time.

But pilots still believe in their pet mythologies, because it is easier than going through the difficult work of understanding how a market actually works.

 

[777forever]

Go study economics. That will trump pilot-think mythology any day of the week.

The contracts from those days were negotiated in an entirely different economic environment. The so-called "bar" effect appeared to be valid due to the environment at the time.

But pilots still believe in their pet mythologies, because it is easier than going through the difficult work of understanding how a market actually works.

Well said!

Sent from my HTC One X+ using Tapatalk 2

 

[xjhawk]

It will pass 70/30. That is my prediction as there are too many people who need a few key items to get them by until there is hiring elsewhere (not regionals).

The ultra senior pilots (XJ)-will vote yes as they want their spot at Delta in a year or two. Those who think their age is preventing them from going will most likely vote yes just to hold onto a $85k a year job for the next few years before they retire.

The middle seniority and low seniority captains will vote yes for keeping a job until they see something better come along. some are even buying into the "bridge agreement" but those are the higher seniority ones who are not 5-7 years away from that "interview". Good luck if you called in sick too much or any trips to the chiefs office are documented-as Delta will be reviewing all that before you walk into your interview.

Everyone is also looking at the options out there if we close up shop. Starting over means no vacation, year 1 pay and a lot of other contract things we have that such places as Go Jets does not have-we will still have our min day, trip guaranty, better vacation than if we started over etc etc. All you telling us to vote no should have been negotiating a deal to get us or give us our seniority and work rules vacation etc at your airline if we voted no and Pinnacle shut down. Its easy to say vote no and end up on the street when its not your job.

The FO's will vote mainly yes for many of the above reasons and the fact that it is easier to look for a job while we still have a job.

Those that vote no-well I cannot blame them. The TA sucks. Its unbelievable that ALPA national and our MEC are pushing a yes vote-I do think there is a conflict of interest as Delta ALPA knew this was going to happen with the loss of our CRJ 200 fleet-and the more money Delta makes by screwing Pinnacle, the more money Delta pilots can make. Those that vote no are just stubborn and have the resources or lack of mortgage/family to support and can make that brave vote of no. Hell I wish I had a sugar mama to support me while I voted no and became jobless.

Until ALPA has equal representation or there is a method for supporting pilots who draw a line in the sand-guess what? Shut up with telling me how to vote for my career. My vote was based solely on my economic and future job search. For you idiots out there.....My vote was to keep a job while I look for a new job. To make my mortgage, support my kids, and find a new job.

 

[ex j-41]

At some point you have to determine what you are worth and how much you will allow management to steal from you.
At what point would you vote "no"?
How bad does the TA have to suck in order for you to tell management "no"?
Pinnacle is in this predicament because of management. Both Delta and Pinnacle.
Why should they get the screaming deal of the century while you suffer?
And why is this acceptable to you? Your selling out yourself and the rest of your brothers by voting yes.
Vote "no". Collect unemployment insurance and find another job. There are plenty out there that will start at $50k. He'll you might even be able to get insurance to buy you a type rating.

 

[bri5150]

Alpa should pay the "signing bonus" for this to be voted down. This ta would not pass and alpa would have held the line.

 

[Theoden]

How does the court rejecting Pinnacle's contract help pilots at other airlines? How does Pinnacle going under and flooding the market with unemployed pilots help other airlines? These are two possible outcomes if Pinnacle pilots vote down the TA. Resent history has shown that we have very little power indeed. Pay will go up when the demand for pilots is greater than the supply.

 

[xjhawk]

At some point you have to determine what you are worth and how much you will allow management to steal from you.
At what point would you vote "no"?
How bad does the TA have to suck in order for you to tell management "no"?
Pinnacle is in this predicament because of management. Both Delta and Pinnacle.
Why should they get the screaming deal of the century while you suffer?
And why is this acceptable to you? Your selling out yourself and the rest of your brothers by voting yes.
Vote "no". Collect unemployment insurance and find another job. There are plenty out there that will start at $50k. He'll you might even be able to get insurance to buy you a type rating.

You are a fool and clueless on the industry as it sits right now and in the coming year and clueless on the state of our economy and what it takes to make a mortgage payment and support a family.

Dont tell me what to do with my career-worry about your own. Your time will come and when that time comes-vote no and live on your unemployment-as I cannot keep my house on unemployment so kiss my ass

 

[ex j-41]

I'm the fool?
You are selling out the whole industry.
I'm not the one lacking integrity.