C'mon July

[Humphreybogart]

I can't wait till July. Then it will be time for CitationAir to vote OUT the mess they call the Teamsters. I hope CA management keeps stalling with the negotiating joke. After that, there will still be hope for us.

 

[RCA]

Is that next July?

 

[pilotyip]

I can't wait till July. Then it will be time for CitationAir to vote OUT the mess they call the Teamsters. I hope CA management keeps stalling with the negotiating joke. After that, there will still be hope for us.

What a union did not produce a Worker's Paradise and unparallelled job security?

 

[Humphreybogart]

Is that next July?

Yes next July. Stay posted.

 

[Humphreybogart]

What a union did not produce a Worker's Paradise and unparallelled job security?[/QUOTE

Haha. My sentiments exactly.

 

[dime line]

What a union did not produce a Worker's Paradise and unparallelled job security?

ohhhhh, ok I forgot Management produced all of that, Ok

 

[pilotyip]

ohhhhh, ok I forgot Management produced all of that, Ok

No wrong again, consumers of the product vote with their dollars to see if a company will produce a Worker's Paradise and unparallelled job security. Not union, not managment, but a combination of their activity that delvers a prodcut that people like to buy.

 

[bailout]

Whoever is left at that place when the shakedown is complete will need the union more than ever, unless you want to see major changes without any input. Paycuts, schedule changes, base changes, yes they are all coming soon..

 

[imacdog]

What a union did not produce a Worker's Paradise and unparallelled job security?[/QUOTE

Haha. My sentiments exactly.

So things will get better when the union is voted out?

 

[doh]

Yip, your oversimplification is a form of d-baggery that can't be cured. I've never used the ignore button before.

 

[pilotyip]

Yip, your oversimplification is a form of d-baggery that can't be cured. I've never used the ignore button before.

Thank you very much, you are welcome to use at your pleasure. It has been fun trading points of view over the years, you will sincerely be missed, best of luck

 

[imacdog]

YIP maybe you can answer, do you think the pilots' situation at CA will get better if the union is voted out?

 

[imacdog]

Yip, your oversimplification is a form of d-baggery that can't be cured. I've never used the ignore button before.

Don't go too hard on the geezer, his little segment of aviation has zero to do with happy employers and high levels of customer service, and everything to do with who will do the job the cheapest.

 

[pilotyip]

YIP maybe you can answer, do you think the pilots' situation at CA will get better if the union is voted out?

That up to the pilots to determine, if they think it will be better then maybe it will be. It is not up to you or I to impose upon them what they feel is best for their group. Do I have to name all the companies that no longer pay their employees anything because they went out of business?

Don't go too hard on the geezer, his little segment of aviation has zero to do with happy employers and high levels of customer service, and everything to do with who will do the job the cheapest.

Ha Ha :laugh:you really know how to hurt a guy don't you, beat up someone on the bottom. A little name calling it is FI.

BTW for a bottom feeder we are definitely not the cheapest employer and we have been a great place to start your career and move on to places like UAL, AAL, UPS, FedEx, SWA, etc

 

[imacdog]

Sorry YIPster but car parts don't care how well they are treated by the employees of the company transporting them.

Cargo forum is this way

 

[CA1900]

... places like UAL, AAL, UPS, FedEx, SWA, etc

Wow, look at all those unionized companies who aren't out of business!

 

[pilotyip]

Wow, look at all those unionized companies who aren't out of business!

I could have listed EAL, PamAm, Braniff I, II, ACA, Midway and Zantop , not to mention BK places like UAL, DAL, AAL

 

[dashtrasher]

ACA didn't go out of business because of a union, they went out of business because of a union shop was in Chapter 11 with a sympathetic judge.

 

[Hogprint]

I could have listed EAL, PamAm, Braniff I, II, ACA, Midway and Zantop , not to mention BK places like UAL, DAL, AAL

Midway died because of 9/11...

Not a Union.

 

[pilotyip]

Midway died because of 9/11...

Not a Union.

Midway I was gone by 1991, 9-11 had nothing to do with Midway 1 Not to mention SWA eating their lunch at MWD, they bought the gates of EAL at PHL for $400M in an attempt to establish another hub. Lots of friends worked there, I interviewed in the summer of 1989, by 1990 the handwriting was on the wall.

 

[Jetz]

Source?

I can't wait till July. Then it will be time for CitationAir to vote OUT the mess they call the Teamsters. I hope CA management keeps stalling with the negotiating joke. After that, there will still be hope for us.

Huh? Tell us more.

 

[OHGOON]

Huh? Tell us more.

He can't because Bogey knows nothing. He will know even less, "next July."

It's highly entertaining to observe how the same logic, or lack of, which allows some to firmly believe the "Flintstones" are a documentary, is at work here.

Lock and load boys, all things will be back to normal "next July." All we have to do is vote em out. LOL, good luck with the card count. :nuts:

To illustrate a bit further:
Rumor has it that Steve O'Neill is waiting in the wings to bring back CitationAir's former glory just as soon as those pesky Union lovers are put back in their place. Sort of like Gene Hackman in Crimson Tide?

For his next trick, Mr Bogart will attempt to explain how Einstein's Theory of Relativity will conclusively be debunked by the Easter Bunny. Off course we will have to wait until "next July."

Thanks for the laughs but now I think I may have to... uke:

 

[Sparse]

I bet the Teamsters quit CA before CA can quit the Teamsters because it is all about the dues. I wonder how many are paying dues? I would be willing to bet that less than fifty percent of the pilots are paying dues. If the vote were held today it would not pass. Cessna has pulled the rug out from under the pilots. They have burst the bubble. I bet there is not a pilot at CA at least considering other jobs.

 

[OHGOON]

I bet the Teamsters quit CA before CA can quit the Teamsters because it is all about the dues. I wonder how many are paying dues? I would be willing to bet that less than fifty percent of the pilots are paying dues. If the vote were held today it would not pass. Cessna has pulled the rug out from under the pilots. They have burst the bubble. I bet there is not a pilot at CA at least considering other jobs.

From where I sit, no one is quitting, not even the naysayers.

As far as the rest of this, exactly what is your point? Unions, voting and most other things in general besides death and taxes are never inevitable. Not sure I really follow??

 

[rigger]

And to answer they pro union lovers on here. Yes CA was a better place before the Union, not perfect but better! Yes there were guys fired and yes there were guys that got in trouble, and yes you got extended sometimes, and yes you worked overtime sometimes, and yes there were times management seemed not to care.....wow sounds like a real honest American company.....huh what a concept to have in America, but they always did what they said they would do! They always paid when they said they would pay, vacation was always given when they said you could take it, they always listened when you said the plane was broken. Heck they even made it a seniority list company when there was no union! They furloughed both times in seniority order and brought back in seniority order all without a union.....then we get a union, and tada the company changes the business plan completely and creates a new company.....I know it's just a coincidence like say the economy still in the shambles it is in Obama and the CA union had nothing to do with either......

 

[pilotyip]

And to answer they pro union lovers on here. Yes CA was a better place before the Union, not perfect but better! Yes there were guys fired and yes there were guys that got in trouble, and yes you got extended sometimes, and yes you worked overtime sometimes, and yes there were times management seemed not to care.....wow sounds like a real honest American company.....huh what a concept to have in America, but they always did what they said they would do! They always paid when they said they would pay, vacation was always given when they said you could take it, they always listened when you said the plane was broken. Heck they even made it a seniority list company when there was no union! They furloughed both times in seniority order and brought back in seniority order all without a union.....then we get a union, and tada the company changes the business plan completely and creates a new company.....I know it's just a coincidence like say the economy still in the shambles it is in Obama and the CA union had nothing to do with either......

Stop that! this is FI, where unions always result in the perfect job with no drawbacks and without a union there are no benefits for working for that company.

 

[imacdog]

Stop that! this is FI, where unions always result in the perfect job with no drawbacks and without a union there are no benefits for working for that company.

So YIP why don't you explain why the union vote at CA is responsible for the company's woes now.

 

[pilotyip]

So YIP why don't you explain why the union vote at CA is responsible for the company's woes now.

Don't have to, I think rigger did a fine job of exposing the reality of the real world.

 

[Pervis]

It's tough to blame the union when there has yet to be a CBA put in place to blame, don't you think?

 

[rigger]

It's tough to blame the union when there has yet to be a CBA put in place to blame, don't you think?

No not at all. It actually follows common sense. The year leading up to the union vote was very troubling for the company and for it'employees. Every day the company was spending time,money,and energy that could better have been put in something else like say....o I don't know growing the company out of rescession induced downturn.....despite the rumblings in the background they actually did it, and was the first ( and only company) to bring all furloughed guys back on property! This was the time the union thought would be great to make the final push and get the union installed! The president started to concentrate 90% of managements time on Union coming issues and assured the Cessna board and the Textron board his business plan and his Union plan would work. Union plan failed, Cessna pulled out plan 2 change company business plan and company president, replace all re-create business as something else. Since then the company has downsized the pilot group to the point the union has no teeth at all..... I'm with whoever said the teamsters will leave CA first.

When the furloughs were first announce the first email from the Teamsters were all containing the language of you must pay your dues, don't stop even if your being furloughed, we need the money and the teamsters will help get your job back( excuse me, the company had already done this without them during the first time around)