Good bye SL9 Greed- no sir.

[chjack]

This isn't going to work. SWA pilots use terms like "won the lottery", "lucky", "stapled" and guys go ballistic. You SWA guys are so arrogant. Why do we use these terms? Because that is how 99% of us felt when we were hired. Former Astronauts, Former Air Tran Captains, Former Acquired airline pilots. What an awesome party it was when I was "stapled" to the bottom. I did feel fortunate to have made it through the interview and lucky to get selected. It took me a long time to get to SWA and I will probably be in my 50s before I upgrade. Price to be paid for getting to SWA.

We now have a group of pilots that were offered more than anyone at this airline has ever been offered before and were not happy with it. There is no daylight between the cultures and I believe that is sinking in on both sides. SWA needs to do this internally, with motivated folks honored to start at the bottom. Anything else is poison to the culture.

Air Tran guys are always welcome on my jumpseat and I will continue to be friendly and helpful whenever possible. I will politely ask to not participate in any SLI discussions because the cultural differences are simply too great. I do hope we eventually offer preferential interviews for those that "get it."

This post proves the southwest guys dont get it. yeah, you were 'honored" to be stapled, but that doesnt mean others find it an honor to be stapled at southwest. SWA guys feel like anybody that doesnt want to work there is stupid for passing up such an "honor." different strokes for different folks.

Alot of the guys at SWA dont want to work at American or Delta. does that make them idiots? of course not, its just not where they choose to hang their hats. there were guys at airtran who had decided it was their final airline. So to say that because they now dont want to be stapled at the "worlds greatest airline", makes them out of touch is dead wrong.

And the whole "prefferential interviews", for "guys who get it" is even more ridiculous. why should a guy have to interview for a job he already has?

All you guys talk about is culture, but if someone doesnt agree or want to be a part of it at any cost, they are abad guy, and you speak of "Gary's revenge. So what is it? A great culture, or a bunch of vindictive dudes who try to screw anybody who doesnt think SWA is the "bees knees"

 

[ephull]

I wasn't refering to where they might go after Airtran, haven't flown with any that mentioned going anywhere else. We work for SWA now why would they LOL.

But seriously, if your at the bottom of any list and have the op to move up to a better company, better paying career or simply a flying career that fits your life's ambitions better why not. I'd say most FO's that came to AT recently planned on staying.

 

[CaptWidgeon]

eric, thanks for what things look like from your side of the fence.

neither of our groups asked for this, but there are a lot of things that happen that we don't want to occur. sometimes it's for the better sometimes not. hopefully we, both groups, can work things out that is beneficial for all.

thanks again. :beer:

 

[ngsp]

You want to be considered an equal?

DOH, no fence.

Welcome to SWA.

i am a junior capt and will get hammered for saying this by my fellow pilots, but yes, i think this is where it should have been to start with. DOH, no fences, no capt protections and let the chips fall where they may. i don't want to be a second class citizen for the rest of my career.

disclaimer- this is just one humble pilots opinion, so if you don't agree, move on. we didn't get a vote in the current situation.

 

[waveflyer]

Eric- props for using your name. Some know who I am, but I'm not putting it out there. Makes for a more respectful conversation.

CHJACK- that might be the case- but if you get acquired by SWA and don't feel honored to work here- That's a good argument for GK to withhold a seat at all, not vault one to their current relative seniority. The situation here is too good and too expensive for mgmt to appease someone who lacks the humility to come in nicely to the one place left that has been committed to treating it's people so well.
Luke 14:10

 

[Cruncher]

Anytime you interview at an airline and are fortunate to be hired, you have effectively stapled yourself to the bottom of the list, with all the rights and privileges a New Hire is afforded. The honorably Bond & McCaskill have essentially forced the government into the private sector once again.

Though an old Chinese proverb goes: Be careful what you wish for, as you just may get it. (or something to that effect). IOW, where B/M tries to protect jobs, it could in effect, eliminate them.

Seniority is not forever, just ask the guys from every airline that has gone Chp. 7 liquidation.

This process is probably far from over, but one thing I am sure of, the SWA employees are more unified than ever.

Be careful of biting the hand that feeds. Knowing how Gary negotiates, all the $$$s from SL9 are gone and will be hard fought to get back, if possible.

I'm not here to debate. I'm most likely not gonna change your mind, additionally, I don't feel like reading drizzle from the sole DAL guy on here (posing as 2 or 3 guys). But I will say, be careful of ALPA's guidance, this would not be the first time ALPA was effective in losing all their members jobs.

 

[CaptAntoineMack]

I get so tired of hearing how greedy the SWA pilots are. Like it is a foregone conclusion that the Airtran pilots have an automatic right to our contract because we bought them.

Let me ask the Airtran pilots this. Would you be ok with DOH with having to live with your pre September 27th contract for the rest of your SWA career? (Please don't debate why this contract and not the one that magically appeared weeks after the buyout announcement) You would get the exact same raises that RSW pilots would get. Lets call it Tranny scale. Would you think that fair?

I would. And be happy to accept this proposal. And no joke, this is a possibility.

Could you live with that?

 

[yoyoma]

Eric,

I appreciate your candor in the post, but it's a pretty big jump to talk about how AAI was a top career airline. I have no doubt that you guys worked your butts off under some represive management. You didn't deserve that. But with top payscales of 153/hr and 79/hr for CA and FO's respectively is along way from were the SW pay and QOL were on Sept. 26th.

This is not like merging apples and oranges, it's worse unfortunately.

I can understand the loss of QOL if you are living in ATL and now find yourself junior and can't hold it. The harsh reality is that Airtran was bought, and with that comes the angst of the company being purchased. Look around at most corporate buy-outs in other industries. Most of the time the acquiring company just closes up shop and tell the employees that they can apply at the new company when openings are available. I'm not saying that is how this should play out, just pointing out how bad these things look outside of the aviation community. So yes, the 2M per pilot deal was extremely generous in this envirnoment, but you needed to look at it long term. There is no other stable company in this industry than Southwest. Balance sheet is steller.

RF

Post of the year! why dont aai pilots understand that someone has to lose here, and they were the ones who were bought, and they are the ones working at a company nobody wishes to work for!

 

[Sacha]

I wasn't refering to where they might go after Airtran, haven't flown with any that mentioned going anywhere else. We work for SWA now why would they LOL.

But seriously, if your at the bottom of any list and have the op to move up to a better company, better paying career or simply a flying career that fits your life's ambitions better why not. I'd say most FO's that came to AT recently planned on staying.

Bull. If the majority of the Airtran guys let alone the new hires were to get a classdate at Delta, they would be gone in a New York Minute.

 

[CF34-3B1]

It's very simple. Eric wants to increase his pay from something around $140K to $250K and keep his seniority. All on the backs of SWA pilots who get nothing in return and are actually harmed in career earnings with his list. That's Fair, right? Did I mention that SWA is the acquiring carrier?

DING DING DING We have a winner.