USAPA sues some America West Pilots

[FR8mastr]

"THE East does not want the WEST jobs! You can not say the same in reverse. I don't know how to make that any more clear."

WRONG. There are some west that live in the East that would love to cut the commute. There's about the same number of West coast Easties that would love to do the same.

I've met one from SAN. He would be in the top 10 in PHX. Imagine....NEVER working a Holiday, Birthday, Anniversary again. NEVER having to pay for a crashpad or hotel room again. 31 Days of vacation pay, FULL pay for mechanicals, FULL pay for deadheads, IV (150%) Pay for fixing crew staffing probems, 125% pay for voluteering to help out, better 401K contributions, and West pay or better.......Well, that was when LCC was making money last fall. Nearly all of the new contract was done save for financials.

We are looking at YEARS of segregation. Too bad.

Fine lets say you are 100% correct and a huge number of East pilots want to come West. FENCE THEM OUT! usapa already stated the West could "name their fences"
Bottom line is, all i hear is rhetoric about how the East is stealing jobs, but the West is not willing to do the one thing that would stop it. Funny the East is willing. So who really wants who's jobs?

 

[Green]

Glad you finally see the reason alpo was kicked off the property at USAir. Maybe there is some hope for you after all.

See ya!

are you saying that Alpa's mission was to screw Us Airways pilots?? That's a little dramatic is it not? Were Us Airways pilots not some of the highest compensated pilots in the industry for years? Did Alpa have any part in that? Will USAPA ever bring you top wages? You guys lost touch with reality... Emotion is more powerful than logic but eventually you have to face the facts, or just grow old and bitter...

 

[Green]

Fine lets say you are 100% correct and a huge number of East pilots want to come West. FENCE THEM OUT! usapa already stated the West could "name their fences"
Bottom line is, all i hear is rhetoric about how the East is stealing jobs, but the West is not willing to do the one thing that would stop it. Funny the East is willing. So who really wants who's jobs?

The east IS trying to steal jobs. You are trying to expose 1600 or so AWA pilots to furloughs at the expense of west pilots such as yourself who were furloughed at the time of the merger. There is no getting around that fact Fr8mastr.... But you will continue to see things your way so this argument is futile....

 

[PCL_128]

or just grow old and bitter...

Too late, they're already there!

 

[Bringupthebird]

I would love to be at the "trial". When the judge says, "Let's see if I understand you correctly Mr. Bradford. When a group of pilots stands united against a perceived threat, you call that racketeering. When you start an organization that purposely divides a pilot group, you call it a "union"?"

I think that the judge will see that the behavior of the named pilots, while foolish, is merely the price USAPA is paying for disenfranchising 1/2 the pilot group. Bullying is a major problem in schools and now in pilot groups. My guess is that the judge will throw out the case and recommend that USAPA try a different approach to carry out it's representational responsibilities.

I think Parker has as much culpability in the integration fiasco as anyone. He is allowing the acrimony to escalate to dangerous levels. He must bring the leaders of USAPA and AWAPPA together and force them to come up with a solution that ratchets down the rhetoric. It is his moral obligation to difuse potential problems before their effects spill over to innocents.

 

[Carl S.]

Why do I need a pillow to cry on when action is now the response to the WAR the EAST has created? Crying has served the EAST well in the short term(ALPA/Call Sign), but litigation will serve the West in the long run. As far as I know, Parker has a list and has accepted it, so the ball is in the EAST hands now!

 

[PlaneDrvr]

I would love to be at the "trial". When the judge says, "Let's see if I understand you correctly Mr. Bradford. When a group of pilots stands united against a perceived threat, you call that racketeering. When you start an organization that purposely divides a pilot group, you call it a "union"?"

I think that the judge will see that the behavior of the named pilots, while foolish, is merely the price USAPA is paying for disenfranchising 1/2 the pilot group. Bullying is a major problem in schools and now in pilot groups. My guess is that the judge will throw out the case and recommend that USAPA try a different approach to carry out it's representational responsibilities.

I think Parker has as much culpability in the integration fiasco as anyone. He is allowing the acrimony to escalate to dangerous levels. He must bring the leaders of USAPA and AWAPPA together and force them to come up with a solution that ratchets down the rhetoric. It is his moral obligation to difuse potential problems before their effects spill over to innocents.

O.K, now I a little confused, looking at this from the outside, but 'what action' (a specific action), has USAPA taken/done so far that has 'disenfranchised' 1/2 the pilot group. Name a specific action that they have actually taken, or is it a 'perception that their future' actions and policies will disenfranchise someone???

And, also, I was not aware that the AWAPPA (whoever they are), was a legally elected (under U.S. law) as a negotiating/bargaining agent?? Do they have two unions at US Air?? Strange, as if you are not legally recognized, by law, you have NO authority to negotiate with the company, and further, if the company negotiates or deals with any such organization, they are in violation of the law. Can the AWA pilots have alpa deal with the company for them, because they prefer them???

Am I wrong somewhere in this??

PD

 

[Ocity]

Fine lets say you are 100% correct and a huge number of East pilots want to come West. FENCE THEM OUT! usapa already stated the West could "name their fences"
Bottom line is, all i hear is rhetoric about how the East is stealing jobs, but the West is not willing to do the one thing that would stop it. Funny the East is willing. So who really wants who's jobs?

"name your fence?" Sure. with the Caveat that 85% of AMW get stapled.

Furlough fodder that virtually guarantees that no Eastinfection ever get furloughed...even guys that were on furlough when the snapshot was taken will have thousands of guys under them.

Never Ever happen. The sooner the lawsuits fly the better.

 

[Bdfg1]

The east IS trying to steal jobs. You are trying to expose 1600 or so AWA pilots to furloughs at the expense of west pilots such as yourself who were furloughed at the time of the merger. There is no getting around that fact Fr8mastr.... But you will continue to see things your way so this argument is futile....

Attempting to place 2 year AWA pilots above some USAir pilots with 20 years of senority flying mainline aircraft at the time of the merger is an attempt by the east to steal jobs?

Perhaps if you had actual knowledge of the events you would be better prepared to less look a fool.

See ya!

 

[Bdfg1]

even guys that were on furlough when the snapshot was taken will have thousands of guys under them.

What about those 20 year senority pilots that were not on furlough when the snapshot was taken that would have 2 year AWA pilots above them in senority?

See ya!

 

[FR8mastr]

"name your fence?" Sure. with the Caveat that 85% of AMW get stapled.

Furlough fodder that virtually guarantees that no Eastinfection ever get furloughed...even guys that were on furlough when the snapshot was taken will have thousands of guys under them.

Never Ever happen. The sooner the lawsuits fly the better.

I am of the opinion that if the fences are up, the furloughs should come from the side that had the cuts. So if cuts are made East than the furloughs should be East pilots, and it should remain that way until the fences are down.
So what is your next excuse about how the East wants your job?

 

[PCL_128]

What about those 20 year senority pilots that were not on furlough when the snapshot was taken that would have 2 year AWA pilots above them in senority?

See ya!

Amazing that you still don't understand the difference between seniority and longevity.

 

[FR8mastr]

The east IS trying to steal jobs. You are trying to expose 1600 or so AWA pilots to furloughs at the expense of west pilots such as yourself who were furloughed at the time of the merger. There is no getting around that fact Fr8mastr.... But you will continue to see things your way so this argument is futile....

I answered this in another post, please take the time to read it. I will be waiting for your next reason on how the East is stealing your job.
I was not furloughed at the time of the merger, I was furloughed in May, 06.

 

[get2flyin]

Fine lets say you are 100% correct and a huge number of East pilots want to come West. FENCE THEM OUT! usapa already stated the West could "name their fences"
Bottom line is, all i hear is rhetoric about how the East is stealing jobs, but the West is not willing to do the one thing that would stop it. Funny the East is willing. So who really wants who's jobs?

Have you ever been to Vegas? Do you gamble? Have you ever bet money, lost, and then said you didn't think it was fair and you want your money back to try to bet again?

Nic told the East negotiators, "You won't get straight DOH, come back with something else." Fences were mentioned, but the East said, "Nope, no fences...we are only authorized to get DOH".

NOW YOU WANT FENCES? The "East is willing" you say? To little, to late, Pop. You got greedy at the arbitration and didn't get what you wanted. Now you accuse the West of being greedy and yet it was a NEUTRAL THIRD PARTY that came up with the award. But, Nic wasn't fair. He was bias. He didn't have all the facts.

I attached a link to Nic's qualifications for you read and enjoy. Open your eyes. It's a big world out there and it doesn't revolve around your whims.

http://www.nmb.gov/arbitrator-resumes/nicolau-george-gn_res.pdf

 

[Bdfg1]

Amazing that you still don't understand the difference between seniority and longevity.

Who taught you the difference? You have three options to choose from:

1) alpo
2) scabs at your airline
3) pft school

Please mail your ansewr to:

ALPO
P.O. Box WE NEED DUES BADLY!
Herndon, VA

See ya!

 

[get2flyin]

Who taught you the difference? You have three options to choose from:

1) alpo
2) scabs at your airline
3) pft school

Please mail your ansewr to:

ALPO
P.O. Box WE NEED DUES BADLY!
Herndon, VA

See ya!

And the moron quote of the day goes to....(Wait for it)...Bdfg!!

 

[Bdfg1]

And the moron quote of the day goes to....(Wait for it)...Bdfg!!

OHHHH ya got me!

See ya!

 

[FR8mastr]

http://www.nmb.gov/arbitrator-resumes/nicolau-george-gn_res.pdf

lets see, I proposed solutions that the East and West(according to your claims) could live with, and you retort with that.
A. You are being less than honest about the West desire for East positions.
B. you just want to cash that lottery ticket, to heck with everything and everybody else.
Nic is just as unfair to the East as doh without fences is to the West.
Fences would preserve both East and West "career expectations" as I outlined. Clearly you are not interested in anything fair that could move this along.
So again who is trying to steal who's job?

 

[Bdfg1]

lets see, I proposed solutions that the East and West(according to your claims) could live with, and you retort with that.
A. You are being less than honest about the West desire for East positions.
B. you just want to cash that lottery ticket, to heck with everything and everybody else.
Nic is just as unfair to the East as doh without fences is to the West.
Fences would preserve both East and West "career expectations" as I outlined. Clearly you are not interested in anything fair that could move this along.
So again who is trying to steal who's job?

Pretty spot on. pft-128 should pay attention for a change.

See ya!

 

[PCL_128]

And the moron quote of the day goes to....(Wait for it)...Bdfg!!

You might as well crown him for life. Surely no one else will be able to match his ignorance and stupidity.

 

[Bdfg1]

You might as well crown him for life. Surely no one else will be able to match his ignorance and stupidity.

Not possilbe to unseat you since you have a life long term to serve.

If I recall I offered you all the proof to my side of the argument in a pm to you. Offered my full name, old alpa #, old employee #, etc. All the information that you needed in order to make a correct statement with facts to back it up. You responded with, "I couldn't possibly care less." I'm sure you will win alot of arguements considering it's your character to not take any facts into account. Aplo has taught you well.

See ya!

 

[PCL_128]

Not possilbe to unseat you since you have a life long term to serve.

If I recall I offered you all the proof to my side of the argument in a pm to you. Offered my full name, old alpa #, old employee #, etc. All the information that you needed in order to make a correct statement with facts to back it up. You responded with, "I couldn't possibly care less." I'm sure you will win alot of arguements considering it's your character to not take any facts into account. Aplo has taught you well.

See ya!

Why not just post your name here for everyone to see, if you're so eager to prove your supposed "facts?"

 

[Bdfg1]

Why not just post your name here for everyone to see, if you're so eager to prove your supposed "facts?"

Simple. This is between you and I. Even your high school education should be able to understand that. Perhaps a high school education doesn't go as far as it used to.

Why not just take the information I offered since you are so eager to prove your supposed "facts"? Wait I forgot you are not interested in facts you "couldn't possibly care less" about facts cause it does not support your arguement. You'd rather have your opinion regarded as fact as opposed to court documents and testimony. Let me guess you are a democrat?

See ya!

 

[PCL_128]

If you insist, then PM me the information. I don't know what the point is, though.

 

[Bdfg1]

I don't know what the point is, though.

Well for starters it will prove that I am not a scab and therefore you are a liar. Sound good to start with?

See ya!

 

[PCL_128]

Well for starters it will prove that I am not a scab and therefore you are a liar. Sound good to start with?

See ya!

I dispute your premise. Anyone who supports USCABA is a SCAB.

 

[Bdfg1]

I dispute your premise. Anyone who supports USCABA is a SCAB.

I suggest a quick glance into a dictionary. I know for a fact that had those in high school. Perhaps you can have access to the high school library with your old high school id? Or would you prefer to keep making up your own definitions to better suit your needs?

See ya!

 

[PCL_128]

From Webster's definition:

3 a: a contemptible person

I think that clears that up.

 

[Bdfg1]

From Webster's definition:

3 a: a contemptible person

I think that clears that up.

Spin class is now in session. Sorry pft 128 you automatically fail this class.

See ya!

 

[get2flyin]

lets see, I proposed solutions that the East and West(according to your claims) could live with, and you retort with that.

No, you proposed a solution that you could live with. During growth, you wanted DOH to take all of the upgrades. During an economic downturn, you you still want DOH knowing that the West become furough protection. You generously offer fences to protect the upgrades that this economy have stopped. Meanwhile, the West pilots get furloughed but the East is there to step in and take up the slack. Is that pretty much how your vision is "fair and unbiased" looks. Gee, that sounds great. On second thought, maybe we'll pass.

A. You are being less than honest about the West desire for East positions.

Oh really? And exactly how did you deduce that? Well you're wrong. You have a lot more guys living out West than we have living East. And AWA has always prided itself on quality of life. And I know those East FOs are just itching to upgrade at any cost. Why else would they be wearing their old captains jackets in 110 degree heat.

B. you just want to cash that lottery ticket, to heck with everything and everybody else.
Nic is just as unfair to the East as doh without fences is to the West.

You want to cash the lottery ticket that USAPA is offering you. Uh...wait..that's different, right? And Nic is unfair because you say it is? Well I guess if you put it that way, nobody can shoot holes in that compelling argument. Wow. You and your logic.

Fences would preserve both East and West "career expectations" as I outlined. Clearly you are not interested in anything fair that could move this along.

Fences wouldn't preserve expectations, as I wrote above. Next question.

So again who is trying to steal who's job?

That, sir, is easy. The East trying to steal West jobs.