ASTAR'S Race to the Bottom

[aviatrix767]

ASTAR'S Race to the Bottom! Attention all pilots/union members:

In an effort to influence DHL’s decision on the home for the 6 future 767-300 aircraft purchased from Boeing, the ASTAR MEC has executed the "race to the bottom" plan. In order to prevent these aircraft from landing at Atlas, Polar, ABX, or even EAT, the ASTAR MEC leadership is currently negotiating concessions in pay and work rules. This means they are willing to fly a heavy for less pay than the narrow body pay. This plan violates several ALPA national codes of ethic and at least one resolution.

The industry would like to thank you.

 

[Clipperskip]

???

ASTAR'S Race to the Bottom! Attention all pilots/union members:

In an effort to influence DHL’s decision on the home for the 6 future 767-300 aircraft purchased from Boeing, the ASTAR MEC has executed the "race to the bottom" plan. In order to prevent these aircraft from landing at Atlas, Polar, ABX, or even EAT, the ASTAR MEC leadership is currently negotiating concessions in pay and work rules. This means they are willing to fly a heavy for less pay than the narrow body pay. This plan violates several ALPA national codes of ethic and at least one resolution.

The industry would like to thank you.

Trix, care to provide supporting facts and or proof. These are strong allegations to be throwing around at this time.

 

[AV8OR]

ASTAR'S Race to the Bottom! Attention all pilots/union members:

In an effort to influence DHL’s decision on the home for the 6 future 767-300 aircraft purchased from Boeing, the ASTAR MEC has executed the "race to the bottom" plan. In order to prevent these aircraft from landing at Atlas, Polar, ABX, or even EAT, the ASTAR MEC leadership is currently negotiating concessions in pay and work rules. This means they are willing to fly a heavy for less pay than the narrow body pay. This plan violates several ALPA national codes of ethic and at least one resolution.

The industry would like to thank you.

Hey Aviatrix,

I know you have honor as a southern belle of Ole Miss bearing. I don't know what you have heard, actually, I'm pretty sure what you've "heard" based on your post, but before you go posting slanderous rumor about our pilot group and it's leadership, you might want to wait and see and know the facts.

So pilot brethren, now that this highly inflamatory statement is out there, here is what is true,

The Astar MEC was approached by management to take pay concessions to fly DHL's new 767ERS. We told them to pound sand, but have had further discussions with management to ascertain the validity of their claims. It's our understanding two other companies, EAT and Polar have been contacted as well, and we have sought to verify that as well. End of story for now.

Would we like to get them? You bet your your you know what. Are we suspicious of John Dasburg? You bet your you know what. Are we gonna do due dilligence? Yes maa'aam.

Back to negotiating YOUR contract. Good luck.

 

[hvydriver]

Hey Aviatrix,

I know you have honor as a southern belle of Ole Miss bearing. I don't know what you have heard, actually, I'm pretty sure what you've "heard" based on your post, but before you go posting slanderous rumor about our pilot group and it's leadership, you might want to wait and see and know the facts.

So pilot brethren, now that this highly inflamatory statement is out there, here is what is true,

The Astar MEC was approached by management to take pay concessions to fly DHL's new 767ERS. We told them to pound sand, but have had further discussions with management to ascertain the validity of their claims. It's our understanding two other companies, EAT and Polar have been contacted as well, and we have sought to verify that as well. End of story for now.

Would we like to get them? You bet your your you know what. Are we suspicious of John Dasburg? You bet your you know what. Are we gonna do due dilligence? Yes maa'aam.

Back to negotiating YOUR contract. Good luck.

Ditto. Nice job there, Avatrix. Instead of your Eboard swallowing whatever pablum Bourne gives you, you might try dropping a dime to us.

 

[DC-9er]

So you told them to pound sand, but you’re having further discussions.
Got it.

 

[AV8OR]

Hey 9ner. You ain't "got" jack. As much as you guys are always wanting intel on our CBA negotiations and other AStar goings on over here, you might be better served to spend a little time over there "manning up" yourselves. Buy a billboard. Have an informational picket. Whatever. I tried to 'splain it to you without getting into detail, and I'm not gonna cause it's really none of your concern unless DHL's approached ABX about flying them as well, which would be news to me. Some, not all, but some of you guys are such friggin hypocrites. Take great offense to ALPA scope, but have NO problem stating that if need be, scope will be used to protect ABX flying from going to Capi or ATI. Isn't there "enough freight to go around"? Or how bout yall having no problem having "discussions" with your company over work rules that produced the end of AStar transcons, and now you've got grief because AStar is in discussions with our management over these aircraft? It's always the same thing from some of yall. AStar was and is a little two bit, piss ant, non-CATII cargo airline that never was, and never will amount to anything who should have come begging to 1224 to let us please play in the ILN sandbox as long as we didn't try and enforce our CBA. Who the h-e-double hockeysticks did we think we were anyway? But when the shoe's on the other foot, there's always ample reason why it's justified. Some of yall have gone as far as to ridicule our latest CBA as a "race to the bottom" cause we didn't get whatever an ABX pilot thought was an adequate signing bonus. Whatever dude. The greatest show of force you've put up to move things forward has been what, The Bunker, which got torn down in a week and taxiing at the speed of smell, which might not be so noticable if you weren't at V1 taxiing down Charlie before.

Yeah, 9ner, you "got it".

Go ahead flame us some more on here. We're fairly used to it. We'll let ya know if things change over here. Why don't let me know when you've got your contract. Self-righteous jerk.

 

[DC8CRIVER]

AVIATRIX'S Race to the Bottom! Attention all pilots/union members:

In an effort to influence everyone who reads any of the popular message boards, AVIATRIX has executed the "race to the bottom" plan. In order to slam fellow pilots, this poster child for the uninformed is posting untrue statements about her "DHL codeshare" brothers and sisters across the field at ASTAR. This means that AVIATRIX is willing to post lies about fellow pilots either because of shortcomings at her own company OR because she is truly alarmed and does not have the intelligence or the integrity to verify her facts prior to slandering other airline pilots. This plan violates any rational person's code of ethics and at least one law regarding slander.

The industry would like to thank you.

You need not worry your pretty little head over us and what we may or may not be doing. Our integrity, principles, and pay scales are intact and our pilot group solidly supports our union officials and our contract. But, thanks for asking.

By the way, speaking about concessions ... how's that Osaka flying working out for your group?

 

[HeavyjetDC8]

. ....... which might not be so noticable if you weren't at V1 taxiing down Charlie before........

As all illustrious ABXers would appear to be in the process of receiving a broad-brush tarring I would like to unequivocally state that I have never taxied at V1 on Charlie. Honestly. :laugh:

As for the labor issues: there's always a double standard; what you see depends upon where you stand and we are, when all is said and done, presently standing at different ends of the cornfield.

Roll on retirement, it can't come soon enough - assuming of course that there's a pension to accompany it.

 

[DC-9er]

Hey 9ner. You ain't "got" jack. As much as you guys are always wanting intel on our CBA negotiations and other AStar goings on over here, you might be better served to spend a little time over there "manning up" yourselves. Buy a billboard. Have an informational picket. Whatever. I tried to 'splain it to you without getting into detail, and I'm not gonna cause it's really none of your concern unless DHL's approached ABX about flying them as well, which would be news to me. Some, not all, but some of you guys are such friggin hypocrites. Take great offense to ALPA scope, but have NO problem stating that if need be, scope will be used to protect ABX flying from going to Capi or ATI. Isn't there "enough freight to go around"? Or how bout yall having no problem having "discussions" with your company over work rules that produced the end of AStar transcons, and now you've got grief because AStar is in discussions with our management over these aircraft? It's always the same thing from some of yall. AStar was and is a little two bit, piss ant, non-CATII cargo airline that never was, and never will amount to anything who should have come begging to 1224 to let us please play in the ILN sandbox as long as we didn't try and enforce our CBA. Who the h-e-double hockeysticks did we think we were anyway? But when the shoe's on the other foot, there's always ample reason why it's justified. Some of yall have gone as far as to ridicule our latest CBA as a "race to the bottom" cause we didn't get whatever an ABX pilot thought was an adequate signing bonus. Whatever dude. The greatest show of force you've put up to move things forward has been what, The Bunker, which got torn down in a week and taxiing at the speed of smell, which might not be so noticable if you weren't at V1 taxiing down Charlie before.

Yeah, 9ner, you "got it".

Go ahead flame us some more on here. We're fairly used to it. We'll let ya know if things change over here. Why don't let me know when you've got your contract. Self-righteous jerk.

OK! Thanks for clarifying!

 

[Clipperskip]

???

[By the way, speaking about concessions ... how's that Osaka flying working out for your group?[/quote]


I'm quite sure that we (the members of 1224) have given no concessions for the operations taking place in Osaka, if that is what you are implying. It seems it would be better for all those on both sides of the cornfield to be mindful of their words. This goes for my commrades on the south side too. It may not be all that far in the future that we are are sitting next to each other in a cockpit as operating crew members.

 

[fob727]

Amen, Clipper!

 

[scarface]

The question is which,if any,cockpit and which side.

 

[EuroWheenie]

The invitation to bid on the 767ER flying was given to EAT, ASTAR and Polar. Simply put, the guys with the sharpest pencils (read lowest cost) will get the contract.

ABX were not invited to bid, read into that what you will.

 

[hvydriver]

The invitation to bid on the 767ER flying was given to EAT, ASTAR and Polar. Simply put, the guys with the sharpest pencils (read lowest cost) will get the contract.

ABX were not invited to bid, read into that what you will.

Quite right Euro. And since Atlas/Polar are so far below both ABX, Astar, and EAT's costs, would anyone care to venture who is going to get them? It's been rather obvious from the start, I think. Nothing personal/flaming, but I'm not taking a $100 buck an hour pay cut for that "new jet smell"

 

[fodc8]

Euro as I understand it. There was a Last minute bid by Luftansa as well and they were granted 3 of the 767's due to their proximity to the motherland. The other 3 will go to Astar or Polar or maybe both as crazy as that sounds. However there seems to be warring factions within DHL on both sides of the Atlantic to gain control over these aircraft. We will know very soon. By the way I believe the Astar MEC rejected any change in pay to fly those airplanes so check your facts before you open your pie hole.

 

[aviatrix767]

FWIW - let me state that I would not post something that I knew was not true, or did not have some merit of truth. Maybe some of you need to pull your heads out of your backsides and start asking more questions.

One more thing - I have noticed time and again that when someone is guilty of something they have a tendency to jump into "defensive" mode.

 

[Airbus300]

Hey, don't pick on EuroWheenie. I believe he is ok with Astar.....if I remember correctly.

 

[rotor&wing]

FWIW - let me state that I would not post something that I knew was not true, or did not have some merit of truth. Maybe some of you need to pull your heads out of your backsides and start asking more questions.

One more thing - I have noticed time and again that when someone is guilty of something they have a tendency to jump into "defensive" mode.

No defensive mode here. What you posted is simply not true.

 

[hvydriver]

FWIW - let me state that I would not post something that I knew was not true, or did not have some merit of truth. Maybe some of you need to pull your heads out of your backsides and start asking more questions.

One more thing - I have noticed time and again that when someone is guilty of something they have a tendency to jump into "defensive" mode.

FWIW, you aren't doing any of your fellow 1224's a service here.

 

[EuroWheenie]

fod

I never said anything about the alleged cutting of salaries by the ASTAR MEC, that was aviatrix.

Lufthansa operating the 76s? Not a chance in hell mate, and neither will AeroLogic be getting them. There are 3 options, the ones I mentioned. My source is the Global Director of Aviation, seconded my the DFO of EAT. Pretty reliable sources I would say ... sadly when the discussion turns to who of the 3 candidates will be getting them, they suddenly become very silent. Decision should be made sometime in May.

We're a couple of guys standing by if EAT gets them, but we've already told Boeing to stuff the ballmats and install castors (like we have on the 75s) regardless of who the operator will be. Boeing, being their usual arrogant selfs are claiming it can't be done. Bollox!