AirTran T.A. = Vote NO

[Lear70]

Well I have just finish reading the TA2 to its entirely, you really do need a lawyer to decode all the jargon crap in here. I am officially jumping the bandwagon to a HELL NO vote.
Hopefully we take a lesson from the flight attendants and don't screw ourselves.

Good for you!

Glad you took the time to really read it, spread the word!

 

[MGT3]

I have not decide which way to go but, I just don't want to be in the same situation as our flight attendants with there contract where they were offer something reject it only years later to ratify something that was a whole lot worse.

It is obvious from posts like this one that not very many people in this debate were employed at AirTran when the FA contract negotiations were going on, and too many people are buying the AP version of events.

The previous contract the FAs had was horrible. There was very few pay protections or positive work rules for line holders, let alone reserves. The union bought into the whole limited pie argument and chose to sell the reserves down the river for better workrules and pay for line holders. This of course was no big deal because the average FA stayed on Reserve about 3 months at the very most. Well guess what, two years later, suprise, surprise, reserve for FAs is anywhere from 10 to 14 months. It did not take long for the company to figure out that if they built less hard lines and pumped up the reserve lines as flying expanded that they did not have to pay for wx cancelations, deadheading, etc etc. If you think this management is not going to explore every dark corner and grey area of what ever contract we sign, you have not been paying attention for the last two years.

Next time you are on a trip with an FA with a 7XXXX or earlier senority, ask them about their old contract compared to their current one. Maybe they should have signed their first TA, but the contract they lived under was horrendous. There is no reason that WE need to sign a TA that is a step back in every single area except sub inflation pay raises.

I can taxi slow, but I can not guarentee that I can make up 5 minutes of door time on every single leg.

All that being said, I am happy to see Flying Colors has come over to the NO camp.

Vote No! Vote Often!!

GT

 

[BagelBomber]

This is for the folks who are on the fence with their vote or just plain voting Yes.

You have to ask yourself a few questions:
1. What is worse; TA2 being voted in by 51% or TA2 being voted down by 51%?

I believe it is the latter.

2. From talking to other pilots on the line or in the crewroom, does it sound like this TA2 will pass and be ratified?

It sounds to me like TA2 will be voted down. It may not be by a large margin, but that seems to be the overall sentiment from the members I have talked to. Ask around.

3. Assuming TA2 will be voted down, will your vote be more beneficial to YOU PERSONALLY by voting Yes or NO?

If you vote Yes, will your vote be heard? Absolutely. Will your vote benefit you personally? Absolutely NOT. Quite the opposite.
If you vote NO, will your vote benefit you personally? Absolutely. If this TA gets voted down by a small margin, we will have no negotiating leverage when we go back to the table because the company will just want to fix a couple things to get back that extra couple percent. At that point, we should just beg the company to give us back TA2 because it won't be worth the 6-12 months it will take to get nothing more meaningful. Having TA2 voted down by a large margin sends a clear message to Management that this thing ain't even close. You need to get real.

Make your vote really count.

Vote NO.

 

[Ty Webb]

I like that slogan . . .

"Make your vote count . . . . . . vote NO!"


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[Lear70]

Bagel has an excellent point, and has been my main concern for the last few weeks as I've watched people's resolution waiver from a strong NO vote.

I do believe the worst thing we could do is ratify it. If it passed, my apps would go out ASAP, as I watched the next 8-12 months unfold so I could bail if my fears come to pass.

Next worst: we reject it by a 55/45 margin (which is my prediction right now). This leaves us in a TERRIBLE bargaining position and sets up the next leadership group for failure. All management has to do is sit by and wait and the new NPA leaders have to somehow rally almost half the pilot group who voted yes. Terrible prospect.

Kill it hard, or get it as good as you can and hope for the best. I've heard that somewhere before. Some event I was at recently in our nation's capital... can't seem to recall.

Tell your friends, your initial new-hire classmates, spread the word in any way possible, just watch yourself... big brother IS watching.

 

[Ty Webb]

According to poll at a very recent Recurrent class, they were 100% voting against..... surprising, but encouraging.


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[AFcitrus]

My guess is 75% NO - 25% yes. With somewhere around 80-85% voting.

Here's my logic.. I figure we will see about the same turnout as we did in the recall vote. The recall was almost as important as voting on this TA. If 22% of the pilots couldn't be bothered to to take 2 minutes to vote in the recall, only a small percentage more (2-7%) will vote in the TA vote.

I have not talked to any pilots who voted for the recall who plan on voting YES on the TA. I have, however, talked to a few who were against the TA but thought that voting out our leadership at such an important time wasn't prudent.

Since the turnout should be about the same (or a little higher) the same numbers will vote against the TA that voted in favor of the recall - around 71.5%(average between Pres. and VP). On top of that add a few percentage points for those I speak of above who were planning on voting NO for the TA but wanted the leadership to stay.

Hence, somewhere around 75% NO vote....Remember where you heard it.

 

[PCL_128]

I have not talked to any pilots who voted for the recall who plan on voting YES on the TA.

I flew with a guy who voted YES on the recall but changed his vote to YES on the TA. However, he was very senior, so I wasn't surprised that he's in support of the TA.

 

[Ty Webb]

I flew with a guy who voted YES on the recall but changed his vote to YES on the TA. However, he was very senior, so I wasn't surprised that he's in support of the TA.

Bet he couldn't fly worth a sh!t, too . . . and is probably on a "list" somewhere . . . . it seems to be a recurring theme.

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[PCL_128]

Bet he couldn't fly worth a sh!t, too . . . and is probably on a "list" somewhere . . . . it seems to be a recurring theme.

Not on "the list." He was a full-term striker. I gave him Lear's rebuttal summary, so hopefully he'll read it and change his vote back.