AIRTRAN has a TA ?!?!

[LUalum]

Make sure to join the NPA pilot conference call tonight at 7pm est. It should be interesting.

 

[Ty Webb]

I hate to say this, but Mike M wouldn't have brought us anything.. The company wasn't going to negotiate with him.. Too much water under the bridge... Lear...

You are mistaken . . . when AP caved and withdrew MB, it was a weakness that put the COmpany in the drivers' seat.

We would have been better off with MB standing tough, than we are now, wasting time with this completely concessionary POS that is an insult to every pilot on the property.

 

[Fly-By-Cable]

If the company screws us on a merger I'll just set the parking brake. The pilots control this airline as long as they don't leave their nuts at home in the refrigerator. The company dones't want to play that game.

Yep! In ATL it doesn't matter how slow you taxi to the runway. As you get sequence when you call Ground at 4-South. Now if you take you time getting to 4-South (as we all should 'cause of all vehicles and ramp activity) then there could be 5-10 other airplanes who called for taxi ahead of you. And if a couple of those are Heavy then you're stuck in a small line.

At other airports I will exercise extreme caution when taxing.

 

[Ace McCoy]

So confused

I'm posting this two threads because I'm so confused...

Does anyone out there have any ideas why the NPA agreed to so many concessions in this TA with basically nothing in return? I can't find one giveback that the NPA can say "well at least we got X back for the pilots"

For instance we gave up the door time in return for what? Gave up retiree medical for what? And the list goes on.

We are not in bankruptcy or on the verge of a strike so there seems no reason to me that the NC should even entertain stuff that is worse than current book.

That is my main problem. Why was there so many givebacks for no reason? I would have been completely fine with current book and 15-25% raises across the board.

 

[Lear70]

Too much water under the bridge... Lear... Block or better is gone as well?? It just keeps getting worse and worse...

Slide # 10: "Core CREDIT time, based on Median ACTUAL block times from the same 3 month periods from last year".

The LOA signed by AP regarding "look back" block or better for the entire day is incorporated into the new T.A.

One of the guys who actually read this thing says that Section 4.I is completely missing from the new T.A.

So yeah, we lost it.

From talking to BoD member today, their sales pitch on this will be something like this: "yeah it's not great, but if we go back to the table, we will end up with the same thing only a year later, and will have no merger protection during next few months"

That's a bunch of horsesh*t.

EVERYONE needs to understand this, and take a good, close look at the UAir and AWA integration.

The FAA will NOT allow one certificate holder to operate two separate certificates as a single operation.

Additionally, should the seniority problem not be solvable and it goes to court, the Allegheny-Mohawk precedent also REQUIRES the two groups to be combined into one.

Since we are not ALPA, DOH isn't a valid merging term as it would result in a "windfall" to the MEH group.

In short, WE DO have merger protection, as the company can't operate the two companies separately under one name and WE get to work out terms through the M&A committee, run by BD.

This needs to be CLEARLY understood by every pilot here. We're evidently going to have to work out a flyer for every pilot that contradicts and clarifies the inaccuracies published by the BOD and NC and distribute it to everyone...

 

[XRMEFLYER]

Scope is a deal breaker on its own. Anything over 50 seats must be flown by us. Period!

Giving up 4 hour min day for 4.5 average? NO

Changing pay from doors closed to rolling? NO

Computation of pay based on average flown same three month priod in year prior versus scheduled? NO

Loss of Emergency Sick Bank? NO

Reserve overhaul? NO

Training section? NO

12 hour day gone? NO

Addition of 15 year pay scale? NO

These are just a few that come to mind. And all of that for what? A pay raise that almost keeps up with inflation. I get that this is a give and take and with the exception of section 1 (non negotiable), I might be willing to give on the other things if their was anything to take.

Depressingly, I was just speaking to a 9 year captain who was trying to sell me on how this mgt. team has kept every promise that it has made to the pilot group and how we should just trust them on the scope thing. I am just being paranoid he said. He was planning on voting yes. Bums me out.

 

[DougCorp-9]

you should of jacked him in mouth.

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

If this sh!t pass, that 9 year CA will be flying is shinning new plane by himself.

 

[Ty Webb]

We're evidently going to have to work out a flyer for every pilot that contradicts and clarifies the inaccuracies published by the BOD and NC and distribute it to everyone...

Excellent idea.


.

 

[Ty Webb]

If this sh!t pass, that 9 year CA will be flying is shinning new plane by himself.

Sounds to me like he already is . . .

 

[GunSlinger]

This is the same crap that Johnny O. tried on us at Mesa. Because of a weak, non-unified pilot group, and corrupt union leadership, they took it as the best thing they could achieve and ran with it. Not only did every positive promise of the crappy contract never come true, we were stuck with those hideos concessionary changes that put more money directly into managment's pocket.

This TA is a joke. Anybody who feels that voting for this will ensure job security is a moron. LETS NOT SELL EACH OTHER OUT LIKE THE DAYS OF THE PAST, AND FOR ONCE STAND SIDE BY SIDE UNTIL THE COMPANY AGREES TO OUR TERMS. WE HAVE ALL THE NEGOTIATING CAPITAL IN THE WORLD, THE COMPANY HAS NONE!

It is time to fly by the book 100%. It is time to ground airplanes in outstations.

IT IS TIME TO GROW SOME BALLS AND GET WHAT WE WANT!

 

[EMBATP]

i agree 110% that this is a turd that should be flushed, with authority.

i also agree that those of us that understand the true meaning behind this thing go to the roadshows with fliers in hand to point-counterpoint every issue of this thing that the union addresses and show everyone what this thing really means...a concession in every sense of the word.

i willl gladly spend my own time and money to do this to shoot this thing down, before i sign this thing and let the company just take it away

 

[FlyFastLiveSlow]

Make sure to join the NPA pilot conference call tonight at 7pm est. It should be interesting.

Will it be webcast on the website later? SOme of us have to work.

 

[N tha jungle]

What's up with all the givebacks?

You guys have the best reserve pay in the industry currently, HANDS DOWN, don't EVER give that up. If you're a new captain (or plan to upgrade to captain in the next SIX years(4 year duration and 2 more for negotiating) do yourself a favor and figure out how much it will affect your finances at home for the next six years, that's 2013!

And what about all the work you do between door closed and push- If you pass this doo doo, you can thank yourself and the guy reading your checklist for helping your great company pay nearly $400,000,000 for midex. Thats right, 4 with eight zeros behind it. Keep the current contract!

 

[Lear70]

You guys have the best reserve pay in the industry currently, HANDS DOWN, don't EVER give that up. If you're a new captain (or plan to upgrade to captain in the next SIX years(4 year duration and 2 more for negotiating) do yourself a favor and figure out how much it will affect your finances at home for the next six years, that's 2013!

Yup.

Average CA reserve time here is 2 years and only going up.

NO!