Alpa President John Prater's Video Response To Age 60

[CapnVegetto]

rant deleted

 

[Andy]

Anybody ever stop to consider that Prater just might have had a private talk with Marion Blakley and maybe he already knows that this rule is going to change.

This is from a private board:

"Some guys I know at SWAPA who are trying to raise the Age 60 thing and who meet with Blakely monthly are telling me that Prater sold us out. I did not believe them until this...now we have a 'blue-ribbon" committee to help ...whatever the heck that is! I'll tell you what it is, its back-room wink, wink, nod, nod..crap. Pure boardroom politics where once again the senior guys benefit and the junior guys loose out. Tell me again why I have been defending ALPA for the past 6 months with these UPA guys? "



I think that it's time to send Prater a clear message - if you fail to follow the majority opinion and direction from the membership, you face recall. It's time to recall prater.

 

[Andy]

Everybody on this forum views age 60 as a zero sum game--if it changes every FO will be an FO for 5 years longer period. ALL predictions are we're going to be short about 30,000 pilots in the industry over the next 10 years or so so there is going to be plenty of expansion and upgrades. The ALPA survey was taken before UAL lost their A plan, DAL lost theirs and most of the A plans were frozen. I'd venture to say there would be some different answers today. Age 60 has always been about economics and will always be about economics and it will always be "devisive" as long as the younger pilots outnumber the older ones.

Airfogey

A) It's a NEGATIVE sum game. Not even close to a zero sum game.

B) The ALPA survey happened in 2006. UAL had already lost their pensions and the handwriting was on the wall for Delta.

C) The furloughees were not permitted to be included in the survey. You're right that the results would be different today. It would be even MORE in favor of no change to age 60.

 

[Purpled]

rant deleted

You should have kept it, it was good!

 

[Purpled]

A) It's a NEGATIVE sum game. Not even close to a zero sum game.

Bravo, Andy.

Everybody, pay attention. When this is all over, assuming a change, some will get to be Captains for 5 extra years, and some will get to be F/Os for 5 extra years...bottom line, that's a screw job!

I guess I should add that some will stay on furlough or not get hired for another 5 years...that's a screw job too!

 

[PCL_128]

It's time to recall prater.

Yep. Still the worst idea ever proposed on this board.

 

[FNG_that's me]

Yep. Still the worst idea ever proposed on this board.

Well then, how about some suggestions on good ideas!

 

[PCL_128]

Well then, how about some suggestions on good ideas!

Good ideas? Let's start with accepting reality: the rule will change. I don't like it, you don't like it, a majority of the membership doesn't like it, but it is going to happen. We can't stop it at this point. All we can do is minimize the damage. This is called pragmatism, guys. You shouldn't be fighting a futile fight. Focus on the fight that you can actually win: designing the new rule in a way that harms us the least. This is what the Association is currently doing, and it's the smart way to go. Crying and attacking Captain Prater is not productive, and it won't save the age-60 rule for you.

 

[FNG_that's me]

Good ideas? Let's start with accepting reality: the rule will change. I don't like it, you don't like it, a majority of the membership doesn't like it, but it is going to happen. We can't stop it at this point. All we can do is minimize the damage. This is called pragmatism, guys. You shouldn't be fighting a futile fight. Focus on the fight that you can actually win: designing the new rule in a way that harms us the least. This is what the Association is currently doing, and it's the smart way to go. Crying and attacking Captain Prater is not productive, and it won't save the age-60 rule for you.

I said good ideas, not giving up ideas!

 

[Phaedrus]

Frenchie!

 

[PCL_128]

I said good ideas, not giving up ideas!

If you want to stick your head in the sand and pretend that this isn't going to happen, then have at it.

 

[seefive]

PCL.

Continuing to fight against a rule change that ALPA's majority wants to retain isn't sticking your head in the sand. Wake up jackass.

 

[FNG_that's me]

If you want to stick your head in the sand and pretend that this isn't going to happen, then have at it.

I'm looking for good ideas...still waiting.

Keeping my head in the sand would be assuming ALPA is going to do what it's charged to do by the majority!

 

[PCL_128]

I'm looking for good ideas...still waiting.

And you'll be waiting a very long time if you're idea of a good idea is trying to save a rule that is already doomed.

 

[FNG_that's me]

And you'll be waiting a very long time if you're idea of a good idea is trying to save a rule that is already doomed.

So are you saying that SWAPA and JB(no representation) won over ALPA on this one...say it isn't so.

I fear that this could be the end of ALPA, which would suck because imagine how bad this job would be without them...however, I don't see the majority sitting around and taking this one.