"..With You.."

[T-handle]

Not sure if it's popular at other airlines, but NWA pilots are notoriously whiny on the radio always asking how long final is going into MSP. I have NEVER heard any other airline ask how long final is. Who the fock really cares? It's always going to be 20 or more miles going into MSP. You got somewhere to go?

And many NWA pilots do not pronunciate D as Delta, they say Dixie (don't want to be caught saying your code share partner?). Wtf is dixie? Some say Dog.... so much for the phonetic alphabet, when you're flying with NWA, they've got their own vocabulary.

 

[Steeler Fan]

Good point. Everytime I hear that "on the hold" stuff it sort of reminds me of the verbiage that helped the KLM and Pan Am 747s smack together in the fog back in 1977. Yet, as you pointed out, you still hear that one all the time.

TENIRIFE...

Capt VanZanten was one of KLM's most repected pilots, but now is a CRM training aid. The accident investigtion found his lack of CRM as a contributing factor.

Lots of good points in that video. Rushing, get-home itis, leadership. But I bet ole Capt. Van Zantan always made perfect radio calls with flawless radio terminology.

This may upset some of you, but there is a middle ground here...

"Position and Hold"--absloutely (yes I was Air Force and managed to eliminate On-To-Hold from my vocabulary).
"340 for 200"--Flying Tigers comes to mind--"Descending Two-Four--Zero--Zero", versus "Descending To Four-Zero-Zero"--I never transmit "For" when I'm talking about climbing or descending--I'll say "340 Climbing 370" or "230 Descending 190"
"And Center, United 123, is with you 350"--in the states, no problem, but if your speaking to Foreign Controllers, you'd better keep it as standard as possible
*Stating which runway you're cleared to land on--Great idea (sorry to hear about your friend)
"G-day, checking-in, with-you"--No way I'm making a big deal about this--It's not a Safety issue--unless I'm flying international, then I only tend to slack off a little when I'm talking to a PATCO guy in Saudi Airspace.
*Not using your call-sign when acknowledging a clearance/frequency change--Yes this is a pet peave of mine as well
*Accepting a clearance when ATC screws up your call-sign, ie Citrus 857 versus Citrus 875--This could end up being a HUGE deal, so I want the call sign confusion fixed--"Confirm that last clearance was for Citrus 876?"
"Hey, Center, did I ever tell you that you're my favorite controller? Any chance of a short-cut tonight?"--I just hope my Captain has a sense of humor, because I've done this before, and it's worked.


Some things are truly a big deal, so in that respect I appreciate this thread, but I'm not going to tick off the guy in the other seat unless I feel it really is a safety issue. Things work better when both pilots are standard, and when both get along.


GO STEELERS!!!!!!!!

 

[PCL_128]

Not sure if it's popular at other airlines, but NWA pilots are notoriously whiny on the radio always asking how long final is going into MSP. I have NEVER heard any other airline ask how long final is. Who the fock really cares? It's always going to be 20 or more miles going into MSP. You got somewhere to go?

Knowing how long the final is allows you to plan the descent. I'm not going to throw out the boards to get a 2000 fpm descent when 1000 fpm will do on a long final.

And many NWA pilots do not pronunciate D as Delta, they say Dixie (don't want to be caught saying your code share partner?). Wtf is dixie? Some say Dog.... so much for the phonetic alphabet, when you're flying with NWA, they've got their own vocabulary.

Dixie is the official phonetic word for "D" at some airports. CVG has a taxiway Dixie and the controllers all use Dixie at ATL, SLC, and DFW usually to avoid any confusion with Delta.

 

[KC-10 Driver]

A controller recently asked me to, "State my intentions." I responded, "I would like to marry your daughter." Do you think that is what he was asking?


And, recently, while flying into JFK at about 5am, I was #1 from about 25 miles out. The NY Approach controller asked, "JetBlue XX, do you want the crowbar?" I responded, "Pry it open, baby!"

Was that non-standard?

(Translation: "Do you want a tight, steep base turn?" "Affirmative.")

 

[captain caveman]

Knowing how long the final is allows you to plan the descent. I'm not going to throw out the boards to get a 2000 fpm descent when 1000 fpm will do on a long final.

Isn't that what that "fish finder" thingy is for?

What about those idiots that say tree instead of three? There's no trees that high in the air, right?

 

[KC-10 Driver]

And, it really bothers me when I hear "Three" and "Five", instead of the correct "Tree" and "Fife" on the radio!

Seriously, someone earlier mentioned that it is annoying to hear "Sugar" instead of "Sierra". "Sugar" was actually phonetically correct until the mid-1950's, when the current phonetic alphabet was adopted and it was replaced by "Sierra".

What can you tell from this post? I have no life, seeing as I read this entire thread. And, I am pathetic for knowing such useless trivia about the phonetic alphabet.

 

[Huggyu2]

How's this for radio brevity on checkin:
"Approach (no need saying "Oakland" or "Houston"; they know who they are), N345Hotel, 11 thousand, tally, 1 o'clock; nojoy, 11 o'clock; request lower (don't say "when able", that's a given, dummy; also, consider telling him the altitude you want rather than just "lower"); vectors ILS 13 right, full stop; X-ray (the ATIS)"

Man, that sounds cool!!!

Or how about
"Center, N345H, engine out; scared; going to die (would be better if you just said "mort" instead of "going to die"); popeye; fox 2; valsalva, ejecting,.... oh, wait, I"m in a Baron; no ejection seat; nevermind, over and out; 10-10; 10-8, on the side."

Don't these convey so much more information so much quicker??!!

 

[Madcow]

Quick question from a rookie:


Let's say your destination is TEB. The ATIS is Sierra. Bradley App hands you off to New York Approach.

Do you advise each subsequent sector that you have Sierra? or Just the initial New York approach sector? I can't find it in the AIM. Thanks.

 

[RSixer]

"with ya"

I hear a guy check into Indy Center every night "with ya", but he says it like this "Withhhh yaaaaa". It does drive me a little crazy, good thing Captain 7 isn't on freq, be a awfull mess to clean up when his head exploded.

 

[ERfly]

I bet you Captain 7 would have a coronary if he came down to Houston and Max was working. Just be warned Captain, Max doesn't use a proper call sign when addressing my company. I hope that doesn't bother you. I enjoy it when Max is working. He's always good spirited and kinda brightens your day.

 

[FracCapt]

Knowing how long the final is allows you to plan the descent. I'm not going to throw out the boards to get a 2000 fpm descent when 1000 fpm will do on a long final.

Sounds like you're flying in/out of ATL. Where else would you be in a situation where you need the boards to get 2000fpm on a CRJ but ATL, where you're doing 170 knots 30 miles out.

 

[FDJ2]

...Yawn...

 

[Stifler's Mom]

CLICK HERE to listen to a confused cockpit crew.

Captain 7,

Thanks for the laughs, we all need these threads every now and then.

Hey, you know what they say... See a broad, to get that booty yak 'em.
Leg 'er down 'n smack 'em yak 'em
Cold got to be. You know? Shiiiiit.

Smack 'em yack 'em

 

[Wild Weasel]

BTW is it common these days to laugh at your students? In my old age I must have forgoten that...um......
technique.

When I went thru flight training the techniques used by the instructors were Fear, Ridicule and Sarcasm.....aahhhhhhh, the good old days

 

[Flyingdutchman]

I cannot believe I just spend 10 minutes reading all this BS.

Anyway, my 2 cents..

If it’s busy out there, stick to the standard radio phraseology.

If it’s not busy it shouldn’t be a problem to have a little fun as long as safety never gets compromised

Flying chick:

Feeling the need to prove something? Get your facts straight before you start making fun of your students.

Roger = I understand everything you said.
Wilco (Will Comply) = I understand everything you said, and I will carry it out that way.

Capt 7 :

Start reading “Human Factors for General Aviation from Jeppesen” . Also, read “Human Knowledge and Performance” from Jeppesen.

 

[CapnVegetto]

And screw the frickin hat... and the uniform for that matter! T-shirts, shorts and flip flops for everyone!!

Best idea I've ever seen on this forum.

 

[paulsalem]

This is a column by a Center controller in ATL. He is for standard phraseology, and backs it up with some pretty good examples.

http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182636-1.html

At the very least its an intresting read.

 

[UnAnswerd]

From "The Pilots Radio Communications Hanbook", 5th edition:

"The expression "with you" is used any time you are being handed off or automatically transferred from one agency to another".

Apparently, it is a valid phrase. At the very least, it may be acceptable in some cases.

 

[Phaedrus]

paulsalem: Thanks for the link. Informative, humble, and interesting.

 

[Juvat]

I almost got Unsat'd on a checkride once for using "with you." I did learn to fly at a small flight school in Daytona that rhymes with Embry-Riddle. Therefore, I don't use "with you" ever.

My only pet peeve is "On the hold." I don't even know what that means. I know it loosely translates to "position and hold," but its just a jumble of words. Just say, "position and hold."

"On to hold" is a fighter pilot thing. I sometimes slip and say it, but please don't b1tch at me...I was turning bad guys into hair, teeth, and eyeballs when your mom was still shaking turds out of your knickers.