Why is AT&T losing its pilots?

[CRJCA]

LegacyDriver is right in some of his comments about "T". The ones who have left in the past year claim the place is a "funny farm" and the day to day work just wasn't worth it anymore. This (in my opinion) is a direct result of poor leadership below the Director level. The C.P. has to go, period. He is a problem. That was my opinion, and was very much in the discussions I had with those who left. I also like to add karma into the equation. Many who were axed were let go in haste for reasons still as yet unknown to even those still there. The whole thing was a mess from the start. Several who made the cut retired almost as soon as they settled in Dallas. Add that to the fact that the job now entails many more nights away and mediocre pay and guys are just saying "enough". To say the department is in a "heap" is a splendid way of putting it I believe.

 

[Turtledriver]

I have heard the pay is pretty poor. I think they include bonus and options/shares and call it a total pay package. Which of course every other Fortune 500 does, just pays a much higher base in addition to the bonuses and stock. Rumor has it the politico director was dead set in getting a woman pilot at all costs. When they interviewed An HP woman, she laughed at his package. not sure if he finally got one or not.

THIS IS NOT ANYTHING AGAINST WOMEN PILOTS! WE HAVE SEVERAL AND THEY ARE ALL GREAT,

 

[sleepy]

It is an overall mentality I am referring to. If your attitude is you are getting a $79 rental car for an overnight when the hotel is literally within walking distance then it is a sure bet you're wasting a ton of money elsewhere.

We get rental cars everywhere we go, not matter what. It is because management wants maximum flexibility if the trip changes, not because they care so much about crew comfort.

 

[AeroDork]

When they interviewed An HP woman, she laughed at his package.

Snicker. :blush:
And that right there is a large problem in our industry now. The new breed of Aviation Directors and Chief Pilots are lacking in the bulge when it comes to standing up for their guys. They're all a bunch of yes men (and I use the term men loosely).

 

[CRJCA]

I have heard the pay is pretty poor. I think they include bonus and options/shares and call it a total pay package. Which of course every other Fortune 500 does, just pays a much higher base in addition to the bonuses and stock. Rumor has it the politico director was dead set in getting a woman pilot at all costs. When they interviewed An HP woman, she laughed at his package. not sure if he finally got one or not.

THIS IS NOT ANYTHING AGAINST WOMEN PILOTS! WE HAVE SEVERAL AND THEY ARE ALL GREAT,

Yes they did, two in fact. To replace two they let go of before. Not sure what that's all about. And yes, the pay package was poor. They did include performance based bonuses and stock. But even that was so-so, and in fact they didn't even get them for a year or two after we left.

 

[Turtledriver]

I heard from a couple folks about the Asst Chief Pilots. They have 3. The pompous A-Hole recently had 2 glorious screw ups. First he set the rubber jungle free during a pax filled flight on a 900, using the excuse he has been on the 7X to much and hadn't flown the 900 lately. Same guy that preaches checklist discipline.

Next he forces the CEO switch planes after he couldnt start #2......wait for it....the thrust reverser was not stowed. CHECKLIST DISCIPLINE

No wonder folks are fleeing. The guy sounds fairly incompetent.

 

[Cat3C]

the world is full of incompetent management pilots - not just this department

 

[Sandhawk]

Is G.P. still there? If so, is he CP or Dept Mgr or ???

 

[LegacyDriver]

Is G.P. still there? If so, is he CP or Dept Mgr or ???

The Pope is still there. CP. Saw him on the 7X a couple months back. Had a nice talk with him for a bit.

Saw Nator at FSI. Also saw Heeeyyy on a 900 EASy not too long ago. Talk about heartburn for the sake of guys like CRJ...

Ran into a few others along the way. Glad people still have jobs in this economy.

 

[LegacyDriver]

I heard from a couple folks about the Asst Chief Pilots. They have 3. The pompous A-Hole recently had 2 glorious screw ups. First he set the rubber jungle free during a pax filled flight on a 900, using the excuse he has been on the 7X to much and hadn't flown the 900 lately. Same guy that preaches checklist discipline.

Next he forces the CEO switch planes after he couldnt start #2......wait for it....the thrust reverser was not stowed. CHECKLIST DISCIPLINE

No wonder folks are fleeing. The guy sounds fairly incompetent.

The best management pilot they had didn't want to be one in the first place... Went back to being a line captain after the move. Great, great guy. Nothing but respect for him. Heart of gold.

 

[rumrnr78]

True, but the department was too big and too expensive. They basically cut it in half for starters... You can imagine the increased workload that would put on those who remain.

People are still staying for a career. The thing is they hire then furlough. Then hire and furlough. Some stay for a career because they're high enough to dodge the axe... There were guys with 12-15 years getting the chop on the first round.

I can only say that a couple of the people I know who left did so because of the things you mentioned. Another few are biding their time so they can retire.

Don't shoot the messenger. Just passing things along that I have been told because you asked.

All true LD! You brought me back from self imposed exile!

 

[LegacyDriver]

All true LD! You brought me back from self imposed exile!

"Heeeyyyyyyyyy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Is that anywhere near Lubbock?"

 

[Turtledriver]

Has anyone heard of a chief pilot there who has a daughter in the flight dept. I guess these two get into big loud arguments when they fly together. Nobody seems to know if it's a father/daughter thing or a pilot/flight attendant. Seems to happen on a regular basis. Same asst chief pilot that shutdown a perfectly good engine on one of their 2000's.

Sounds like a carnival ride over there. I would think they would have some type of nepotism clause to prevent these family feuds.

 

[Turtledriver]

Can somebody verify a 10 year Captain on a 900Easy is barely making $100?

 

[CRJCA]

Can somebody verify a 10 year Captain on a 900Easy is barely making $100?

Sounds about right. As for the other post yes there is an Assistant CP that has a daughter flight attendant but not sure about the "arguments". But it wouldn't surprise me.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Sounds about right. As for the other post yes there is an Assistant CP that has a daughter flight attendant but not sure about the "arguments". But it wouldn't surprise me.

Sounds like " Shakedown" to me. No idea about the arguments thing though....

I do remember him giving a line check to two people in this thread and criticizing them for using flows on all the checklists. "We don't do flows here."


Don't forget to put in your mandatorily voluntary United Way donation, CRJ.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Same asst chief pilot that shutdown a perfectly good engine on one of their 2000's.

They have a history of people flaming out engines. It keeps you employed longer. It is also why they are addicted to three-holers.

One guy (who survived the cut by the way) allegedly dual flame outed one of their Citation 650s years ago...with the CEO on board. He still has a job. But one of the guys in this thread managed a cabin depress at altitude flawlessly with multiple execs in back and got the chop.

There are three guys there I would swap out. Bring CRJ and Rum back, along with just about anyone on the street, and punt those other three... But quality isn't the criteria there.

Heyyyyy!

 

[Turtledriver]

Why would anyone want to go back or even start there? That flight Department has a storied past as one of the premier positions in corporate aviation. I can't believe the amount of negative info coming out about the management team this place definately has gone down to bush league chief pilots and a clueless director with a Napolianic complex.

I wonder what keeps these folks at this flight department.

 

[LegacyDriver]

The previous director was an absent minded professor.... Overrated I would say, but it had potential to be awesome.

Put Doug or Mark in charge....maybe one or two others would also do a good job....and the place really could be great.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Why would anyone want to go back or even start there?

A job is a job right now. Anything beats unemployment.

That flight Department has a storied past as one of the premier positions in corporate aviation.

Just remember it used to be SBC which acquired AT&T and took the name over. Then BellSouth and Cingular came in. So you are merging three/four different departments and reputations.