Why do ASA pilots want PBS?

[79%N1]

Don't you NOT get paid for the dropped portion of trips after or before the actual week of vacation? Not everybody chooses to "drop" 20 or more hours to get the magical 20 days on 1 week of vaca. I know I never did. If you had 3 days off before the vacation and 3 days after, that is 2 weeks and that is plenty for me. I'm just speaking for myself, but getting paid 50 hours in a month just to get 3 weeks off was never worth it. I guess it worked different at XJT. Do you guys somehow get paid for those conflicting days you drop?

 

[SLUF4]

all i know is the union came into RGT pushing it really hard on us...i still didn't want it

 

[cybourg10]

Don't you NOT get paid for the dropped portion of trips after or before the actual week of vacation? Not everybody chooses to "drop" 20 or more hours to get the magical 20 days on 1 week of vaca. I know I never did. If you had 3 days off before the vacation and 3 days after, that is 2 weeks and that is plenty for me. I'm just speaking for myself, but getting paid 50 hours in a month just to get 3 weeks off was never worth it. I guess it worked different at XJT. Do you guys somehow get paid for those conflicting days you drop?

We get the min guarantee of 75 hours no matter how many trips were dropped. If you wish to pick up trips during your vacation it goes down as add pay. You could fly 50 hours for the month for 95+ hours of pay. We have had guys fly a full months schedule during a vacation month and credit 180 hrs. Most of us enjoy the time off but you will never lose any pay below your min guarantee.

 

[sweptback]

And guess what, with ASA's PBS you will never get paid less than 75 hours in a vacation month. With the vacation bid low option, you can extend your vacation as well. You guys know nothing about the work rules that ASA pilots got, so don't assume our PBS system is on par with CAL's.

 

[PapaSiera]

Don't you NOT get paid for the dropped portion of trips after or before the actual week of vacation? Not everybody chooses to "drop" 20 or more hours to get the magical 20 days on 1 week of vaca. I know I never did. If you had 3 days off before the vacation and 3 days after, that is 2 weeks and that is plenty for me. I'm just speaking for myself, but getting paid 50 hours in a month just to get 3 weeks off was never worth it. I guess it worked different at XJT. Do you guys somehow get paid for those conflicting days you drop?

We are protected to 75 hours and can drop us much as we want. I have gotten a max of 25 days off for 1 week of vacation before. Usually its between 19-23 days off though.

 

[cybourg10]

And guess what, with ASA's PBS you will never get paid less than 75 hours in a vacation month. With the vacation bid low option, you can extend your vacation as well. You guys know nothing about the work rules that ASA pilots got, so don't assume our PBS system is on par with CAL's.

Unfortunately most of what XJT guys know about PBS is the crappy CAL language. Some of know that ASA has much better PBS language but is it better than what we have at XJT is the question.

 

[crj567]

Being owned by Skywest has gone to my brain. Can we make stuff better? No doubt there. However, these militant guys here would complain if they only worked one day a month. you need to understand that. Is XJT vacation better? looking over the contract, I'd say no doubt. The basic tenants of this system beat CAL's into the ground but I believe we can do better with the vacation which is the only place I saw us backing up.


So... Chill out... Let us try it out and let you guys know about it. Talk to average EV guys and not these jaded bleeding twats on this board.

Enjoying the pay raise?

-Nice to bump the ol' paycheck up just to keep the system from "being abused."

I would enjoy it while it lasts. Once people figure out how crappy their schedules will be, the number of us "jaded bleeding twats" will rise dramatically. Can't be a good thing.

 

[crj567]

And guess what, with ASA's PBS you will never get paid less than 75 hours in a vacation month. With the vacation bid low option, you can extend your vacation as well. You guys know nothing about the work rules that ASA pilots got, so don't assume our PBS system is on par with CAL's.

Yeah-it is gonna be great! 7 days vacation and 75 hours!! AWESOME!!

 

[Medeco]

Hey CRJ

Weren't you sure that ASA could not buy anybody?

 

[COOPERVANE]

I didn't want or vote for PBS.

PRIMARILY for the vacation loss. Lots of the FO's I flew with were oblivious to the whole vacation thing. They didn't care 'cause they were gonna be at Delta in a year or two and didn't have time to read the details.

Many Captains I talked to said "Since I have kids, I don't travel anyway"

The reps position was we were "abusing" the system turning 7 days off into 22, and "we don't live in an environment where we can do that anymore" "Those days are gone" (yes I was told this personally MANY times)

To the XJet guys: May ASA'ers voted yes on PBS ONLY because we were ABSOLUTELY going to have PBS whether we liked it or not. By voting it in, we were told we would be in the drivers seat and could negotiate the vendor, language, etc...If not, we would get an inferior product forced down our throats. That was probably true. I think we just caved in too easily.

Since it passed, we have discovered in incalculable amount of loopholes and loose language, not to mention the above mentioned benefit to the reps. THEY PUSHED IT HARD!!

We have just this week been hit with the first consequence from the lies our reps told us. We were sold THREE months of parallel bidding for training and to see how it works. Now we are doing 3 WEEKS instead. The association email in part said it was because they were afraid we would "forget how to use the software if it was 3 consecutive months" I think this is exactly what the future will be with PBS. Now it becomes clear why everyone that benefits is in a hurry to implement PBS. Someone above said we can try it out and if we hate it we can go back. Once it is on property, I don't think we can ever go back. They'll NEVER allow it.

Don't let this turd pass your muster. You know it suxx, we know it suxx.

 

[crj567]

Hey CRJ

Weren't you sure that ASA could not buy anybody?

Well- Considering that ASA is not an independent company, I would say it did not buy anything. Try going out and buying a share of ASA stock. How about trying to find out where the ASA board of directors meeting is held. Maybe you can come up with a 10K statement or an annual report which has ASA on it.

-If you still think that ASA really bought anything, I cannot help you.

 

[JettBoii]

PBS; ho hum. Same crappy overnights on the 200. You just decide when you want to stay there.

 

[maxcackel]

With the old bidding system that's about to be trashed we could bid conflicting trips to be dropped, if that dropped you below 75 hrs it was easy to pick up a nap or day line to bring you back. As a person on vacation you got priority on open time to do that over senior people not on vacation at the beginning of the month. So it was easy to get 18-20 days off and get paid 75hrs. My best month was 22 days. Now with pbs maybe the top 20% might get 15 days but most will get just a few over 7. I tried to tell people that minus the pay raise you get if you divided your days worked this year by the pay compared to the days worked next year by the pay with pbs(agian minus raise) you will get paid much less per day at work with pbs. Between the lost vacation days and other conflicting days it will cost you time at home for the same or less pay. But in a way the company has done this to me this year over last year with the poorly constructed trips and lines with less days off, I have worked many more days this year than last and by July 31st have made less than last year WITH my raise!

 

[SPDBRD747400]

Never wanted it...I voted NO! Wish many others had also, I still feel the number were rigged.

 

[ASA Captain]

Let's see. Set vacation low 70-75 hours required to meet the window. Check virtual credit to 4 X 7 = 28. 75-28=47. Need 47 to make line. Two 4-days at 20 hours is 40. Pick up one more day-line to ELP or an overnight to get the last seven hours. Working 9-10 days and paid 75. Not bad.

The reason you are working more now is because we have more flying now as compared to last year.

 

[maxcackel]

"We are going to get PBS anyway, might as well vote it in now". The dumbest statement made the entire time I've been at ASA. ONLY if we vote it in people. Just because the company want's it does not make it so. What if the company said HUGE PAY CUTS or else would you just fold in contract negotiations, NO. The union scarred the pilots into thinking they would have to agree to it in negotiations or never get a contract. Wrong but you will never know now.

 

[maxcackel]

Let's see. Set vacation low 70-75 hours required to meet the window. Check virtual credit to 4 X 7 = 28. 75-28=47. Need 47 to make line. Two 4-days at 20 hours is 40. Pick up one more day-line to ELP or an overnight to get the last seven hours. Working 9-10 days and paid 75. Not bad.

The reason you are working more now is because we have more flying now as compared to last year.

But I've made less than last year due to those months of every line at 75 avg and crap trip construction.

 

[crj567]

Let's see. Set vacation low 70-75 hours required to meet the window. Check virtual credit to 4 X 7 = 28. 75-28=47. Need 47 to make line. Two 4-days at 20 hours is 40. Pick up one more day-line to ELP or an overnight to get the last seven hours. Working 9-10 days and paid 75. Not bad.

The reason you are working more now is because we have more flying now as compared to last year.

Your math assumes trips blocked to reasonable time. If you are flying a couple of 14 hr 4 days or 11 hour three days, it takes a lot more work to get to 47 hours. Of course the road show certainly tip-toed around any possibly downside, so I can understand the confusion.

 

[maxcackel]

Your math assumes trips blocked to reasonable time. If you are flying a couple of 14 hr 4 days or 11 hour three days, it takes a lot more work to get to 47 hours. Of course the road show certainly tip-toed around any possibly downside, so I can understand the confusion.[/QUOTE
Exactly. And if pushed would say that PBS might park a trip right before or after you vacation but its still awesome because you get a several days then a trip in the middle then several more days off. PUKE, "well honey we could go on vacation then come home a couple days then go back!"

 

[ASA Captain]

I don't argue with your point on the trip construction. When we were "fat" and furloughed, the company spread the flying on certain categories to min guarantee max work. Union doesn't control that.

We have only been "short" for a couple months.

What was your block time last year up to Aug? What about this year? What was the difference in pay? I don't doubt what you say but some real number might help show the disparity.

What's important in this thread is people are in a panic about something that haven't even run a fake bid on yet. Relax a bit. Wait until after the first bid, talk to a rep, find out what u did wrong, fix it, bid again, and then come bitc$@!?$ about how you can't hold 3 days.