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West Air and SKYW?
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EAP
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AnimalTale, I take exception to the fact that no Yonited guys protested the non-union communter flying takeover. In fact, United SFO council 34 passed several, and I mean several UNANIMOUS motions protesting the fact that United feed was going to go to a non union carrier that had SEVERAL times voted to be not represented by a union. What does a motion do? Well, ALPA cannot make UAL leadership completely turn about face on a decision like this, but it does make subtle changes to the direction. For instance, I know several guys that were interviewed and hired preferentially, as the result of these motions.AnimalTale said:
The second statement I take no objection to. Westair did in fact provide a good product in their earlier years and never went the PFT route like ACA, Comair, Atlantic Coast, Jetstream, etc. Of note, Mesa never did PFT either. And, Westair was one of the very first commuters to successfully provide jet feed with the BAe-146.
TIS
Wing, Nosewheel, Whatever
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- 366
Fun and games - WestAir in the 90s
The full mid 90s WestAir scoop goes like this.
In December of 1989 Presidential Airlines, the OE carrier for IAD went toes up. The call went out for someone to pick up the slack. Several companies were offered the opportunity and most came up with proposals that would have three to five cities in four to six months time. WestAir came along proposed – I believe it was five cities – by the end of NEXT WEEK! Sold to Tim and Maury out in Fresno.
The operation started and grew rapidly. So rapidly that hiring which had been so-so was now kicked into overdrive. For about six months nearly everyone hired at WestAir was shipped directly to the Washington Front.
Aug. 2, 1990 was the day that everything changed. Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait and set up a pattern of instability that sent fuel prices soaring and profits into the tank. (Sound like a familiar ailment?) By November 1990, WestAir was attempting to furlough the guys they didn’t want around out of seniority – namely the Bandit drivers who were flying the plane they planned to park. You see, they couldn’t afford to let all the Brasilia FOs on the east coast who were junior to the most junior Bandit guys on the west coast go. It would have brought the east coast operation to a screeching halt.
When that didn’t work they started dreaming up other ideas but the damage had been done. During the process of furloughing out of seniority, another nasty little development entered into the mix. NPA, the OE feeder in the Pacific Northwest was folded into WestAir. The reason this mattered was because when they furloughed the Bandit guys the dropped them form the seniority list. Because a general system bid had been triggered by the merger of the NPA and WestAir seniority lists the end result was that when it was all said and done, about 30 or 40 guys simply vanished even though they were still making those 0500 shows in FAT to do two round trips to SNA.
It didn’t take very long to get them back into the list and more or less in the right order but some training decisions had been made in the interim and quite a few people did not get the airplane and seat their proper seniority would hold. This was the source of a number of ALPA grievances and quite a bit of training expense when those grievances were eventually won.
Anyway, along about August 1991, it was clear that WestAir was in a lot of trouble. It was learned later that the paychecks almost bounced several times about then. It was in this climate then, that the sale of ACA to a group headed by Ed Acker was announced. To compact the story, everyone got to take a shot at being where they wanted to end up in a general system bid that was designed to finalize the division and severance of the seniority lists. Guys got screwed there too. A number of them wanted to go to ACA but weren’t allowed to because they filled key seats in the west. They were told that their seniority wouldn’t hold ACA – utter nonsense!
Towards the end of 1991 rumors began to fly about WestAir being up for sale and that Mesa might be the suitor. In short order the rumors were proved and by the end of the first quarter of 1992 Mesa and their union busting policies (and law firm) were in charge. They immediately downsized all existing domiciles and opened “mini-domiciles” in most of the cities WestAir served, thus putting overnight costs on the pilots – they had to pay the rent wherever they ended up. Naturally the lines went into the toilet with the elimination of the overnights. The days were long and the rests reduced almost al the time.
They also parked the six BAe-146s and later the Shorts 360s. Parking the 146s precipitated a flood of backwash through the seniority list as the top 50 or 60 on the list came tumbling down from their lofty perches in the jet. More furloughs that lasted about a month resulted. The reduction in force however, led to breaches in schedule integrity that United couldn’t ignore. On one day something like 40% of all OE flights failed to launch due to lack of crews. Most of these were out of SFO. With the word coming from the big “U” Mesa brought everyone back.
Things got rocky again when Mesa took the Brasilias out of the Northwest and brought them down to California. The crews had to come with them until they could be trained on the J32 – if that’s what they wanted – which they did almost universally. At about the same time the LAX flying, reduced by abandonment of routes was being replaced by dozens of “green hornets” – Mesa Beech 1900Cs – in violation of the WestAir ALPA contract scope and successorship clauses. Soon, Mesa began opening mini-domiciles in WestAir cities.
The writing had been on the wall for a while but this made quite a few start working REALLY hard at getting out. Things ground along for another three years or so and eventually the time came to renew the OE contract and this is when United said enough is enough. WestAir had nothing else to do without the contract and they shut down in 1997.
Hope this hasn't caused any relapses of anyone's post traumatic stress disorder. We were all affected significantly and adversely by the experience of working for and with Mr. Ornstein. Therapy bills should be sent to HIM!
TIS
The full mid 90s WestAir scoop goes like this.
In December of 1989 Presidential Airlines, the OE carrier for IAD went toes up. The call went out for someone to pick up the slack. Several companies were offered the opportunity and most came up with proposals that would have three to five cities in four to six months time. WestAir came along proposed – I believe it was five cities – by the end of NEXT WEEK! Sold to Tim and Maury out in Fresno.
The operation started and grew rapidly. So rapidly that hiring which had been so-so was now kicked into overdrive. For about six months nearly everyone hired at WestAir was shipped directly to the Washington Front.
Aug. 2, 1990 was the day that everything changed. Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait and set up a pattern of instability that sent fuel prices soaring and profits into the tank. (Sound like a familiar ailment?) By November 1990, WestAir was attempting to furlough the guys they didn’t want around out of seniority – namely the Bandit drivers who were flying the plane they planned to park. You see, they couldn’t afford to let all the Brasilia FOs on the east coast who were junior to the most junior Bandit guys on the west coast go. It would have brought the east coast operation to a screeching halt.
When that didn’t work they started dreaming up other ideas but the damage had been done. During the process of furloughing out of seniority, another nasty little development entered into the mix. NPA, the OE feeder in the Pacific Northwest was folded into WestAir. The reason this mattered was because when they furloughed the Bandit guys the dropped them form the seniority list. Because a general system bid had been triggered by the merger of the NPA and WestAir seniority lists the end result was that when it was all said and done, about 30 or 40 guys simply vanished even though they were still making those 0500 shows in FAT to do two round trips to SNA.
It didn’t take very long to get them back into the list and more or less in the right order but some training decisions had been made in the interim and quite a few people did not get the airplane and seat their proper seniority would hold. This was the source of a number of ALPA grievances and quite a bit of training expense when those grievances were eventually won.
Anyway, along about August 1991, it was clear that WestAir was in a lot of trouble. It was learned later that the paychecks almost bounced several times about then. It was in this climate then, that the sale of ACA to a group headed by Ed Acker was announced. To compact the story, everyone got to take a shot at being where they wanted to end up in a general system bid that was designed to finalize the division and severance of the seniority lists. Guys got screwed there too. A number of them wanted to go to ACA but weren’t allowed to because they filled key seats in the west. They were told that their seniority wouldn’t hold ACA – utter nonsense!
Towards the end of 1991 rumors began to fly about WestAir being up for sale and that Mesa might be the suitor. In short order the rumors were proved and by the end of the first quarter of 1992 Mesa and their union busting policies (and law firm) were in charge. They immediately downsized all existing domiciles and opened “mini-domiciles” in most of the cities WestAir served, thus putting overnight costs on the pilots – they had to pay the rent wherever they ended up. Naturally the lines went into the toilet with the elimination of the overnights. The days were long and the rests reduced almost al the time.
They also parked the six BAe-146s and later the Shorts 360s. Parking the 146s precipitated a flood of backwash through the seniority list as the top 50 or 60 on the list came tumbling down from their lofty perches in the jet. More furloughs that lasted about a month resulted. The reduction in force however, led to breaches in schedule integrity that United couldn’t ignore. On one day something like 40% of all OE flights failed to launch due to lack of crews. Most of these were out of SFO. With the word coming from the big “U” Mesa brought everyone back.
Things got rocky again when Mesa took the Brasilias out of the Northwest and brought them down to California. The crews had to come with them until they could be trained on the J32 – if that’s what they wanted – which they did almost universally. At about the same time the LAX flying, reduced by abandonment of routes was being replaced by dozens of “green hornets” – Mesa Beech 1900Cs – in violation of the WestAir ALPA contract scope and successorship clauses. Soon, Mesa began opening mini-domiciles in WestAir cities.
The writing had been on the wall for a while but this made quite a few start working REALLY hard at getting out. Things ground along for another three years or so and eventually the time came to renew the OE contract and this is when United said enough is enough. WestAir had nothing else to do without the contract and they shut down in 1997.
Hope this hasn't caused any relapses of anyone's post traumatic stress disorder. We were all affected significantly and adversely by the experience of working for and with Mr. Ornstein. Therapy bills should be sent to HIM!
TIS
EAP
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- 141
Good background on the IAD expansion. Though I never had an association to Westair, I always thought they had a great setup on the west coast. Out of all the regionals in the 80's I think Westair had some of the best promise. Looking at it based on some of your recounts, it looks like the ACA startup did more damage to Westair than anything, and unfortunately set it up for a Risley cancer cluster in the early 90's.
TIS
Wing, Nosewheel, Whatever
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2001
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- 366
The ACA startup wasn't really out of line - at the time...
As I noted, the thing that sent the ball rolling downhill was Saddam Hussein invading Kuwait. I admit that the things that were adding up to the recession of 90-91 were vital pieces of the puzzle, but the invasion event itself was what did the damage to the airline industry because of what the resulting political instability in the Middle East did to fuel prices.
Fuel costs prior to that point had been between 35% and 40% of the total cost of running the airline. By the end of the year that had risen, some said, to a figure as high as 60%. I remember one article that claimed that American Airlines alone had lost more money in the three quarters that followed the invasion than the entire airline industry had made in profit in its history!
It was really the timing of the planting the ACA seed that was unfortunate. From a business standpoint it was an opportunity not to be missed but it WAS a gamble and the margins weren't fat enough to get away with it in the end. It was an exciting and fast paced time in which almost anything seemed possible. Having to watch it all simply melt away like snow in a temporary mid-winter thaw was hard to take.
For proof of the concept on ACA just look at them now some 14 years later!
TIS
As I noted, the thing that sent the ball rolling downhill was Saddam Hussein invading Kuwait. I admit that the things that were adding up to the recession of 90-91 were vital pieces of the puzzle, but the invasion event itself was what did the damage to the airline industry because of what the resulting political instability in the Middle East did to fuel prices.
Fuel costs prior to that point had been between 35% and 40% of the total cost of running the airline. By the end of the year that had risen, some said, to a figure as high as 60%. I remember one article that claimed that American Airlines alone had lost more money in the three quarters that followed the invasion than the entire airline industry had made in profit in its history!
It was really the timing of the planting the ACA seed that was unfortunate. From a business standpoint it was an opportunity not to be missed but it WAS a gamble and the margins weren't fat enough to get away with it in the end. It was an exciting and fast paced time in which almost anything seemed possible. Having to watch it all simply melt away like snow in a temporary mid-winter thaw was hard to take.
For proof of the concept on ACA just look at them now some 14 years later!
TIS
embdrvr
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- Posts
- 430
Hey Truckdriver,
Did SkyWest turn you down during an interview? Were you one of the ones that failed training? Sounds like a case of sour grapes. You make a lot of assumptions based on pure speculation. I know guys from both Westair and SunAir.
Can anyone name a merger or acquistion where both pilot groups were happy with the outcome? SkyWest bid successfully on the routes and UA was tired of Risley and Mesa. SkyWest gave a bunch of Westair guys a shot at a job. Some took it. I've met some of them and not one complained about how things turned out. Maybe we should all boycott Southwest because the Morris Air guys got hosed. Everyone withdraw your application at WN. As soon as all of you pull your app out of the stack I'll withdraw mine. Seriously, why aren't we bashing Southwest? After all they're not ALPA and look what happened to the Morris guys.
The Coex deal was different. However SkyWest wasn't the company that parked all the turboprops in the desert. It probably wasn't cost effective for ExJet to reintroduce the EMB so the flying got contracted out. Did anyone there kick and scream when the EMB's got mothballed or were they too busy drooling over the new planes. Oooohhhh wow...look shiny jet...me fly...
Quit trying to attribute all SkyWest flying to the lack of a union. Bottom line is the company puts out a good service. Performance and reliability are very good. SkyWest pilots may fly a handful of 70's for the price of a 50 for the time being but there is no chance in h.ell that they will fly anything larger than a 70 for a long time. And they will likely see a pay increase for the 70. The only question is how much.
Did SkyWest turn you down during an interview? Were you one of the ones that failed training? Sounds like a case of sour grapes. You make a lot of assumptions based on pure speculation. I know guys from both Westair and SunAir.
Can anyone name a merger or acquistion where both pilot groups were happy with the outcome? SkyWest bid successfully on the routes and UA was tired of Risley and Mesa. SkyWest gave a bunch of Westair guys a shot at a job. Some took it. I've met some of them and not one complained about how things turned out. Maybe we should all boycott Southwest because the Morris Air guys got hosed. Everyone withdraw your application at WN. As soon as all of you pull your app out of the stack I'll withdraw mine. Seriously, why aren't we bashing Southwest? After all they're not ALPA and look what happened to the Morris guys.
The Coex deal was different. However SkyWest wasn't the company that parked all the turboprops in the desert. It probably wasn't cost effective for ExJet to reintroduce the EMB so the flying got contracted out. Did anyone there kick and scream when the EMB's got mothballed or were they too busy drooling over the new planes. Oooohhhh wow...look shiny jet...me fly...
Quit trying to attribute all SkyWest flying to the lack of a union. Bottom line is the company puts out a good service. Performance and reliability are very good. SkyWest pilots may fly a handful of 70's for the price of a 50 for the time being but there is no chance in h.ell that they will fly anything larger than a 70 for a long time. And they will likely see a pay increase for the 70. The only question is how much.
Last edited:
Truckdriver
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embdrvr,
No I was never turned down for anything at SKYW. I never even applied or dreamed of applying because they are a non-union carrier that has consistently shown it is in favor of staying non-union. Never wanted to work there, will never want to work there, and the reason I started this post is because I hope I never work for a carrier that has assets thaty SKYW wants. At this point in my career I worry a little about that when listening to Jerry at investor confereneces.
I beleive in unity as a PROFESSION not soley a company. I know that staying non-union may have been better for some as a COMPANY. Unity as a profession is the only thing that will keep this career what it should be. If you want a career as an airline pilot to be a lower-middle class career then that's fine. Without unity that is where it is going. Unity, Unity, Unity, anything less than that will fail US as pilots. And yes, I said US.
No I was never turned down for anything at SKYW. I never even applied or dreamed of applying because they are a non-union carrier that has consistently shown it is in favor of staying non-union. Never wanted to work there, will never want to work there, and the reason I started this post is because I hope I never work for a carrier that has assets thaty SKYW wants. At this point in my career I worry a little about that when listening to Jerry at investor confereneces.
I beleive in unity as a PROFESSION not soley a company. I know that staying non-union may have been better for some as a COMPANY. Unity as a profession is the only thing that will keep this career what it should be. If you want a career as an airline pilot to be a lower-middle class career then that's fine. Without unity that is where it is going. Unity, Unity, Unity, anything less than that will fail US as pilots. And yes, I said US.
Truckdriver
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The only thing changing in this industry is airline managers have finally found a bunch of pilots that will fly large aircraft for low wages. F-100 guys at AMR get $130/hr. You shouldn't be willing to fly a 100 seat aircraft for $100/hr let alone a 159 seat aircraft. I know you don't have any on property but the rates on paper do just as much damage. If you think that the market is determining pay rates on aircraft you are crazy. Airline managers have set up capacity purchase agreements or cost-plus agreements for a reason. That reason is to constantly put downward pressure on labor costs and to put "regionals" into a low-cost bidding war to save "mainline" money. The recent RFP, or whatever they called it, at DCI is a great example. When pilots buy into "the market just won't support those wages" line, they are stupid. As for me, I'll let ALPA set my wages. I trust them more than I trust CEO's these days.strega7 said:
TIS
Wing, Nosewheel, Whatever
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There are two sides to every issue - unions included
You CLEARLY haven't been in this business long enough to understand that for every union protection you receive in your contract you give up something in negotiations for the next one. Or perhaps you do. It's not really for me to divine but the kind of one-sided rhetoric you put forth is due for an extreme makeover.
Now, before you bash me as an anti-unionist, understand that I became an ALPA member in 1990 and remained so as long as they would let me stay - WES went under in quite a while ago. I was vehemently in favor of their activities from the day I walked on to the property there - the climate was ripe for abuse. ALPA fought and WON a grievance filed on my behalf that restored my seniority after it was lost in the NPA general system bid I described earlier. That, in turn, allowed me to be trained in the aircraft that was correct for my seniority - which was worth a bit more money.
Our contract provided pathways of communication between the pilots and the company that were,once established mandated by federal law. In other words, the company HAD to listen. Distinct rules about successorship, training, duy rigs, trip rigs, reductions in force, company paid move when displacement occurred were just a few of the benefits we got from our dues.
But you try asking ANYONE who was a TWA employee where ALPA was for them! They won't sing such a sweet song. Unions aren't for all companies but they will come if the company fails to listen and respond with care when concerns are raised by potential collective bargaining converts.
I will not try to claim that the current market just won't support the wages of yesteryear - it might. But the company paying those wages has got to be profitable to do so. No, what the market won't support is the corporate structure of the companies that people often point the finger of woe at when discussing the declining state of the industry. All you have to do to see proof of this is look at who's making money - three of the four biggest money makers are union shops - UPS, FedEx, and Southwest. JetBlue hasn't got a union yet but they will in time.
I believe it is likely that United will not survive this episode - at least not in its present form. I think American and Delta have a ways to go yet before they're out, despite predictions of doom and gloom everywhere. After all they're not in bankruptcy - yet. I don't believe that any of this has to do exclusively with pilot salaries but what are you going to pay those salaries with if you just spent your last nickel on fuel for your 747? It all has to do with the way these companies opererate and the remendous burden of corporate bureacracy that they must shoulder.
I've been out of the union thing for a few years now and you know what? For me that's a good thing. I could whip out my contract with the best of 'em - even showed managment a thing or two about the English language as I read it to them over the phone when they were trying to extend my duty day.
Went through a negotiation too. Have you done that one yet? Not to be missed, my friend. Not to be missed. Your blood pressure will be 40 points higher ALL THE TIME. What a wonderful benefit your union provides for you! Know what else? They'll provide it every three to five years just so you know they're doing everything they can for you. They have huge reservoirs of venom, rumors, and vitriolic rhetoric stockpiled and ready for use like a weapon of mass destruction at the negotiation table. Sorry, but that's just not what I need after an evening out with the wife at the local Italian joint. They don't manufacture enough Tums for that. The fun of having your life peeled away from reality and turned upside down on that kind of a regularly scheduled basis is just not what I need. Some thrive on it though!
Remember that seniority thing I mentioned earlier? That sure helped out - the extra money and all. Problem was I was held out of seat and type for NINE MONTHS while the grievance ran its course and was owed about $2200.00 in retroactive pay differential (per the contract). The MEC chairman personally helped me understand why I wouldn't be receiving it. "Son," he said, "You got your airplane. Don't you think ALPA has done enough for you?" I guess he was right. What possible good could $2200.00 OF MY OWN MONEY have done me?
Now I know all this sure seems like I'm pretty bitter about unions but the fact is that I'm not. They did get me that seat and I did start making better money on the spot. It did improve my quality of life and it did help me learn what I needed to know to do what I do now. It's just that when I see someone raving in a way that would make Hoffa proud I just know from experience that there's more to the program than union rhetoric and propaganda. I know there can be more to a career in aviation than fumbling through my flight bag looking for that tattered, well worn contract document.
The phrase, "Be careful what you wish because you just might get it," is especially applicable to almost ANY union related matter. It's important to keep in mind that unions are run by politicians of a sort. Politicians have an agenda - ALWAYS. That agenda is not always on your side, whether you realize it or not.
TIS
You CLEARLY haven't been in this business long enough to understand that for every union protection you receive in your contract you give up something in negotiations for the next one. Or perhaps you do. It's not really for me to divine but the kind of one-sided rhetoric you put forth is due for an extreme makeover.
Now, before you bash me as an anti-unionist, understand that I became an ALPA member in 1990 and remained so as long as they would let me stay - WES went under in quite a while ago. I was vehemently in favor of their activities from the day I walked on to the property there - the climate was ripe for abuse. ALPA fought and WON a grievance filed on my behalf that restored my seniority after it was lost in the NPA general system bid I described earlier. That, in turn, allowed me to be trained in the aircraft that was correct for my seniority - which was worth a bit more money.
Our contract provided pathways of communication between the pilots and the company that were,once established mandated by federal law. In other words, the company HAD to listen. Distinct rules about successorship, training, duy rigs, trip rigs, reductions in force, company paid move when displacement occurred were just a few of the benefits we got from our dues.
But you try asking ANYONE who was a TWA employee where ALPA was for them! They won't sing such a sweet song. Unions aren't for all companies but they will come if the company fails to listen and respond with care when concerns are raised by potential collective bargaining converts.
I will not try to claim that the current market just won't support the wages of yesteryear - it might. But the company paying those wages has got to be profitable to do so. No, what the market won't support is the corporate structure of the companies that people often point the finger of woe at when discussing the declining state of the industry. All you have to do to see proof of this is look at who's making money - three of the four biggest money makers are union shops - UPS, FedEx, and Southwest. JetBlue hasn't got a union yet but they will in time.
I believe it is likely that United will not survive this episode - at least not in its present form. I think American and Delta have a ways to go yet before they're out, despite predictions of doom and gloom everywhere. After all they're not in bankruptcy - yet. I don't believe that any of this has to do exclusively with pilot salaries but what are you going to pay those salaries with if you just spent your last nickel on fuel for your 747? It all has to do with the way these companies opererate and the remendous burden of corporate bureacracy that they must shoulder.
I've been out of the union thing for a few years now and you know what? For me that's a good thing. I could whip out my contract with the best of 'em - even showed managment a thing or two about the English language as I read it to them over the phone when they were trying to extend my duty day.
Went through a negotiation too. Have you done that one yet? Not to be missed, my friend. Not to be missed. Your blood pressure will be 40 points higher ALL THE TIME. What a wonderful benefit your union provides for you! Know what else? They'll provide it every three to five years just so you know they're doing everything they can for you. They have huge reservoirs of venom, rumors, and vitriolic rhetoric stockpiled and ready for use like a weapon of mass destruction at the negotiation table. Sorry, but that's just not what I need after an evening out with the wife at the local Italian joint. They don't manufacture enough Tums for that. The fun of having your life peeled away from reality and turned upside down on that kind of a regularly scheduled basis is just not what I need. Some thrive on it though!
Remember that seniority thing I mentioned earlier? That sure helped out - the extra money and all. Problem was I was held out of seat and type for NINE MONTHS while the grievance ran its course and was owed about $2200.00 in retroactive pay differential (per the contract). The MEC chairman personally helped me understand why I wouldn't be receiving it. "Son," he said, "You got your airplane. Don't you think ALPA has done enough for you?" I guess he was right. What possible good could $2200.00 OF MY OWN MONEY have done me?
Now I know all this sure seems like I'm pretty bitter about unions but the fact is that I'm not. They did get me that seat and I did start making better money on the spot. It did improve my quality of life and it did help me learn what I needed to know to do what I do now. It's just that when I see someone raving in a way that would make Hoffa proud I just know from experience that there's more to the program than union rhetoric and propaganda. I know there can be more to a career in aviation than fumbling through my flight bag looking for that tattered, well worn contract document.
The phrase, "Be careful what you wish because you just might get it," is especially applicable to almost ANY union related matter. It's important to keep in mind that unions are run by politicians of a sort. Politicians have an agenda - ALWAYS. That agenda is not always on your side, whether you realize it or not.
TIS
Hey Truckdriver,
US Airways ALPA just offered to "lower the bar" by some 12 %, no doubt Delta will be next. In your infinite wisdom, what do you say to those guys?
It seems you've heard the rumors that SKW is looking to buy someone and you're running scared. In the SunAire buyout, the SunAire guys ended up relatively better seniority than the SKW pilots, (BTW that will not happen again) and Westair was run into the ground by its own management, SKW had nothing to do with that.
's all good.
US Airways ALPA just offered to "lower the bar" by some 12 %, no doubt Delta will be next. In your infinite wisdom, what do you say to those guys?
It seems you've heard the rumors that SKW is looking to buy someone and you're running scared. In the SunAire buyout, the SunAire guys ended up relatively better seniority than the SKW pilots, (BTW that will not happen again) and Westair was run into the ground by its own management, SKW had nothing to do with that.
's all good.
AnimalTale
Well-known member
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- 543
Rogue5
Adult Swim junkie
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- Jul 16, 2002
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- 882
Truckdriver, you seem to have chaged your tune a bit as of late...Truckdriver said:
A search of your previous post with respect to the SkyWest union drive shows some thoughts to be slightly less than cheerleading the union cause:
"If you guys can get what you want as a pilot group without a union, all the more power to ya."
"Unionizing is a VERY serious decision to make and one that should not be taken lightly. Unfortunatley, many peoeple will take it lightly and not realize the impact it will have on their job. I work for an ALPA carrier and see BOTH the good and bad that a union brings to a pilot group. In a perfect world we wouldn't need ALPA and I could spend my 1.95% on aluminum wheels and chrome for my sweet 97 Saturn."
So why the gung-ho attitude now? You seemed before to be more understanding that things may work different here and that that might be a good thing.
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