Wanna see what scabs are like....?

[Boeingman]

I don't know the history of that CAL strike but wouldn't it make the IAM strike more effective if all the other employees showed up for work, forcing the company to pay them, even though there are no working planes to fly?

The company can take on one group, attempt to operate and replace them. Which is exactly what NWA looks like they are trying to do. When everyone walks, then it forces negotiations. Of course it depends on their CBA's and if others have no strike commitments. With your scenario the company could decide to just cease operations, lay off others until a settlement like at COMAIR. These days that would never happen. With the perilous financial state of the airlines like NWA, a lenghty cash flow interuption would be kiss of death.

 

[Tomct]

Boy, mgmnt is smiling all over the world tonight.....!

 

[Paul R. Smith]

but YOU and your ALPA boys are picking up extra flying while your fellow ALPA pilots are furloughed. oh, thats right, you HAVE to fly extra to save the airline....

Are you serious?
Each union rep gets to bid and be awarded a line like all the other line pilots. While they are not flying the line and doing union bizness they are paid for their line anyway...otherwise no one would want to be in the union. What the union reps do is fly back their duties essentially they would be paid if they were not flying anyway so the only incentive to fly is payback the pilots who pay for their service; the pilots of his/her mec.

If you have no idea how a pilot's union works then say nothing about it.

There are alot of people (not neccessarily pilots) on this forum that trash talk ALPA and to me your all fools. Flame away you anti-union hacks!!!

 

[SUNDOWN]

Sundown,

You nailed it on the head, my pay is pathetic for flying a modern 50 seat jet, by the way $66.40/hr 6 yr CA. Why? Because bottomfeeders (read Mesa/CHQ) forced concessions on the reputable carriers, and because of this new industry average the NMB never would have released us to strike so we had to settle for much less. By the way, for retirement, I get a 9% match on 5% contributions, better than AWA, SWA, UAIR, and beloved Jetblue. FOs still make slave wages, see reason above. What's sick is that in a year we (XJT) will pass up Comair and by default be the industry leaders.

I guess you are misreading me. I wish us all better paychecks and retirements. With fuel prices the way they are and all of us barely keping our head above water, how do you expect a five year old company with less than 80 a/c to set industry rates. If we asked we would recieve the same reasons you stated above. Right now B6 is trying to establish ourself ( see SWA 20 years ago). For most us it is a good gamble. I am curious as to how we ( most of us here under 3 years ) are suppose to be in a position to demand a pay raise. First year F/O's here make more than a good percentage of RJ captains. Remember the 190 is a choice and you will be given the opportunity to upgrade soon. I invite you to actually research the company and make an informed descision about us. You may even apply. Sure, we could make some positive changes and I am sure we will in time.


Oh Yeah..................GENERAL LOOSEN UP

Take One day and only say nice nice things....Plus you gotta be stoaked. The Dukes of Hazzard is coming to the big screen. That should get you off the computer for a little while at least. Who is gonna play Cooter.

 

[Dizel8]

Don't think he was talking about the actual ALPA reps, but the pilots who continues to fly overtime, while their fellow pilots are on furlough.

 

[Paul R. Smith]

Don't think he was talking about the actual ALPA reps, but the pilots who continues to fly overtime, while their fellow pilots are on furlough.

He means the whole open time scam? Yeah thats greddy a-holes.

Sh*t

Open mouth insert foot.

sorry jbpct

 

[TrimixDeepDiver]

Nothing new under the soon. The S-I-T (scab in training) claims that he has a wife and kids to support. Don't we all!!

The irony of this idiot is that if he does scab he will be putting his family in harms way. The reprocussions to his car,house,etc will be many. I can remeber the mechanic strikes of the 80's and many scabs got hurt and some killed. I even remember my dad telling me a story about a scab that got his house burned down and he lost everything....

 

[Donsa320]

The general lack of understanding of the Railway Labor Act and Labor laws in general amazes me.

Everbody walk-out to support a different union's strike action? You can't do it. Secondary boycott prohibited by Taft-Hartley. The company would have an injunction in minutes. If you want to go to jail and/or have your union pay huge fines just disregard the court. Remember American a few years ago.

When ALPA supported the Eastern mechanics and Lorenzo did not get an injunction against them, you knew that was what Lorenzo wanted...get the pilots off the property.

Generally with the RLA and No strike clauses in most ALPA contracts plus Taft- Hartley any supportive action has to be carefully crafted. I would limit the brave talk meanwhile.

~DC

 

[GogglesPisano]

I've always heard that NWA has historically had some of the worst labor-management relations.

 

[General Lee]

I guess you are misreading me. I wish us all better paychecks and retirements. With fuel prices the way they are and all of us barely keping our head above water, how do you expect a five year old company with less than 80 a/c to set industry rates. If we asked we would recieve the same reasons you stated above. Right now B6 is trying to establish ourself ( see SWA 20 years ago). For most us it is a good gamble. I am curious as to how we ( most of us here under 3 years ) are suppose to be in a position to demand a pay raise. First year F/O's here make more than a good percentage of RJ captains. Remember the 190 is a choice and you will be given the opportunity to upgrade soon. I invite you to actually research the company and make an informed descision about us. You may even apply. Sure, we could make some positive changes and I am sure we will in time.


Oh Yeah..................GENERAL LOOSEN UP

Take One day and only say nice nice things....Plus you gotta be stoaked. The Dukes of Hazzard is coming to the big screen. That should get you off the computer for a little while at least. Who is gonna play Cooter.

I hope you're right. I never said Jetblue was a bad company to work for, it's just the mandatory pay rates given to you by your company pretty much affect every regional pilot out there in future negotiations. The management negotiators will point out that Jetblue 100 seat pilots make XX amount per hour, and to compete they will have to offer XX. It may not be your fault, but it will affect everyone else behind you. Now, trying to get the transcon turns allowed is your fault, and I hope calmer heads prevail and that is not allowed, since one leg on the 757 (faster than the bus) from JFK to LAX seems to take an eternity and I am tired by the time I get there. Going back to JFK would be extremely tiring, and throw bad weather in NY into the mix, and you are asking for problems. If you can fix those two problems, then I think you are golden.


As far as the Dukes of Hazzard movie, I am looking forward to it. I don't know who will play cooter? All I have seen in the ads are Bo, Luke, Daisy (hot), and Boss Hogg played by Burt Reynolds. When is that coming out again?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

$89 a hour for a 12 year Captain on a new 100 seater at Jetblue..... But wait, the current Jetblue guys will stay on the bus and really don't care what future newhires make---they already "have it made........on the bus......" Who cares, right?


Bye Bye--General Lee

In two-three years I'd like to revisit this pay scale... If it is still where it is at for the E-190 then, I'll paint my garage in the Stars and Bars. I started here when the A-320 pay scale was $78/hr-- where was the uproar then? Ours is the only 32% pay raise still in effect!

 

[LearLove]

What about this?

(Note: before I ask this, of course I don't agree with what these guys and NWA are doing and hope myself and none of us are ever in this position)

What if thoes guys go out there to PHX for the 3 or so weeks of paid training get some training and pay funded by NWA then if or when the NWA mechanics go on strike or job action none or very few of the "PHX trained" guys show up? So basically they get some pay and free training but cop out when its time to cross. Are they still scabs?

_____________

Put it this way. Say I'm furloughed from U/MDA and JO starts some alter ego operation with say 757's where he needs to type pilots and I get hired. I go out there for say 2 months of paid training get a type then quit before I hit IOE. Am I a scab?

I would think the union or union members may actually see this as good because you just took said operator for 20,000 polus in training and pay

(Lets just say for arguements sake that there are no such things as training contracts/agreements, so you can blow out at any time with no obligation).

Just a hypethetical question, again see note above. What do you guys think?

 

[Captain Overs]

Hey Blown by you,

Who's bringing who down? Last I checked your airline was trying to get around the 8 hour rule so you can fly over 8 hour trans-cons. Think before you cast stones!

 

[canyonblue]

By the way, for retirement, I get a 9% match on 5% contributions, better than AWA, SWA, UAIR, and beloved Jetblue.

Better check your plan doughboy, you're not better than Southwest.

 

[humveedriver]

90 bucks an hour for a 12 year CPT seems like a pretty good argument to start a union at JetBlue...if I had a dog in that fight. Any rumblings from the JetBlue guys/gals on that issue? Your thoughts on the pay...need for a union at JetBlue?

 

[SWA tech]

It's sad to see scabs all scabs will bring down everyones pay.

 

[oldxfr8dog]

What if thoes guys go out there to PHX for the 3 or so weeks of paid training get some training and pay funded by NWA then if or when the NWA mechanics go on strike or job action none or very few of the "PHX trained" guys show up? So basically they get some pay and free training but cop out when its time to cross. Are they still scabs?

_____________

Put it this way. Say I'm furloughed from U/MDA and JO starts some alter ego operation with say 757's where he needs to type pilots and I get hired. I go out there for say 2 months of paid training get a type then quit before I hit IOE. Am I a scab?

My friend, if you lay down with dogs, you're gonna get fleas...

On a totally different topic, I went home with a dog once and she gave me crabs...!

 

[wahoo250]

My friend, if you lay down with dogs, you're gonna get fleas...

On a totally different topic, I went home with a dog once and she gave me crabs...!

funny...i like it

 

[Dizel8]

Deleted by me

 

[FlyinScotsman]

"Claims that he has a wife and kids to support" Same response I get from Jet Blue and other LCC XCM's when I ask them why they are willing to work for low wages and such lousy work rules. And it amazes me they have no idea what the work rules and quality of life is at a major. Another form of outsourcing of jobs.

Didn't NWA pilots, FA's use the same excuse "kids to feed" as too why they crossed the Mechs picket lines. They don't want risk their jobs to help the Mechs out, because the Mechs union was asking for too much or whatever their reason. Boils down we all have families to feed, while I don't agree with what the scabs are doing don't be too quick to say "I would never do that".

 

[Deli Guy]

Hey FlyinScotsman,
No, This had nothing to do with feeding the kids. It was because AMFA leadership was on drugs, and had a plan of action dreamed up by rookies, and did not care if their insane plan drug down the other employee unions or not. ALPA warned them we were not on board. NWA Alpa has been putting NWA mgmnt in its place since 1929. Give them their turn before you reduce NWA pilots to excuse makers.

don't be too quick to say "I would never do that".

 

[WillowRunVortex]

NWA Alpa has been putting NWA mgmnt in its place since 1929. Give them their turn before you reduce NWA pilots to excuse makers.

How's it going Deli,

What's the good word over there? Not hearing good things on my end. Was told that it would take a "miracle" for ALPA to get something hammered out in writing with management by the Oct deadline. Also hear that management wants almost the same deal from the FA's that it wanted from the mechanics. Not good. You take away Asia flying from the senior momma's and you watch how fast those girls strike. Have any good "Smurf" stories?

 

[FlyinScotsman]

Hey FlyinScotsman,
No, This had nothing to do with feeding the kids. It was because AMFA leadership was on drugs, and had a plan of action dreamed up by rookies, and did not care if their insane plan drug down the other employee unions or not. ALPA warned them we were not on board. NWA Alpa has been putting NWA mgmnt in its place since 1929. Give them their turn before you reduce NWA pilots to excuse makers.

don't be too quick to say "I would never do that".

I am waiting to see what NWA ALPA is going to do. I understand they didn't sign to what AMFA leadership wanted to do, but I also see it as they won't support the strike to preserve thier jobs for the time being. I also know it is a little more complicated than that and the pilots are in for a fight for their wages and bennies when NWA goes into BK. Which will happen before Oct.

 

[banger]

$89 a hour for a 12 year Captain on a new 100 seater at Jetblue..... But wait, the current Jetblue guys will stay on the bus and really don't care what future newhires make---they already "have it made........on the bus......" Who cares, right?


Bye Bye--General Lee

General
As a former Delta pilot and now furloughee I used to respect and look forward to your posts. You stayed above some of the petty name calling and stuck to facts and defended your profession. That doesn't seem to come through in your posts lately. I shouldn't blame you. Maybe nobody can read this stuff day after day and remain objective and fair.

 

[banger]

90 bucks an hour for a 12 year CPT seems like a pretty good argument to start a union at JetBlue...if I had a dog in that fight. Any rumblings from the JetBlue guys/gals on that issue? Your thoughts on the pay...need for a union at JetBlue?

Yes as a matter of fact, All the jetblue 12 year 190 Captains have formed their own union and are preparing for a Strike!

 

[Deli Guy]

Hey Willow Run and FlyinScotsman,
It is really getting tight on campus. I am not sure what a "smurf story" is though. I think there is a good possibility the FA's might flex their muscles and shut down the airline and we may declare BK based on that. Good for them. They have the power, so they can use it as they see fit. Hopefully ALPA and the PFAA are coordinating an effort together. Alpa repeatedly echoes this mantra.
My take is that Alpa is signaling that it realizes there are some advantages to going into BK court because it may let us get rid of this management team. If the FA's put us there prior to Oct, I am fine with that. I am pretty junior and recognise that ALPA leans toward the senior guys.
I think mgmt would like to make the FA job a "rapid turnover" job where they suck in young kids and then the kids leave after 5 or 6 years when the glamor wears off. I think the FA's need to stick together and push back with management but I think they had better get off the "no pay cuts" theme and move towards a more reasonable bargaining position. If the FA's strike with a reasonable platform (not like AMFA'S) the pilots would have to strike for their own good. If NW mgmt brings it that far, I think they will be proved to be wrong like 98. That is just the way I see it now. That may change with a new input tomorrow.

 

[Redmeat]

Doesn't look good for staying out of BK.

 

[WillowRunVortex]

Hey Willow Run and FlyinScotsman,
It is really getting tight on campus. I am not sure what a "smurf story" is though.

I was told that the scab mechanics are being refered to as "smurfs" due to their "special" shirts that they are forced to wear. I was also informed over the holiday that these guys are the biggest F__K-UP's, that you couldn't make up some of the sh1it these guys are trying to pull off.

 

[Diesel-9]

I'm sure it is a mixed bag. I've flown two trips and the few write ups I had were handled correctly. Seen many things repaired on R.O.N. aircraft and MEL's cleared and those items worked fine. At least that is what the F/O told me. Weak area was logbook paperwork the first few days.

 

[Deli Guy]

Hey WRV + Diesel 9,
OK I get the smurf thing now. That is a ridiculous color they are wearing! I am in the middle of a 3day /2 day. I hate to say this, but the books have been clean, the walk arounds show good jets, and the smurfs have stayed out of my "fart zone". I really think the hurricane has punched management in the gut. I think it really puts us close to BK. I think that there was a chance pre hurricane but now there is very little chance.