USAPA wants $'s for marksman........

[waveflyer]

it's a good point that if USAPA had a fund to help the upcoming furloughs- guys would be a lot more willing to help a captain who should be better off financially than this.

 

[vetrider]

When did we become so jaded and bitter that we can't set aside the BS for one moment and help out a fellow human being? How about just this one time we forgive and forget and help a guy out? Does it really matter that he's East or West? Rise above. Turn the other cheek. Whatever, but let it go or else it's gonna kill your own spirit. You can still fight for seniority and scope and fences, but you don't have to lose your humanity in the process.

Ordinarliy I'd agree with what you just wrote. However, when this benevolet association goes after 18 of my brothers for seven figures of damages in a trumped up bs lawsuit, it tends to make me a little bitter and jaded.

And then when the judge throws out said lawsuit, they appeal it, stating that they are interested in the damages available to them under the rico statutes. Give me a break.

These cretins have a lot of gall sending that plea to west pilots. Perhaps if they hadn't wasted all those hundreds of thousands on lawsuits and an ad harming the mouth that feeds them they'd have enough to slip old Jim some money.

 

[vetrider]

So if usapa succeeds in bankrupting 18 individual west pilots for high crimes such as web board posts will they send out and appeal for benevolence on their behalf?

 

[Networ-King]

Unless you were there or are a party to the investigation you don't know what exactly happened. I'm as in the dark as the rest of you. I know this much though. CA Langenhahn is not personally responsible for Nicalau's decision. CA Langenhan is not personally resonsible for USAPA. CA Langenhan isn't personally responsible for all the hate and discontent between East & West. Last but not least he still hasn't had his day in court and the process isn't finished.

I have no idea whether or not he's an idiot He is. or just made a bad decision He did. Is he guilty of unsafe behavior He is or a victim of flawed procedure I didn't shoot a hole in the side of my airplane last time I carried my weapon with said "flawed procedures"? Or both No... its his fault? I'm not asking anybody to donate. I am asking some of you to consider that maybe you've let your hatred of East vs West go too far. The whole USAPA/Nicalau/East vs West deal is a train wreck. That doesn't justfy dumping all your anger upon one relatively obscure individual. I can understand someone deciding not to donate because they had concerns about his actions relative to FFDO procedure. That is a rational decision. Not contributing solely because he's an Eastie is what I find disturbing. If he needed a kidney would you refuse just because he's an Eastie? That's an extreme analogy, but the principle is the same.

Its guys like this that waste the union funds because of their stupidity or their actions. Been at enough airlines to see enough of these kind of pilots do the dumbest sh!t and get caught and expect the union to save their a$$e$. I fully stand shoulder to shoulder with my union brothers and sisters, but there is nothing that can be written in any contract that can support stupidity and or lack of common sense.

Oh and by the way.... while doing the recurrent FFDO course they briefed us on exactly what this guy did. He's lucky hes not in jail for endangering the lives of his passengers and or his crew. If you ask me he got off easy......

 

[Caveman]

I agree that USAPA has a lot of nerve forwarding this to the Westies. Either you decide to donate or you don't. Just don't let anger and resentment make the choice for you. It's either a worthy cause or it isn't.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Caveman.

It isn't. But if you feel that strongly about it, feel free to donate. As a matter of fact,here's the address you can send your check to:

"Captain" James Langenhahn Fund
C/O "Captain" Elwood Menear (a piece of work in his own right)
PO Box 62
Hummelston PA 17036
Checks payable to "Usapa"
..... and hope that it gets to it's intended recipient.
Go get 'em Marine !!


PHXFLYR

 

[waveflyer]

Now that we've figured out that anyone can donate or not....

HOW ABOUT THAT FURLOUGH FUND?

SEEMS LIKE A MORE IMPORTANT ISSUE TO BE TALKING ABOUT.

 

[Dan Roman]

Kind of pathetic regardless of how you feel about this guy. Fact is, if they were still in ALPA he would have all the resources he needs at his disposal. Sad that as a USAPA pilot they have to resort to panhandling.

 

[Poahi]

While I sympathize with his situation, I have to ask, if they only need to get him through the end of the year and he's worked for Airways 24 years, where did all the money go?

 

[MK82Man]

Caveman --

I can’t speak for every dude out West, but I’m certain almost all of us are empathetic to Capt Jim Langenhahn’s plight. But it stops there. We feel for the guy, but most of us strongly believe that he jeopardized the reputation of our airline by his conduct. So we are sympathetic to his plight and feel for him, but that is about it. At some point personal responsibility sets in.

Now USAPA asks us to help him. What is the USAPA doing to help the 175 mainline AWA guys being furloughed this Fall? – ZERO. What are they doing to help the 125 “new-hire” furloughs out East? – ZERO. So you see, it re-enforces the pattern of behavior that USAPA exists only to help the one’s they want to help. Old time East pilots. None of the East Coast furloughee recalls (those who were on the street in May 05 when the merger was announced) will be furloughed this Fall. USAPA is ok with that because it keeps old legacy US Air pilots employed while they attrit the legacy AWA pilots. If USAPA hadn’t run the USA Today Ad claiming the company was abusing Captain’s Authority (so laughable) they would have had $100K to help out Capt Jim. And now USAPA asks me to cough up money to help Capt Jim when I’m being furloughed this Fall, while some East Coast guy who didn’t have a job at the company when the merger was announced, gets to keep his job – YGTBSM.

Next week, USAPA will begin Section 29 proceedings against over 1000 AWA pilots who have refused to pay dues to USAPA. There hasn’t been a single road show by USAPA to either West domicile since they were elected the CBA in April … and they want our help? I’ll tell you what they want; they want our money so they can further disenfranchise us. Capt Langenhahn is caught in the middle. As long as USAPA exists and the East won’t live up to the binding arbitration they agreed to, the house will be divided and USAPA can best decide where to allocate the scarce resources. Fundraisers for a guy who broke the rules and endangered the safety of his passengers and the reputation of the airline will be poorly received out West. The chickens are indeed coming home to roost and it is sad that so many East pilots were blinded by rage against ALPA and voted for USAPA. Unfortunately there will be many more pilots and families damaged as the months drag on. Good luck to Capt Jim. The sooner the East pilots wake up to the nightmare USAPA has created for all of us, the better. Me and 299 other soon to be furloughed dudes would to get back to work in 2009.

 

[Colonel Savage]

"Next week, USAPA will begin Section 29 proceedings against over 1000 AWA pilots who have refused to pay dues to USAPA."

Why only 1000? Did 800 pay their dues?

 

[eatme]

Politics aside, anyone proficient with a gun care to chime in on this. From what I read about this incident, it sounds like negligence, pure and simple. If this is FFDO SOP, you can have it.

 

[Herkdrv]

Its guys like this that waste the union funds because of their stupidity or their actions. Been at enough airlines to see enough of these kind of pilots do the dumbest sh!t and get caught and expect the union to save their a$$e$. I fully stand shoulder to shoulder with my union brothers and sisters, but there is nothing that can be written in any contract that can support stupidity and or lack of common sense.

Oh and by the way.... while doing the recurrent FFDO course they briefed us on exactly what this guy did. He's lucky hes not in jail for endangering the lives of his passengers and or his crew. If you ask me he got off easy......

Can you provide further details?

 

[PCL_128]

CA Langenhan is not personally resonsible for USAPA.

Actually, if he voted for uSAPa, as 90% of the Eastholes did, then he's most certainly responsible for his own lack of adequate representation at the moment. I hope he sees the irony.

 

[m80drvr]

Politics aside, anyone proficient with a gun care to chime in on this. From what I read about this incident, it sounds like negligence, pure and simple. If this is FFDO SOP, you can have it.

Yup

I shoot more than most. I shoot some local competitions in my area. Nd's (negligent discharges) occur....alot. (not in competitions though. They are very structured and safe)Do some searching on the web. Hell, Utube has videos of them. BUT........ to blame any ND on the firearm or the holster is just plain stupid. The FFDO program has SOPs JUST LIKE THE AIRLINES. If you follow the SOPs you will NOT shoot an innocent airbus. If you make up your own procedures than you will, at some point, shoot an airplane or a person.

We have all heard of the term "get home-itus", If you rush, and are careless of a firearm you will have an ND. Hopefully you don't shoot a person.

Again I shoot alot. I'm not an expert but I am experienced in the shooting sports, and gun handling.


Everyone screws up in life, it's humn nature, but to screw up with a firearm can be deadly.

MD