UNITED changing name to United Express

[EMB170Pilot]

Keep in mind your gain is always someone elses loss. You may be the next one to lose how will you feel?

I do not see this happening at RAH.

Soooooo bring on the 170s/175s/190s!!!

 

[motch]

If a mainline/Legacy carrier parks mainline aircraft and furloughs pilots WHILE they grow the express carriers to replace that mainline flying, then those new aircraft at the express carrier should be crewed by some sort of furloughed pilot ratio.

It is not taking jobs away from the regional carrier if it is new aircraft that they are crewing.

At the same time, it behooves the regional feeders to work with mainline to ensure mainline doesn't go out of business.

As a former regional Capt who is now at a Major, there exsists the possibility that I could be furloughed in the fall. I personally don't think it will happen, just posturing from the company... but if it does, and we park 737's while growing Q400 operations then some sort of agreement has to be worked out between the management of the 2 companies and the pilots of the 2 companies!


Always
Motch

 

[spitfire1500]

As a former regional Capt who is now at a Major, there exsists the possibility that I could be furloughed in the fall. I personally don't think it will happen, just posturing from the company... but if it does, and we park 737's while growing Q400 operations then some sort of agreement has to be worked out between the management of the 2 companies and the pilots of the 2 companies!

Yea right.... since when has Mgt asked the pilots "How should we do this?"

 

[JoeMerchant]

If a mainline/Legacy carrier parks mainline aircraft and furloughs pilots WHILE they grow the express carriers to replace that mainline flying, then those new aircraft at the express carrier should be crewed by some sort of furloughed pilot ratio.

It is not taking jobs away from the regional carrier if it is new aircraft that they are crewing.

At the same time, it behooves the regional feeders to work with mainline to ensure mainline doesn't go out of business.

As a former regional Capt who is now at a Major, there exsists the possibility that I could be furloughed in the fall. I personally don't think it will happen, just posturing from the company... but if it does, and we park 737's while growing Q400 operations then some sort of agreement has to be worked out between the management of the 2 companies and the pilots of the 2 companies!


Always
Motch

If the planes are put on the regional certificate, then those jobs belong to the regional group....Mainline pilots aren't entitled to superseniority at the regionals when the going gets tough.....Just like regional pilots aren't entitled to mainline jobs when the times are good.....

Is this the best system? NO.....But it is the system WE created.....If you want to negotiate....then let's negotiate some quids....otherwise apply and take your spot at the bottom of the list.....

 

[Taildraggaah]

As a former regional Capt who is now at a Major, there exsists the possibility that I could be furloughed in the fall. I personally don't think it will happen, just posturing from the company... but if it does, and we park 737's while growing Q400 operations then some sort of agreement has to be worked out between the management of the 2 companies and the pilots of the 2 companies!


Always
Motch

So let me see if I have this logic straight. You are entitled to a job with a subcontractor because the company you work for has a contract with said subcontractor?

So where does this stop? If a CSR gets laid off, is it mandatory for the catering sub to give them jobs? You chose to leave for "greener pastures", get over yourself and your sense of entitlement...

Mainline pilots sometime forget that they played a part in this situation. By allowing bigger and bigger equipment to be subcontracted to other pilot groups, where did you think this was going to wind up? Bottom line short term benefit equalled long term pain...

 

[pipe]

Possibly true, but irrelevant nonetheless.

Your management (with permission from your pilot group, presumably) decided to farm Express flying out to OTHER airlines under a CONTRACTUAL arrangement. Unless your pilot group has a CONTRACTUAL arrangement with that OTHER airline, you have no more right to those seats than they do to yours. And no, it makes no difference who leased the airplanes or buys the gas or books the tickets.

Express carriers are CONTRACTORS to your management. Is it a good arrangement? I don't think so, but that's the situation. You want to dictate terms to another corporation, it'll probably cost you a lot more than you're willing to spend at the negotiating table.

It's pretty simple really. United's head crook just has to be convinced that without providing these folks seats, the UAL pilots will scuttle the ship.

He then goes to the head crooks/prostitutes at the regionals and says - "whichever one of you sluts wants the contract, you're gonna have to give us captain seats as a condition of the contract".

Any number of small-time RJ CEO crooks will jump on this deal.

The operative point here is that the UA pilots gotta convince Uncle Glenn that they'll burn it down otherwise -- a task they've not been up to thus far.

PIPE

 

[lookin4better]

I do not see this happening at RAH.

Soooooo bring on the 170s/175s/190s!!!

more regional pilots who will salivate at more e-jets and flying.....but at the severe expense of mainline pilots and their jobs....sad but very true

and these same regional pilots will scream bloody murder if another regional 'steals' their rightfullly earned flying....completely dumbfounding.

 

[Sonny Crockett]

more regional pilots who will salivate at more e-jets and flying.....but at the severe expense of mainline pilots and their jobs....sad but very true

and these same regional pilots will scream bloody murder if another regional 'steals' their rightfullly earned flying....completely dumbfounding.

EXCELLENT POST!

Sad but true, however I feel this time around if UAL does furlough (pretty sure we will but still an if) I will FIGHT hand and fist to secure LEFT seat jobs for our furloughed bubba's. We already have movement in that direction underway,

 

[contrail67]

If a mainline/Legacy carrier parks mainline aircraft and furloughs pilots WHILE they grow the express carriers to replace that mainline flying, then those new aircraft at the express carrier should be crewed by some sort of furloughed pilot ratio.

It is not taking jobs away from the regional carrier if it is new aircraft that they are crewing.

At the same time, it behooves the regional feeders to work with mainline to ensure mainline doesn't go out of business.

As a former regional Capt who is now at a Major, there exsists the possibility that I could be furloughed in the fall. I personally don't think it will happen, just posturing from the company... but if it does, and we park 737's while growing Q400 operations then some sort of agreement has to be worked out between the management of the 2 companies and the pilots of the 2 companies!


Always
Motch

Posturing for what?

If it is about 70plus seaters...those will be flown by mainline....IE 90-100 seat jet market...

Decreasing block hours and buyouts are coming. This will have a large impact (decrease) of any furloughs. Also in the announcement, it also stated that lease obligations will be addressed. Look for renegotiated leases on the 737...this may have alot to do with all of this.

 

[ReverseSensing]

It's pretty simple really. United's head crook just has to be convinced that without providing these folks seats, the UAL pilots will scuttle the ship.

He then goes to the head crooks/prostitutes at the regionals and says - "whichever one of you sluts wants the contract, you're gonna have to give us captain seats as a condition of the contract".

Any number of small-time RJ CEO crooks will jump on this deal.

The operative point here is that the UA pilots gotta convince Uncle Glenn that they'll burn it down otherwise -- a task they've not been up to thus far.

PIPE

Fine. Negotiate at will. See what happens. My point, as has been echoed by others, is that mainline pilots aren't entitled to regional seats anymore than regional pilots are entitled to mainline seats unless it has been negotiated between the managements and between each management and its pilot group.

Your negotiating tactic is to use threats of burning the fokker down to get the regional CEO to agree to your demands. Problem is, if it's a union regional carrier, the regional CEO still has to negotiate something like that with his pilot group. If my CEO came to me with a threat like that from mainline, I'd have to see what -- besides survival -- was in it for my pilot group. If it wasn't enough, I'd want to tell him to pound sand and call your bluff, because I think there's a limit to how much coercion we should tolerate. At some point, I'd say "let 'em burn it down -- we're taking a stand here."

If a guy like Motch thinks he's gonna take my Q400 seat without a fight and without negotiating, when I've never had the opportunity to take his 737 seat, he's crazy.

 

[jonjuan]

The operative point here is that the UA pilots gotta convince Uncle Glenn that they'll burn it down otherwise -- a task they've not been up to thus far.

PIPE

Why would the top 80% of the list risk everything to ensure the 20% of furloughees have jobs? What's in it for them? I am sure the over age 60 crowd wil be all over it.
Seems to me the regional pilots have less to lose and would be more apt to burn it down.

 

[lookin4better]

So if I resign after 8 years and go to any airline, (SWA UPS FDX Emirates AAL UAL USAir you name it) I get to go back to a captain position at my previous carrier in the event the airline I chose furloughs me. Must be nice!!!

These guys took the chance to go to another airline. No one forced them to.

Getting furloughed is one thing....however getting furloughed because your company is contracting the flying out to the lowest or lower bidder....totally different. If those planes that get more flying have United colors on them, and are the reason the UA pilots are getting laid off.....they should get dibs on the LEFT SEAT.....the only reason your flying that RJ around is because of mainline....its not your flying, it belongs to United.

 

[lookin4better]

EXCELLENT POST!

Sad but true, however I feel this time around if UAL does furlough (pretty sure we will but still an if) I will FIGHT hand and fist to secure LEFT seat jobs for our furloughed bubba's. We already have movement in that direction underway,

Hope it works out for you Sonny! Its not going to kill anyone to wait a few more years to upgrade at their regional.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Here comes more Jets For Jobs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

In the end though I was told it feels more like Jets 4 BloJobs.

 

[jonjuan]

In the end though I was told it feels more like Jets 4 BloJobs.

No kidding-of course, who's giving and who's getting..........?