United career progression

[ferlo]

Way to add to the conversation, tool.

Why put your head in the sand? It doesn't matter which airline you go to, your career will progress until the bottom falls out. It WILL eventually happen...furlough, BK, huge paycuts, pension stolen, merger fiasco, medical issues...whatever. Perhaps the box carriers will provide some longer term cover, but something bad is always down the road. It's a fact that everybody should understand with certainty before they sign up for this "profession".

 

[IronCityBlue]

Is scope restoration a major topic at UAL and other legacy airlines currently going for new contracts? CAL has 50 seat and under jets only, and AA is mentioning 100% scope, NWA just drew a fresh "line in the sand" with Compass so we know where they stand. What is the goal at UAL and DAL regarding scope? Is the continued outsourcing of 70-76 installed seats (in some cases 90 seat certified) acceptable for the next contract? Will more be sold for a "bargaining credit" for something else?

 

[Hair-on-Fire]

Way to add to the conversation, tool.

As somone who was furloughed from UAL for 5+ years, all I can say is: you've got a lot to learn, tool.

 

[contrail67]

So you know the future now? Back to the thread... Other things to consider if it matters to you, PIC type rating on the aircraft you are assigned to....16% of your wages go into a retirement fund paid for by the company...not what it was, but will hopefully be improved upon, and we are getting work rules back before negotiations. Hopefully things will continue to move forward. Hiring 250 by June of '08...then a break over the summer then resume hiring in the fall again...this is from the New Hire HR rep.

 

[ferlo]

So you know the future now?

Yes, United will either furlough again, or be chopped up in a merger...resulting in more furloughs. Check back in 24 months and see if I'm right.

 

[ualdriver]

Is scope restoration a major topic at UAL and other legacy airlines currently going for new contracts? CAL has 50 seat and under jets only, and AA is mentioning 100% scope, NWA just drew a fresh "line in the sand" with Compass so we know where they stand. What is the goal at UAL and DAL regarding scope? Is the continued outsourcing of 70-76 installed seats (in some cases 90 seat certified) acceptable for the next contract? Will more be sold for a "bargaining credit" for something else?

The company can't oursouce anthing over 70 seats (and I think over a certain weight, I don't recall), and under our current scope the company isn't even close to the number of outsourced RJ's they could have right now. Will it be sold for "bargaining credit" for something else? Sure, theoretically anything can be sold for "bargaining credit." Will it? Doubtful. I would expect a tightening on scope unless there's a bankruptcy judge involved.

As far as any future furloughs and a merger go, personally I doubt there will be any furloughs if there is a merger with UAL UNLESS the merger is combined with some sort of act of God (deep recession, terrorist attack, $200 oil, etc., etc.). I think our CEO wants a merger to happen and I think they know that an unhappy pilot group can be the spoiler of such an integration. I suspect that if any CEO says "merger" and "furloughs" in the same breath that all hell will break loose in our pilot ranks making our little Christmas debacle look like a picnic. Just my opinion.

 

[pipe]

The pilots didn't cause the "little Christmas debacle" - bad management did.

PIPE

 

[contrail67]

The company can't oursouce anthing over 70 seats (and I think over a certain weight, I don't recall), and under our current scope the company isn't even close to the number of outsourced RJ's they could have right now. Will it be sold for "bargaining credit" for something else? Sure, theoretically anything can be sold for "bargaining credit." Will it? Doubtful. I would expect a tightening on scope unless there's a bankruptcy judge involved.

As far as any future furloughs and a merger go, personally I doubt there will be any furloughs if there is a merger with UAL UNLESS the merger is combined with some sort of act of God (deep recession, terrorist attack, $200 oil, etc., etc.). I think our CEO wants a merger to happen and I think they know that an unhappy pilot group can be the spoiler of such an integration. I suspect that if any CEO says "merger" and "furloughs" in the same breath that all hell will break loose in our pilot ranks making our little Christmas debacle look like a picnic. Just my opinion.

UAL driver, Can you give the details of what all was given back to the 320/300 crews in the last agreement about 1 week ago concerning work rules,min day, line guarentee, ect...thanks.

 

[ualdriver]

The pilots didn't cause the "little Christmas debacle" - bad management did.

PIPE

Yeah, I'll definitely give you that. Yup, we're properly staffed Glenn!

I think some pilots, like myself, could have gone way out of their way to "help out" and soften the blow, but as individuals chose not to in order to express our displeasure with our management team. I personally think it is important for our management team to realize that as pilots, we can be happy and save gas and help them through the rough patches, but if we're not happy, we can be in full compliance with the Railway Labor Act and still bring the operation to a halt by simply only doing our jobs and nothing more. I think that message has been sent and understood, hence my belief (maybe naive, maybe not) that there will likely be no furloughs due to soley a merger.

 

[aa30]

Thanks for all the info. I appreciate both sides. Right now I am in the middle of the interviewing process. And, with any luck, I'll have a decision to make. I am stuck where I live, and it's not a domicile, so I'd be commuting. Work rules and a better contract would sure make the commute that much easier. My concern is ofcourse the possibility of a merger leading to a furlough; but, like I've heard many, many times (and told my wife myself) you just never know if you made the right choice until it's time to retire.

Thanks again for the info.