UAL Merger Comte Msg

[dcfu69]

What are the opinions about scope? Do you guys think CAL scope will remain or will UAL? I hope CAL scope stays with the merger

 

[Deerkiller]

What are the opinions about scope? Do you guys think CAL scope will remain or will UAL? I hope CAL scope stays with the merger

My opinion is they had better figure out a way to operate w/o 70 seaters w/ "Express" on the side. I've got no problem w/ them if they only say "United."

 

[densoo]

What are the opinions about scope? Do you guys think CAL scope will remain or will UAL? I hope CAL scope stays with the merger

If the past is any indicator, it'll go down in the first round. 274 RJs early in the decade kept 2,000 pilots off the mainline list then, infinite 70-seat Q400s are doing that now, so it seems to be a bit of moot point anyway.

Scope affects the bottom of the list in the short term (note 1500 furloughed at UAL) and they have never taken care of the bottom of the list. No medical, five year pay scales, reserve rules, are about the worst in the industry. Open time pickup and vacation waive keep 147 guys off the property each and every day.

If they get a hint of a whiff of a scent that they're going to lose retirement benefits as was the case in C'02 (or lose the lump sum option), or if they're offered an immediate payout of the A-Plan in exchange for scope, it'll go down like a tased baseball fan.

 

[rumrunner300]

Or to paraphrase, "pilots currently furloughed from a dying company will not be able to steal the careers from pilots currently employed at a healthy one." At least that's how I interpret that, here's hoping the arbitrator does too.

I agreed with you right up until GT flat out admitted that UAL was "rightsized" for a merger with the permissible inference being that the parking of the 737's at United was done for no other reason than to facilitate that merger.

I get it, bottom of one, bottom of the new one; I still agree with that premise. However, if it comes down to a tiebreaker, or giving a guy a boost, I want the fact that the United guys bore the brunt of it to be recognized.

If you are unable or unwilling to at least acknowledge the legitimacy of the argument, at least keep your mouth shut. However, you are of course permitted to forward a non-circular argument in favor of your position in the interest of intelligent discourse.

rr

 

[Tail Gunner Joe]

... giving a guy a boost, I want the fact that the United guys bore the brunt of it to be recognized...

rr

By "brunt of it" - do you mean the brunt of Tilton?
and by "boost" - do you mean give a United guy a boost to make up for Tilton's incompetence.

And isn't "boosting" United, stepping on Continental's "Career Expectations"?

 

[eaglesview]

Reality check... If you took the bottom of the UAL list including the fourloughies, and the bottom of the CO list again including the fouloughie's, and swapped them. (CO guys are now UAL and visa versa) My guess is 90% of the individual opinions would reverse as well. What does this say?? To much empotion involved, just human nature.

 

[saabservant]

I'm ten from the bottom on the furlough list at ual, and no, I would not expect to gain at the expense of any CO pilot.
The only people who stole my career were that SOB Tilton, and the Flt. OPS Mgmt.
personnel who knew they were going to retire aircraft a year before they hired us to get them through the summer schedule. I worked at Mesaba before ual, so my experience tells me it is not beyond these people...
What a chump I was, believing the hiring process and the interview....

I hope to resume flying for ual someday, it was great and the Captains were first class.... but it won't be for at least five years. Better would be the ability to say "no" to these greedy pigs.

I'd put my cards on Capt. Morse and the negotiators to get a fair integration for everyone. But greed is not exclusive to the boardroom, is it? Some pilot group will try to take advantage....

 

[ultrarunner]

I'm really surprised a USAir Eastie hasn't chimed in and suggested demanding DOH only, since that tactic worked out so well for them....

If anything, you gotta give the Easties credit for showing what NOT to do...

 

[pilotgolfer]

If anything, you gotta give the Easties credit for showing what NOT to do...

Or like my sim instructor always says..."you're not completely worthless. You are always good for a bad example."

 

[Fly2AK]

I'm ten from the bottom on the furlough list at ual, and no, I would not expect to gain at the expense of any CO pilot.
The only people who stole my career were that SOB Tilton, and the Flt. OPS Mgmt.
personnel who knew they were going to retire aircraft a year before they hired us to get them through the summer schedule. I worked at Mesaba before ual, so my experience tells me it is not beyond these people...
What a chump I was, believing the hiring process and the interview....

I hope to resume flying for ual someday, it was great and the Captains were first class.... but it won't be for at least five years. Better would be the ability to say "no" to these greedy pigs.

I'd put my cards on Capt. Morse and the negotiators to get a fair integration for everyone. But greed is not exclusive to the boardroom, is it? Some pilot group will try to take advantage....

I think with the lack of enthusiasm combined with the high cost of flight training, airlines will be hard pressed to find pilots especially qualified ones in about 5 years. Just my opinion. Either way I will ride out the chaos here in the desert and will try to put away money for a rainy day when I get back home.