UAL MEC standing tough for tighter Scope---listen up United Express people...

[damnflyboy]

Bring all RJ operations into mainline. Figure out a seniority integration. Fence off that equipment so if super senior CRJ captain wants to stay on that equipment, he wont get bumped out. I've always believed there are solutions to every problem. Management loves this division. They profit off it handsomely. Look at the salaries and stock options they are paid. Are they that much smarter or more talented?

Everyone can agree on this, the race for the bottom has to stop. If you made it to the point of getting hired to fly passengers at an airline, you are worth more than what most regional airlines pay.

Agreed. But most mainline guys would argue that I'm not even worthy of a staple, let alone seniority integration (because I'm a barbie-jet operator).

 

[tmac3333]

Dornier: I got hired with 2000 total time, all jet PIC from military. When the military pipeline dries up...which it is for various reasons, the airlines will have to start hiring from flight instructor or charter ranks. Maybe fly checks in the middle of the night? I don't know not my problem. I found a way to do it, because I wanted to. If you want to stay with your gig, good luck.

 

[rfa]

Dornier --

I thought of 3 in about 5 seconds.

1) Military
2) Flight Instruct
3) Charter

I never flew an RJ in my life before getting hired at Continental. Same with several in my class. I'm sorry you don't understand this. Enjoy your career at your regional, I hope it works out for you.

HA! Hired at Continental with no RJ time? No kidding? Could it be that you were military <rolls eyes> Well of course that is a good way of skipping the regionals, but even that is not a golden legacy ticket these days. ...unless they get lucky with delta and their low hiring minimums, some mil guys do not have enough PIC to get on with a"1000hr" major. Plus, the military is just too small these days.

As for flight instructing or charter... If you think a person with that experience will have an equal chance of getting a legacy job as a person with 121 (especially RJ) time, you are dreaming. Plus, people have to eat you know - maybe it did not cross your mind, but the civilian route is much harder financially than what you experienced. I know I could never keep up my stint as a flight instructor for much longer, and charter, well, that is not much better.

 

[Dornier 335]

I found a way to do it, because I wanted to. If you want to stay with your gig, good luck.

So have I. And I have even flown my little RJ for mainline rates in Europe. But I don't forget where most of my experience came from. And I hate to hear his generalization of RJ drivers like we are the root of all evil. Like I hate this "I'm too good to fly this little plane". I don't care about someone's inferiority problem. The RJ opportunity was there, I took it, and I moved on. But I never look down on somebody who flies a smaller plane.

@rfa: like I said before, he's just being slightly out of touch...

unless they get lucky with delta and their low hiring minimums

or Continental a few years ago: blond, big t!ts, low time and guess what? You're in!

 

[filejw]

So have I. And I have even flown my little RJ for mainline rates in Europe. But I don't forget where most of my experience came from. And I hate to hear his generalization of RJ drivers like we are the root of all evil. Like I hate this "I'm too good to fly this little plane". I don't care about someone's inferiority problem. The RJ opportunity was there, I took it, and I moved on. But I never look down on somebody who flies a smaller plane.

@rfa: like I said before, he's just being slightly out of touch...



or Continental a few years ago: blond, big t!ts, low time and guess what? You're in!

And I agree too.What most people here miss is this MEC is proposing to take back the flying as the contracts expire. Nothing wrong with that as that same MEC negotiated flying out of the contract and can do the same thing in reverse. FYI i don't work for UAL...

 

[the palm]

The sheer arrogance of mainline continues to boggle my mind.

1. Denver has the best training center in the world because the military trains there? I see military guys train at Flight Safety in Atlanta too.... And if the military is so great why are they training in the private sector? ROTFLMAO!!!!

2. UAX crews are not as safe as mainline? Yet they train at the same "world class" training center...../puke

3. Ofcourse people would rather fly first class on a mainline flight everywhere they go, but guess what? It's too freakin expensive. People really only care about getting where they want to go as cheaply and safely as possible. As long as that remains the case mainline airplanes will disappear and RJ's will remain.

4. Genital Lee is a doooooosh!

5. Mainline will ALWAYS give up scope for $$$$. History proves that. Management knows it. ALPA knows it. Even the scope chest thumpers know it.

 

[Jon Rivoli]

It cracks me up to read all these "Mainline" pilots talking tough on the regional board. As you are well aware (you are always telling us) we don't have a say in the matter, it is you who negotiate scope. Telling me that my days are numbered doesn't advance your cause any, the guy who is sitting to your immediate left the next time you go to work is the one you need to keep the pressure on. He's already a Captain and he probably doesn't have any more regard for your career than you have for mine.

The threat to you doesn't come from the little Barbi-Jets clogging up the sky, it comes from the guy who has seen his pay, benefits and pension decimated, who may be willing to give a little more on scope if it enables him to sock away a little bit more for his rapidly approaching retirement. He will have little trouble easing his conscience that what he did was ultimately for the good of the profession, restoring the pay and benefits for real airline pilots; you will thank him someday, after he retires, at 70.

So, please stop wasting your time bashing us regional pilots. Do what you got to do protect you career and quit wasting your time here.

 

[pave driver]

Hey guys, our plans to outsource all flying will be much easier than we thought. These groups will do all of our work for us. Just look at how they pit against each other. Pilots will always be pushovers and we'll never let them dictate to us the routes and equipment types.

 

[bluefin]

Why should any of us have to "reinterview" to do the same flying of the same passengers we are ALREADY flying every day? Did you have to reinterview when you went from the narrowbody you were hired into to the mighty 767??? The day your type at mainline realizes we at the regionals are ALREADY FLYING the very SAME passengers you then take to Europe or wherever and quit thinking of us as incapable inferiors, we all might get somewhere together.

Why should we have to go to the bottom of the list we were at 10 yrs ago in the joke of FOCL?

 

[CLARKGRSWOLD]

In all fairness, I will be the first to stick up for a regional airline guy. I spent 10 years at a regional flying mostly turbo-props. That is the hardest flying I've ever done. In fact, it was much harder 20 years ago when a Metroliner was state of the art, and 9 legs in a day didn't seem to bad because Great Lakes was doing 12!

What irks most mainline guys is the excitement displayed when 100 737's get parked, and some class 1 A-holes run around ORD with guppykiller on their bags. I understand some pilots choose to fly at a regional airline as the final career stop. Just understand that you never really control your own destiny. Another airline and pilot group are the real ones in control. I realized that in 1998, and the writing on the wall was very clear then. While regional airlines have seen explosive growth post 9/11, the ceiling has been reached. The push for larger regional jets is what management drools over. It's only the scope clauses at major airlines that prevent this. I'm sure some guy at Republic sits there at altitude and thinks, the 717 pilot who used to fly this route got paid 3 times as much. Why am I not worth that?

That is the conundrum. A major airline pilot sees it as job stealing, the regional airline pilot sees it as mainline pilot limiting growth and income potential. ALPA has a very difficult problem serving 2 masters. There has to be a solution. I'd advocate bringing all flying into mainline, and protecting the pilots who are already flying that equipment. A huge undertaking. I could never understand the logic of "we have to interview them, and hire them". We are all flying the same damn passengers.

Bring all RJ operations into mainline. Figure out a seniority integration. Fence off that equipment so if super senior CRJ captain wants to stay on that equipment, he wont get bumped out. I've always believed there are solutions to every problem. Management loves this division. They profit off it handsomely. Look at the salaries and stock options they are paid. Are they that much smarter or more talented?

Everyone can agree on this, the race for the bottom has to stop. If you made it to the point of getting hired to fly passengers at an airline, you are worth more than what most regional airlines pay.

HAHA yea mainline, control of your destiny, Tell that to the Airways guys that are 20 year 737 f/o's. Tell that to the TWA pilots that got the AA shaft, tell that to the UAL pilots that have been furloughed twice in 15 years. Mainline just paints the illusion of a stable job. Sorry but a 10 year RJ captain making 95k a year with a good schedule.. No thanks you can have mainline