UAL announces another recall class- 21 Aug

[Sonny Crockett]

If you were out more than 36 months, you get the Freeze.

 

[Tanner]

Understand. Thanks for the replies. I just hope to be awarded whatever gets me a line the quickest, so I can use the Big Pick to get me down to around 50 to 60 hrs. per month.

 

[Huggyu2]

If you watch the vacancy bids, you'll see that there have been several 767 bids to recalled furloughees on mil leave. I've seen a ton of mil leaves getting different aircraft/domiciles on the 737 and airbus bids.

The problem is that, even though I'm on mil leave and haven't done training, they have still given me a 3 year freeze to the 737. So I'm not eligible to put in for a vacancy. I'm stuck with the 737 unless I can find a trade.

 

[Andy]

The problem is that, even though I'm on mil leave and haven't done training, they have still given me a 3 year freeze to the 737. So I'm not eligible to put in for a vacancy. I'm stuck with the 737 unless I can find a trade.

You sure? You shouldn't incur a freeze until you start training.

 

[Andy]

Huggy, I got a response on the UAL ALPA board indicating what I thought ... you don't incur a freeze until you enter training. You can call a flight manager and have him put in bids for you.
Who told you that you've got a freeze on the 737?
When I'm recalled, I plan on going into the IADFO and plug in a bunch of vacancy bids even though I'll be on mil leave. I don't want to fly in the LCO; it sounds brutal.

 

[Huggyu2]

Bob Neal emailed me and told me I had the freeze. So did the letter I received from UAL.
I'll call my domicile and see what they say.

 

[Andy]

Bob Neal emailed me and told me I had the freeze. So did the letter I received from UAL.
I'll call my domicile and see what they say.

Huggy, I was afraid that you were going to tell me that. I'd say just call your domicile and play dumb.
Let us know the results.

 

[Hvy]

Which part? That they are recalling or that it takes about 100 calls to fill 20 positions and the bypasses are increasing because no one wants to go back to that craphole?

There's a village looking for you.

 

[Andy]

Huggy, you got me thinking about the freeze while on ML. From what I gather, you get a freeze as soon as you go on ML. If you're on ML for 24 months, you'll still owe another 12 months.
However, I was reading C2003. I've copied 8-D-4-c below:
[FONT=Arial,Bold]

8-D-4-c
[/FONT]

The above provision shall not restrict a pilot from​

bidding up in status (i.e., First Officer to Captain) at any

time; however, a pilot who vacates an awarded
assignment by bidding up in status, may be ineligible to
bid and be awarded any other vacancy with an effective
date earlier than the fourteen (14) months (thirty-six (36)
months) provided above, plus the amount remaining
unfulfilled from his prior assignment. Notwithstanding the
above bidding restriction, a pilot who is awarded a
vacancy and subsequently receives another award to a
higher status prior to beginning training for the initial
vacancy award shall not incur any bidding restriction as a
result of the initial vacancy award.​

Please note the last sentence. I interpret this as allowing us to bid for larger equipment while on ML. The added bonus of this is that the freeze on 767/777/400 fleets is 14 months. Depending on how long you hang out on ML, you may be able to bid up to a 777/400 before returning to UAL.
I've read a couple of posts indicating that there will be quite a few 777 & 400 FOs who will hit age 60 within the next year. Also, TK is advertising for additional 400 PIs; this is feeding the rumor of UAL entering back into cargo ops.

Also, here's 8-D-4-b:
​

[FONT=Arial,Bold]

8-D-4-b​

​

The above bid restriction shall also apply to a
pilot who requires training upon being hired as a pilot or
upon being recalled from furlough; except that the period
of restriction shall begin upon the date the pilot is
assigned to training.​

I again read this as not having a bid restriction while on ML.

And a bit more food for thought: How much longer will UAL be flying the 737? I see that as the next fleet to be retired.​

[/FONT]
​

 

[Fletch F Fletch]

Fellow UAL furloughees,

I was a May 2000 hire and am now a probie at a large cargo outfit in the midst of contract negotiations. Also looming is the possible reduction of the mail contract (which apparently makes up 50% of flying). Included in this mix is a less than enjoyable commute to a city nowhere near as nice as the many UAL domiciles (or the UAL domicile where I still live: western mountainous state). So, what I want to know is, if said cargo company can't get their sh-crud together, should I accept the recall?

Poorly educated minds would like any advice available. Any sarcasm or ridicule accepted.

Gracias.

 

[Fox-Tree]

Fellow UAL furloughees,

I was a May 2000 hire and am now a probie at a large cargo outfit in the midst of contract negotiations. Also looming is the possible reduction of the mail contract (which apparently makes up 50% of flying). Included in this mix is a less than enjoyable commute to a city nowhere near as nice as the many UAL domiciles (or the UAL domicile where I still live: western mountainous state). So, what I want to know is, if said cargo company can't get their sh-crud together, should I accept the recall?

Poorly educated minds would like any advice available. Any sarcasm or ridicule accepted.

Gracias.

Triple-F,
If you really want advice, you'll probably need to be a little less coy regarding the outfit you're working for now.
Some of the "clues" about your current employer point to Fedex. Except that some of your info isn't correct (assuming it is Fedex).
1- The mail isn't 50% of the flying.
2- The current mail contract isn't in jeopardy (yes, UPS just got a new one) however, Fedex's still dwarfs theirs (less than 10%) and USPS has no plans to change it.
3 - In spite of the current lack of contract, I'd hesitate to characterize Fedex as not having their "sh-crud" together. Their current financial state is something UAL hasn't seen in its entire history.

I'm not saying things will never turn bad at Fedex, but their history is certainly better than UAL. Given the unrest in the oil producing areas of the world and potential for further attacks on us, my $$ is still in the world of cargo. I miss living in domicile, traveling on passes, etc. - BUT, I missed not flying more when the sh-crud hit the fan at UAL. They're not out of the woods. I'd stick w/ Fedex (if that's where you are). At a minimum, don't rush into your decision. Bypass until you have to make the final call. Why burn a bridge (either one) before you have to.

Can't give you much on the commute. Move or deal with it if you want to stick w/ cargo. If you're not holding a good line yet, the commute gets better. I'm in my crash pad for ~20 hours for the first time in more than 3 months. The double deadheads really make the commute an almost non-event.

One final thought. You may not care, but if you bail, you’ll probably hose every UAL furloughee (maybe EVERY furloughee from a major) in the pool or trying to get on at Fedex. You may even force some other probies to have to answer some pretty pointed questions from their ACP or CP.
Good Luck.

 

[Sonny Crockett]

Triple-F,
If you really want advice, you'll probably need to be a little less coy regarding the outfit you're working for now.
Some of the "clues" about your current employer point to Fedex. Except that some of your info isn't correct (assuming it is Fedex).
1- The mail isn't 50% of the flying.
2- The current mail contract isn't in jeopardy (yes, UPS just got a new one) however, Fedex's still dwarfs theirs (less than 10%) and USPS has no plans to change it.
3 - In spite of the current lack of contract, I'd hesitate to characterize Fedex as not having their "sh-crud" together. Their current financial state is something UAL hasn't seen in its entire history.

I'm not saying things will never turn bad at Fedex, but their history is certainly better than UAL. Given the unrest in the oil producing areas of the world and potential for further attacks on us, my $$ is still in the world of cargo. I miss living in domicile, traveling on passes, etc. - BUT, I missed not flying more when the sh-crud hit the fan at UAL. They're not out of the woods. I'd stick w/ Fedex (if that's where you are). At a minimum, don't rush into your decision. Bypass until you have to make the final call. Why burn a bridge (either one) before you have to.

Can't give you much on the commute. Move or deal with it if you want to stick w/ cargo. If you're not holding a good line yet, the commute gets better. I'm in my crash pad for ~20 hours for the first time in more than 3 months. The double deadheads really make the commute an almost non-event.

One final thought. You may not care, but if you bail, you’ll probably hose every UAL furloughee (maybe EVERY furloughee from a major) in the pool or trying to get on at Fedex. You may even force some other probies to have to answer some pretty pointed questions from their ACP or CP.
Good Luck.

Dude REALX!

He was just asking a question...CHILL

If he wants to bail on FEDEX that is HIS decision!

 

[Fox-Tree]

Dude REALX!

He was just asking a question...CHILL

If he wants to bail on FEDEX that is HIS decision!

??? I'm not quite sure why you feel I need to chill. What in my post gave you the impression that I need to be told to relax? I know he was asking a question. That's why I tried to give him an answer. I tried to give the guy an honest opinion and some things to consider which was what I thought he was asking for. I could care less what he does.

You're right - bailing is HIS decision. I never said it wasn't. I just pointed out that it has the potential to effect others. He'll still make it.

 

[bizicmo]

Can I have your spot?

 

[skykid]

I have to agree with Fox-T about hauling the mail - with United and SWA giving up domestic mail carrying and the Post Office pleased with FedEx's performance, I'd say that is not an issue. Fact is, FedEx is in the position of turning down business because they don't have enough lift. Talk to some of the guys you know still flying at United to help make your decision.

 

[D-Bo]

Fellow UAL furloughees,

I was a May 2000 hire and am now a probie at a large cargo outfit in the midst of contract negotiations. Also looming is the possible reduction of the mail contract (which apparently makes up 50% of flying). Included in this mix is a less than enjoyable commute to a city nowhere near as nice as the many UAL domiciles (or the UAL domicile where I still live: western mountainous state). So, what I want to know is, if said cargo company can't get their sh-crud together, should I accept the recall?

Poorly educated minds would like any advice available. Any sarcasm or ridicule accepted.

Gracias.

Currently on bypass (not at FDX) myself but I'd stay at FedEx if I were in your shoes. At the very least pass it up for as long as possible. No better seat in the stands to watch this game being played out than where you're at right now. The commute may be bad but don't they pay for your tickets to get to and from work? Good luck on making the right choice when the time comes. Maybe life will get a little better when you get to widebody FO over there. Life won't begin to improve greatly at UA until after 09.

 

[Andy]

Fletch F Fletch, a bypass will probably buy you another year before you have to make a permanent decision. That'd be the course that I'd opt for right now if I were in your shoes.

Fox-tree, it was pretty obvious that he was talkin' 'bout FedEx. Maybe he's looking at FedEx negatively, but that's not a bad thing after seeing what happened at UAL. I don't think that his decision will have as great an effect on other UAL/major furloughees as you make it out to be. Certainly FedEx had to anticipate a bit of attrition when those guys get recalled.

 

[skykid]

Certainly FedEx had to anticipate a bit of attrition when those guys get recalled.

Andy, actually I don't think they expect any attrition back to United or any other major. I'm at FedEx with lots of other furloughed United guys, and I can tell you triple F is the exception. Its a no brainer, just compare 727 plumber pay to United narrow body pay. Everyone is taking the bypass because that is the smart thing to do, but I know of no one even considering going back.

 

[Fox-Tree]

Concur Skykid. If someone leaves, it will raise eyebrows. I haven't met anyone who is looking at Fedex as a place to spin their wheels until UAL/AA/etc. calls them back.

Andy,
I guess I didn't see the point in being so mysterious. If the guy wanted advice/opinions, just state the facts. "I'm at Fedex, furloughed UAL, live in Denver, blah, blah." It's not like he was fooling anyone if he was worried about being identified.

 

[flyingmonkey]

Concur Skykid. If someone leaves, it will raise eyebrows. I haven't met anyone who is looking at Fedex as a place to spin their wheels until UAL/AA/etc. calls them back.

Andy,
I guess I didn't see the point in being so mysterious. If the guy wanted advice/opinions, just state the facts. "I'm at Fedex, furloughed UAL, live in Denver, blah, blah." It's not like he was fooling anyone if he was worried about being identified.

How do you know he's not at UPS? Just curious, I must have missed something.

 

[Andy]

How do you know he's not at UPS? Just curious, I must have missed something.

1 Midst of contract negotiations - UPS has already completed new contract negotiations.

2 Concern over loss of the postal contract. UPS just recently got a chunk of USPS' business; FedEx has had USPS business for quite a while.

Hope that helps.

 

[Yuppyguppy]

What if you had to choose between staying at your LCC after being there 1.5 years or UAL...I chose UAL because I from near ORD and numerous other reasons. I'll get a pay raise and I know my training and the guys I fly with will be predictable and they professional...more than I can say at my current place. Some of the ******************** I see man.

 

[Sonny Crockett]

Yuppy,



You hit it on the head! I too was at an LCC and came back to UAL. Some of the guys I flew with at the LCC were pretty bad. The Training and hiring was also a new low. YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

UAL has a few bad apples as well, but not the norm like Airline "X"

 

[Cobraair75drvr]

sonny,

Is your dad former NWA with the intials of M O?

 

[Craven Morehead]

Hijack! Who's been recalled to UAL (check thread title)? Line number? Date of hire? What was the latest classes domicile availability?

Craven

 

[Yuppyguppy]

4/10/2000 for Sept 25th

 

[GuppyPuppy]

Hijack! Who's been recalled to UAL (check thread title)? Line number? Date of hire? What was the latest classes domicile availability?

Craven

3/20/00 hire. 1/15/03 furlough.

Recalled for the 8/21/06 class. Bypassed.

GP

 

[Fletch F Fletch]

Thanks for all the "advice" folks. Yeah, I was being cryptic, but it was an attempt at humor. Clearly it failed. As for screwing things up for other UAL guys, I certainly would not do that. I was mostly thinking if this FDX thing goes sour (e.g., the "s" word or furloughs). I know, I know, I know, they've never furloughed. I guess once bitten, twice shy. But I appreciate the smack back to reality. I guess I shouldn't post at 0300 after a few beers while stuck at the crappy crashpad. Thanks again.

 

[Whale Rider]

Congrats Tanner...

We need you like no tomorrow!

I think we are about 300-600 short on pilots.

Hey Crockett, what's the latest on UAL buying Polars 747-400F's? That rumor has kind of faded away.

 

[catIIIc]

I belive Polar is only getting rid of its 200's not its 400's so I think this rumor is false. Any Polar guys care to chime in.