UA "national seniority list"

[Fubijaakr]

A NSL would create some real negatives both in the short-term and the long-term. If airline A is doing well while airline B is not, then there would be a number of pilots wanting to go to airline A...quite possibly senior to existing airline A pilots waiting for an upgrade at their successful airline. Now a group of more senior airline B pilots get those upgrades "off the street."

Wrong. An NSL would only apply in the case of a merger/acquisition. If you want to voluntarily change airlines, you maintain your NSL number, but you go to the bottom of the airline list you voluntarily jump to.

 

[IAHERJ]

Wrong. An NSL would only apply in the case of a merger/acquisition. If you want to voluntarily change airlines, you maintain your NSL number, but you go to the bottom of the airline list you voluntarily jump to.

Well I think that is basically the only intent of the movement on the part of the UAL MEC anyway. This is a self serving idea coming from the same group that wanted no part of a NSL a few decades ago.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Well I think that is basically the only intent of the movement on the part of the UAL MEC anyway. This is a self serving idea coming from the same group that wanted no part of a NSL a few decades ago.

Of course it is. What is amazing is that it was the UAL MEC that honchoed deleting "DOH" from the ALPA merger/frag policy the first time they tried to merge with USAir.

Ironic, isn't it?

 

[michael707767]

Wrong. An NSL would only apply in the case of a merger/acquisition. If you want to voluntarily change airlines, you maintain your NSL number, but you go to the bottom of the airline list you voluntarily jump to.

Then what? Your new airline merges with someone and you jump ahead of all the pilots at your new airline via your NSL number?

 

[michael707767]

...says the Delta pilot. I bet more than half of the members of ALPA support it. Within ALPA, probably only the Delta and FedEx pilots would oppose it...maybe CAL pilots too..The rest will most likely support it.

Hmm, then maybe the Delta, Fedex and CAL pilots walk right out the door and form a new union. Something we should do anyway.

 

[Dan Roman]

Sorry if I am going to look stupid here but...... are they saying if an Airline shuts down and they go to another carrier they get merged in ahead of active pilots or just keep a higher pay rate?? It didn't seem to clear to me.

 

[waveflyer]

Wrong. An NSL would only apply in the case of a merger/acquisition. If you want to voluntarily change airlines, you maintain your NSL number, but you go to the bottom of the airline list you voluntarily jump to.

Why?
An NSL could be implemented in a 1000 different ways. Regardless of UALs motives it's a concept that should be studied -

there needs to be a solution to the problem that mgmts nationwide are using our seniority system against us- they know that we'd give up the whole contract to avoid starting over at 1st year pay somewhere else- and it hurts us at the bargaining table

 

[eaglesview]

Why?
An NSL could be implemented in a 1000 different ways. Regardless of UALs motives it's a concept that should be studied -

there needs to be a solution to the problem that mgmts nationwide are using our seniority system against us- they know that we'd give up the whole contract to avoid starting over at 1st year pay somewhere else- and it hurts us at the bargaining table

Thanks for the compliment but do you really think we (UAL) control what ALPA does. I don't think they give a crap about us, we are now outnumbered by the regionals.

 

[waveflyer]

Just responding to all the other previous posts saying the NSL subject is just a scam by UAL mec now that they are staring down a merger-

my point is that an NSL has merit regardless of any one airline's current scenario-

if there is a pilot group out there that doesn't think they could be panam or braniff or eastern- you're off your rocker- just don't box in how an NSL would work into whatever you have in your head- there are literally a dozen ways to implement an NSL on top of a dozen alternatives- don't limit it- support it being studied...

 

[waveflyer]

Unless of course you like bailing out your management every bankruptcy

 

[Splert]

Why?
An NSL could be implemented in a 1000 different ways.

...and every airline would have to agree to negotiate the same EXACT seniority contract language in each of those "1000 different ways".

Seniority is not imposed on an airline by a union it is negotiated with the airline.

The airline has no interest in extending seniority to pilots it did hire in those "1000 different ways".

 

[DrunkIrishman]

Ok Fubi, here's another scenario for you....

Airline A is doing well and has just given a new contract to its pilots with a large raise. Airlines B through Z are now well underpaid so many senior pilots from those airlines decide to interview at airline A so that they can get an immediate pay raise. Since their seniority is now portable, they can do this with no penalty.

 

[Turtle21]

One little problem with ALPA is in the organization itself. These critical decisions are made by an executive committee not by the rank and file. Any decision to change anything regarding seniority should go out for membership ratification.

The person missing in this equation is the line pilot.

Valid point.

And with ALPO, always will.

 

[Turtle21]

It would have to have strong leadership at ALPA national- but it could be done

Oxymoron of the decade.

ALPA "strong" leadership is focused on national dues generation, not pilot seniority concerns. Alas.

 

[Mr.B]

Unless of course you like bailing out your management every bankruptcy

I'm interested.

If your an airline pilot and your company is standing before the BK judge, what steps do you take to prevent the bailout of your management.

Just so I have this these steps handy, give me as much detail as possible.

Thanks!