Today's Update from NJA

[imacdog]

Bro, I know you're just being a smartass but as far as the boards being a happy place again, that's the first lie I've read from you... Ever. That's a bit depressing. I get emails on a daily basis from folks I don't even know following my "lead" so to speak. Just today I got a message saying that it is worse than ever.

The boards are a joke right now and you and I both know it.

As far as passing the 25% off to just a temporary issue is a bit BS too man.

Oh please, you've done your fair share of dividing on that board yourself. Save the melodrama for someone who cares about what you think. Good luck finding that person.

 

[netjetwife]

...in the last 2 months ... a "pissed" attitude, not quite surly, but I can't think of the right word, and just keep it bottled up and don't say a word. .... Years ago I was told that in a "good compromise" no one is totally happy. It means everyone gave in....

Like Steeler, I think the time frame makes it very likely that you were witnessing the stress and frustration of those pilots who were most at risk of being furloughed. Human nature being what it is, some will hold back emotionally with the the idea (often unconscious) of avoiding the pain that comes with losing something you value. If our theory is correct, you should see an improved attitude if you get those pilots again.

Consider it a good compromise. A couple aspects of the Voluntary Measures were debated (sometimes heatedly) on the NJASAP board. Like most families, there are internal squabbles but the group pulls together to face outside threats. In one way or another, the majority of NJ pilots are supporting the cause/each other and that's what counts. For the record, during the past two months there was a lot of nervousness and stress projected on the board. I didn't see it as hate. Right now, I think the over-riding tone of the board is one of relief and expressed gratitude. Is it a happy place? Certainly to those pilots whose job was saved and to those who are proud of the role played by NJASAP. Add in their family members (whose thanks were passed on) and the ayes have it.

As always, your shared perspective is appreciated 'Owner... NJW

 

[netjetwife]

Since we saved jobs at NJA/NJI/NJLA, we also saved jobs indirectly for the FSI instructors. Good point! ... many of those folks would be on the street as well. If they're still over-staffed I hope they follow the NJ alternative-method first.

I am proud of everyone here at NetJets for looking out for each other. Hear! Hear! I am proud that people put aside their feelings of management to help their fellow brothers and sisters. Agreed and I think this experience will help build trust for those who have a hard time with that. We have proved time and time again that this pilot group is solid and will continue to be undivided and impenetrable. I'm pleased that my prediction has come true. In 2004 I posted that standing together would get easier as the pilot group went forward--in unity.

We have created a whole new history in aviation when it comes to union and company relations, we have created new paths in pilot soliderity. This is the third time we have come to together to do whats right (2005, 2007, 2009). Each time validates the effort of NJASAP leaders and volunteers. From my family's perspective, the results make it worth it all. I applaud and am proud of each and every crewmember at this company, Thank you.

Great post, EJCA! I'd just like to add family members to the appreciation list as their support for the pilots is critical to success. In 2005 the pilotgroup stood up for themselves and earned the respect that was due. 2007 was a proving ground on two fronts: Labor-Management cooperation and considering the needs of junior VSL pilots. We all learned that it could be done and a foundation was laid that we just built on again. This last achievement is the most impressive, I think, because doing the right thing took more thought and work. Consider that NJ could have just furloughed and not too much would have been said because the practice is common. Likewise, the senior VSL pilots were truly selfless this time. In 2005 and 2007 they still benefited monetarily by the arrangements; but this time they are giving up income to help those at the bottom of the list. In addition, the 2009 cause has helped to strengthen the bond between the two NJ pilotgroups and that bodes well for the future. NJASAP is unionism at its finest and that is something all NetJet folks can be proud of and other aviation groups can safely follow. Respectfully, NJW

 

[Semore Butts]

Guys cmon

There is no need to explain to NJA Owner what he experienced?

He knows what he saw. He has been around for a long time.

G200, I PMed you man, hope you are well, but cmon....

Don't comment on the other board since you left????

I'm with Imac, Fozzy, and the "Smoking Monkey" man.

Alot of relief and gratitude now.

Have we got a count on the "Union board" how many are attending the big BBQ at G-200's when he leaves for next tour?

That thread is getting long man!!!!!!

(Sorry "G", had to give you some $hit man! Back off the "Clacker" man!)

 

[G200_PILOT]

What a F'ing joke! Unity, relief, and gratitude huh?

Last week it was the senior guys being accused of not giving a shyt about the junior guys. "Selfish and stupid." Wasn't that how it was worded? Had this thing failed, do you think those affected would have remained unified? Do you think they would have remained respectful and thankful for the attempt? Some yes, but the ass-monkeys on the board would have been the first to place blame on the other pilots rather than understanding that the economy is to blame.

We'll just have to disagree on this one SB's. I'm completely disgusted at how this all went down. News-flash... I'm not alone on this one.

 

[netjetwife]

The success of the JPMC substantiates our claim of unity--easily. That many ...hundreds...of pilots and their families are utterly relieved is basic common sense--backed up by posts expressing that relief. It is also logical that readers interpret posted thanks to all involved as expressions of gratitude. To deny that is to deny reality.

The fact that the stress of the situation showed up in a handful of posts is not surprising, but that any NJ pilot would harp on that instead of focusing on the collective good that was accomplished does raise eyebrows. :erm: The overwhelmingly positive response to the Voluntary Measures indicates that those with a negative opinion are out of step with the NJ pilotgroups and other employees. If we apply the term "ass-monkeys" fairly, would it not fit a fringe group that refuses to make allowances for those who got sick on the emotional roller coaster, and who can't give due credit for an exemplary system without seemingly demanding perfection?

Newsflash... I bet that almost every furloughed pilot out there would have gratefully chosen the unity and accomplishment seen at NetJets. That's a huge vote of confidence that far exceeds the few who aren't suitably impressed.

 

[G200_PILOT]

NJW, no doubt, without the work of thousands here, the outcome would have been very different. I'm very proud what this group was able to accomplish. The issue that I share with many others is that when a few people opened up and publically came out and admitted to not being able to help out for o e reason or another, they were attacked by the same that had their hands out begging for help. They spoke out of both sides of their mouth. They were nice as can be while asking for help but as soon as one person said they couldn't help, their attitudes changed and they went on the attack. I for one look at that as being two faced and I'll be the first to tell that person to enjoy the unemployment line. I have no sympathy for a person that refuses to listen to why certain people couldn't help out to the extent that others did. Sure, some could have but simply didn't but I'm certain that most of the peoe that didn't take a reuced schedule and/or remained opted in COULDN'T.

 

[o2bflyn]

the other 1/3 just have a "pissed" attitude, not quite surly, but I can't think of the right word, and just keep it bottled up and don't say a word. This is diffrent when during the contract negotiations there was a group of pilots who were actively trying to tell us something they did not like.

As we all know.....some people are simply never happy. I don't think it has much to do with this agreement. These are the kind of people that if you bring them a Rolls-Royce, they want a Bently.

It is a shame that it is displayed in such obvious terms to an owner though. If you are unhappy with your job, it is something to be taken up with management. The owner/customer should NEVER see it.

 

[NJAowner]

Some pilots are worse off and b!tch less.

I agree with o2bflyin. When you keep make excuses, even if they are valid, they get lame and less effective. This time it is the recent sniority issues, before that the contract, before that ... It can get tiring. This is like an arguement between cats and dogs.. they are so at it going back and forth that neither one of them sees the pack of wolves standing next to them. I may be wrong but it seem slike the mission of NJ (like most service businesses) is to deliver quality and safe service to its customers.

In the past 18 months I have flown quite a bit on another fractional as well as NJ (but not as often and not Flops). From what I read on this board its non-union pilots have much, much more to complain about -- and guess what -- I can not recall a single PIC or SIC who did not give "service with a smile" and was extremely and genuinely thankful for our business. Whehter it was BS or not I do not know -- but they did not show their concerns, worries, issues, complaints with the passengers in the back.

Fly safe.

 

[imacdog]

There is a fringe on both sides of everything, G200. Apparently you can't understand that the fringe on the boards doesn't represent the group as a whole. Too bad, but not unexpected.

 

[o2bflyn]

Exactly.....whatever the issues, the pax should never know you have so much as a headache. Remember guys and gals, there is not a door on most of these jets, they can see and hear you.

Save it for your union rep/ACP/CP or Bartender.......put a grin on your face and go to work.

 

[RNObased]

Oh please, you've done your fair share of dividing on that board yourself. Save the melodrama for someone who cares about what you think. Good luck finding that person.

Well Imacdog, the fact that G200 is gone from the message boards mean that the junior guys lost a supporter. Even if you don't like what he said, he always supported the junior guys.

It is one thing to fight on the boards, it is another to drag it to the work place in front of owners, that is unacceptable. I'm not saying you did, so don't freak out, that is just a general statement.

 

[imacdog]

RNO, both you and I know what I'm talking about with the boards. Losing a "junior guy supporter" on what is basically a bitch board that for the most part does not represent the thoughts of the pilot group as a whole is okay with me.

 

[RNObased]

RNO, both you and I know what I'm talking about with the boards. Losing a "junior guy supporter" on what is basically a bitch board that for the most part does not represent the thoughts of the pilot group as a whole is okay with me.

Yeah, I hear you. The majority of the pilot group tends to go down the middle, while the fringes scream bloody murder. The level of whining has reached the pitch of somewhere around a Garrett engine. I'm done with it also. They can fight among themselves until hell freezes over for all I care.

Let's see what happens after the summer is over and everyone is ready to come back to work. Also the numbers of reduced schedules is wrong. I personally know two guys who were put on reduced schedules they didn't ask for, wonder how many more mistakes like that were made??

 

[G200_PILOT]

RNO, thanks for the kind words. What a change between you and I in just a year huh?:beer:

imacdog, my departure from the "bitch boards" doesn't change how I look at the majority of the "junior guys." Having been a new hire mentor, I had the pleasure of meeting a lot of the guys hired here those last two years before the freeze. We have a great bunch of guys working here. The junior guys that made waves over the past few weeks made themselves known and that was their choice. Hopefully it all works out for them. My initial reaction when the senior guys began to get attacked was to say ******************** the junior group and let the chips fall where they will. I never said that and I took the time to calm down and do the right thing. I simply took myself out of an area that began to be filled with people in that group. The message boards have always been a great place to go for good entertainment. The division that many of us began to witness recently was too much for some of us to take. It was depressing to see and began to wear on me. If you look, you'll notice that the pilots that never go on to our private boards live a much calmer life. They're not wrapped up in the BS politics that engulf the message board. The less exposure to that type of BS, the better.

For years, I have tried to convince other pilots to join the boards and stay connected. For years, the message board was a great place for information regarding our union. It's not that way now and that's OK. Our elected eboard members, mainly our president, has done a great job of keeping the entire group informed by publishing the weekly 411 emails. Everything that a pilot needs to know can be found by simply reading those emails and visiting njasap.com. One doesn't have to log onto the message board for answers anymore. That's my opinion. You don't have to share that same opinion. Move on and do whatever you wish.

 

[netjetwife]

... When you keep make excuses, even if they are valid, they get lame and less effective. This time it is the recent sniority issues, before that the contract, before that ... It can get tiring. ....

To clarify, I don't condone anything less than stellar service. I was just looking for a logical explanation and noticed that your two month time frame fit the fear-of-being-furloughed situation. I'll pass your observation on to my husband; like the majority of the NJ pilots, he's very aware of the need to retain present customers and attract new ones. I know he'll regret, as I do, that your flying experience wasn't top notch in some cases. Thanks for your patronage in the sky and on the board...no BS ... NJW

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

G200

I need you to report to the boards on the 14th as so I win my bet, I'll send you half of that to subsidize the margaritas at your next cookout.

Dont dissapoint me, Bubba.

 

[G200_PILOT]

LOL... That's a bet that unfortunately you're going to lose. I have absolutely no desire to log back on. This last week allowed me to look at just how engulfed I really was. It's definitely not something I'm proud of.

 

[gunfyter]

I need you to return to the boards because I need someone to tell me if i should get the new iPhone 3Gs or stick with the original....:beer:

 

[imacdog]

Yeah G things were great when you were around. BTW how did that whole "Porter" thing work out for you?