The Brits show Americans the way. STRIKE!

[flygirlqt]

Rez, Waveflyer's post neatly sums up my response to you and I have a contract law final this afternoon. Your rhetoric does nothing to change the fact that ALPA is losing the backing of numerous pilots. You may feel good about what you are saying but in reality the process and principles you espouse for change within ALPA are a joke. The good old boy system is so entrenched within ALPA politics no one within the membership has the ability to change anything with the status quo. It is all geared around money, dues income and protecting ALPA long before the memberships interest are concerned.

If you feel your dues are going to something worthwhile like the grossly disproportionate pay for union officers, lackluster representation and that stupid glad handing magazine be my guest to enjoy it.

 

[Lear70]

Disclaimer: thread drift...

One of these days I'd like to hear how you're covering your basic bills while you're back in school... (not an attack, just seriously wondering how the heck you replace $3k a month after-taxes while you're trying to go to school, too.) House payment, property taxes, insurance, utilities, gas, food, cell phone, not even counting child support or child care / tuition for Pre-k, etc...

Adds up fast.

 

[waveflyer]

Ex ALPA and IBT, been there done that. I am a union realist, as a former ALPA and Teamster member I have seen what unions can and can not do. They can not make a silk purse out of a pig’s ear, the consumer determines your pay and benefts, management only tries o keep the company in business

So mgmt is always the good hearted protagonist? You're repeating the flaws of Ayn Rand- if every executive was dagny taggart or Hank rearden we wouldn't be having this conversation. The consumer does NOT determine my benefits or contract- I spent too many years at theregionals to know it's not that simple.

 

[flygirlqt]

Disclaimer: thread drift...

One of these days I'd like to hear how you're covering your basic bills while you're back in school... (not an attack, just seriously wondering how the heck you replace $3k a month after-taxes while you're trying to go to school, too.) House payment, property taxes, insurance, utilities, gas, food, cell phone, not even counting child support or child care / tuition for Pre-k, etc...

Adds up fast.

Substantial inheritance. I would never have to work a day in my life but I would rather be a productive member of society than sitting around on my tush hanging out at the country club.

 

[PCL_128]

Disclaimer: thread drift...

One of these days I'd like to hear how you're covering your basic bills while you're back in school... (not an attack, just seriously wondering how the heck you replace $3k a month after-taxes while you're trying to go to school, too.) House payment, property taxes, insurance, utilities, gas, food, cell phone, not even counting child support or child care / tuition for Pre-k, etc...

Adds up fast.

Apparently not the case with her, but there are law schools that have part-time programs. There are four colleges in the Atlanta area that offer 4- and 5-year law programs going to school part-time. If you can manage to work a flying schedule that allows it, then you can make it work without losing the income while attending school.

 

[Lear70]

Apparently not the case with her, but there are law schools that have part-time programs. There are four colleges in the Atlanta area that offer 4- and 5-year law programs going to school part-time. If you can manage to work a flying schedule that allows it, then you can make it work without losing the income while attending school.

I was actually thinking of my *ahem* CURRENT situation,,,

Planning the best for Feb, but the prepared person always evaluates their options BEFORE they get backed into the corner, and a 15/6 schedule is brutal on the family life. Even if things DO go our way in Feb (not to mention IF Kalitta retains my job after exceeding my FMLA timeline for my shoulder), AirTran will likely push it another YEAR before doing anything after they lose the Arbitration...

Hence the thought process prompting the initial question to FlyG. You know how I like to dissect a contract... Not that I would prefer that over a flying career (I haven't come THIS far to give up on it now), but a lucrative position as a Contracts or Trademark / Copyright attorney and home every night with my son beats the heck out of 15/6 for years to come. (Plus, it'd be fun to someday show up across from Kolski at the table in a completely different capacity... admit it, you just laughed at the thought of it).

p.s. Yes, there are a couple of part-time J.D. programs here in BNA, Vandy included, but you're talking 4-6 years part-time, and that's assuming I get accepted.

Substantial inheritance. I would never have to work a day in my life but I would rather be a productive member of society than sitting around on my tush hanging out at the country club.

Good for you, although if you already inherited it, my condolences on your loss...

I know what you mean about sitting around. I've been sidelined for 6 months now having surgery and recovering from it, and I'm about to go out of my mind here bored to death... If I knew the ALPA FPL was going to continue no matter what and ALPA would allow it, or I found an alternate way to fund my basic income while full-time in school, I'd have already applied for full time Vandy's Spring semester and tried to get my scholarship back they offered me years ago.

Best of luck to you out there.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

You are not making sense.......

Rez, Waveflyer's post neatly sums up my response to you and I have a contract law final this afternoon.

Suddenly you are too busy?

Your rhetoric does nothing to change the fact that ALPA is losing the backing of numerous pilots. You may feel good about what you are saying but in reality the process and principles you espouse for change within ALPA are a joke.

No, the fact of the matter is, you really want to be served, but you are not willing to do too much yourself. Classic union hater syndrome.

You have problems but you have no solutions. And you want other people to change to meet your satisfaction.

#1 rule when complaining.... offer a solution. I've even suggested ways for you to get involved....

Again.. with compensation that you despise... the BOD, hundreds of fellow pilots, don't agree with you. So now what? Isn't your issue really with them? Have you tried to understand why they don't agree with you?

The good old boy system is so entrenched within ALPA politics no one within the membership has the ability to change anything with the status quo.

The good ol boy system? Maybe, but how does that relate to your statements of how ALPA used to be a good organization but now it is bad? It seems to me that good ol boy is a term of the past. UAL has a female MEC chair now. Is this the good ol boy?

Provide an example of entrenched ALPA politics.

It is all geared around money, dues income and protecting ALPA long before the memberships interest are concerned.

Not really, it is easy to think that way, but it is really about democracy. When you've got 60,000 pilots who all want different things, plus rules, policy, labor law, etc, governing how things are done.... things don't get done that easy... then again... do you want change to happen too quickly? At ALPA or the US govt?

If you feel your dues are going to something worthwhile like the grossly disproportionate pay for union officers, lackluster representation and that stupid glad handing magazine be my guest to enjoy it.

What is your real issue? It seems your airline pilot pay, benefits, QOL and retirement are quit satisfactory, because you don't complain of it.... does your dissatisfaction with ALPA make the spoils of your excellent compensation and time off undesirable....?

What is the bottom line here? I am willing to guess that this career is not what you expected and you are disappointed. And now you are switching gears to law.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

We've gone back and forth on this Rez - there are TOO many non-flying career politician alpa reps.

First off, that is what they are... politicians. That is what ALPA is... a political organization....

Who are the career politicans? Prater? First term. Helsing? First Term. Couette? First term.

There are systems and organizational behavior techniques that could be employed to involve the membership more. You may believe that alpa is the answer- I believe unity is important on the global stage- but it will be in another form if alpa doesn't address some of the corruption/ back-door deal issues.

ALPA or whoever it is, is the deal broker after management/govt agrees to deal. It is grassroots member force that gets the job done, not ALPA. Pilots are inherit leaders in the cockpit, but for some reason they fall apart when it comes to thier careers.

Pilots need to quit looking to ALPA for all the answers and look within...

You can say that we aren't correct as much as you want- but the perception is the reality-and you're losing that battle- leaders take responsibility- they don't blame their membership- there are things that alpa could be doing that would be much more effective than the standard answer from alpa. Any OB textbook would be a good read

Give me three OB ideas applicable to unionism.


Look ALPA has problems and can do better, but being obstructionist and haters is not going to solve any problems. In fact it is very detrimental. Coming up with ideas and working with others will..... that is democracy. If someone things they have a great idea, but no one else does.... that is democracy.....

 

[FrustratedCFI]

Absolutely true that every other contry has an easier time flying here than we do flying anywhere else. The ATP is a quick 3 or 4 day test including training but the JAA is FOREVER and with no reciprocity. If I had my way there would be NO foreigh pilots in the us unless there was 1 for 1 in their country/company

 

[flygirlqt]

Good for you, although if you already inherited it, my condolences on your loss...

I know what you mean about sitting around. I've been sidelined for 6 months now having surgery and recovering from it, and I'm about to go out of my mind here bored to death... If I knew the ALPA FPL was going to continue no matter what and ALPA would allow it, or I found an alternate way to fund my basic income while full-time in school, I'd have already applied for full time Vandy's Spring semester and tried to get my scholarship back they offered me years ago.

Best of luck to you out there.

Appreciate the thoughts but it was years ago and I know he is in a better place now.

Sitting around gets old very fast and must be even worse with an injury or medical issue. I believe the mind atrophies faster than the body and is harder to reclaim a real positive outlook when you become bored. But remember it is never to late to start. Best wishes on your recovery.

Thanks for the wishes for luck.... I might have bit off more than I can chew, especially with my choice of schools, but I am determined to finish my JD degree.

Rez..I have had a long day maybe I'll respond later to your tired worn out ALPA puffing diatribe. Right now it is time for a couple of cold Molsons and I am going to kick back watching another semester fade into oblivion.