Terrorists are practicing....

[Pilot124]

If 16 ME men all acting suspicious on an aircraft doesn't set off red flags to you ATL2CDG you are missing a few screws. Sometimes I really wonder about you and why you play devil advocate to everything. 1 guy acting suspicious gets my attention. I just wish you were on that plane to TALK all 16 into taking their seats and stop acting suspicious. After all YOU are the voice of reason.

 

[ATL2CDG]

enigma :

No, I neither have or deserve any special protection from the Muslim fundamentalists.

Regarding my views about security and freedom, your own signature sums it up nicely : «Those who would trade freedom for security, deserve neither.» I think I've made my position on this topic quite clear and I see no need to reiterate my opinions.

Lastly, to my recollection, I have never «blamed their problems on us».

 

[ThomasR]

One Brief Note:

QUOTE: "All I can say is that we play be the rules. They do not."

The rules are; there are not rules.

 

[ATL2CDG]

Pilot124 :

If you would take the time to re-read all of my contributions to this specific thread, you would see that I have never claimed that sixteen persons of Middle Eastern origin acting questionably would not cause me to be suspicious. All of my remarks to this topic have been in regard to the forced screening of all persons of Middle Eastern origin without just cause or due process. In-depth seaching of ALL persons meeting this criteria is, in my humble opinion, racism. If a Lebanese family of four arrive at the gate, the father is a platinum frequent flyer and the purchase was made 3 months in advance, I would feel advanced security checks would not be necessary. Now, if fifteen Saudi nationals have cash-purchased, one-way tickets that were bought within 2 hours of each other within the past week, that would be cause for concern.

I've never claimed that I could persuade the suspects to take their seats.

I've never claimed to be the voice of reason ; I am simply the voice of an independent-minded, decently-well educated, very bored, radical 24 year old American male. If you want reason, this forum is the wrong place to be in search of it.

 

[100LL... Again!]

Bold idealism coming from someone who, as you put it, is on the wrong side of the cockpit door.

What about 15 young saudis who bought tickets anywhere from 4 months to 4 weeks in advance. Do they get off free?

Mark my words:

If we get hit a few more times successfully, the majority of the public will easily be talked into internment camps.

I think a little 'draconian' screening will BENEFIT the nice arabs by preventing the aforementioned scenario. Otherwise, they could be unfairly swept up in the panicky mob mentality that would surely follow. Don't think internment camp could happen in this day and in the US. Think again. Scared people will amaze you with what they are capable of.

I would not care if I got the full strip-search to travel on El Al. If that is what they must do to prevent needless deaths, then okay.

 

[ATL2CDG]

Bold idealism coming from someone who, as you put it, is on the wrong side of the cockpit door.

Ah, yes. The fact that I enjoy working in the service industry and have not the funds or time to secure the needed ratings to be a commercial airline pilot, I have not the intelligence, experience or simple cognitive ability to formulate complex social, political and cultural theories and related desires. Only pilots are able to conjecture or othewise devise various ideas or thoughts on important topics that affect the world.

Nice way to connect two COMPLETELY unrated facts to make a personal jab at me. Care to have at it again?

 

[Singlecoil]

funny....

I just did a search on Altavista.com of " Northwest Airlines flight #327 from Detroit to Los Angeles"

Nearly 40+ online news websites had the same story...

So much for a A WWS Exclusive Article

I did a google search and only found articles written by this Annie Jacobsen person. How come no other news organization has written about this perplexing incident? A vast ACLU conspiracy? Or maybe its all a bunch of Bull$hit? I'm picking the latter. This whole thing doesn't smell right. My Bull$hit annuciator started flashing as soon as she mentioned Ann Coulter. Her credibility vanished just that fast.
Does anybody else think this is just bogus internet fiction?

 

[FN FAL]

Actually, whether they were conducting a probing excercise, testing our our ability to track them or whatever...they were successful in one thing, spreading fear on that flight and on anyone that has read the article and reacted with feelings of terror.

They don't have to bomb an airliner or kill anyone to be successful in creating terror. All they have to do is scare people.

 

[ATL2CDG]

FN FAL :

I can't believe that I'm thinking this, but « WELL SAID! »

 

[EagleRJ]

If they were terrorists on a trial run, they were sure being obvious, weren't they? You don't need 12 guys to assemble a bomb, either. The trips to the lav might have been a way to distribute weapons, but again, why so obvious?

It could be that they were actually musicians who were merely talking to eachother, but they must have been incredibly naiive not to notice that their actions were suspicious.

If I was on the plane, I would have rushed the lav holding my mouth like I was going to be sick. If the guys waiting were musicians who didn't want to get barfed on, they would move out of the way. If they were terrorists, though, and there was a partially-assembled bomb or a pile of knives in the sink, they would have gone ape-sh*t. In that case, their cover would be blown, and the whole cabin would have rushed them.
In these times, you might have to do something like that to test someone's true intentions.

There have been numerous other incidents that are extremely suspicious and probably were probing attempts, but this one doesn't seem right. I'm guessing it was just a combination of indifference and paranoia, maybe flavored a bit by a reporter who needed a story.

 

[DX Rick]

My question is. Why if they were so threatening or suspicious. Why didn't do anything about it? I think I would have enough of thier games, that they would be pooping Nike for the next year

 

[Typhoon1244]

ATL2CDG...you and your type are responsible for the 9/11 deaths.

Jesus, am I glad somebody finally cleared that up! All this time I thought it was bin Laden and al Qaeda. What's everbody waiting for? Let's go find this ATL2CDG SOB and his kind and string 'em up by their gonads! Then all terrorism will stop.

Okay, having said that...

ATL2CDG, believe me, I sympathize with you, but there comes a time when you have to be realistic. If the 9/11 hijackers had been an equal-opportunity bunch, I'd be right there with you decrying the evils of "profiling." But the fact is that our country (and a lot of other countries, for that matter) have been getting kicked in the teeth by middle eastern men age 17-to-40 for three decades or more. Whether anybody likes it or not, they warrant special attention when it comes to transportation (airlines, cruise ships, rail, etc.). Profiling would suck for the law-abiding Arab-American...but as with so many things, a handful of radical as_holes has ruined it for everybody else.

 

[ATL2CDG]

Let's go find this ATL2CDG SOB and his kind and string 'em up by their gonads!

Finally! My gonads are going to get some much needed attention!

 

[100LL... Again!]

That was my point typhoon, although I used ATL's over the top style that he seems to like so well.

Point is, it IS the PC types such as Mr. ATL who would have screamed bloody murder had GWB pre-emptively locked up these 'poor, innocent' arabs who just wanted to get their pilot's licenses.

Therefore, they bear greater responsibility in the security breakdown that led to 9-11.

Simply put, the security apparatus in this country could not do what it needed to do, because it was hamstrung by the liberal activist mentality.

Look at what they are doing to John Ashcroft. A great American by the way.

 

[ATL2CDG]

Look at what they are doing to John Ashcroft. A great American by the way.

*gag*

You think the Rev. Ashcroft is good for this country? Sure... if you like the suspension of basic civil rights, privacy laws and government neutrality in the world of religion.

*laughs*

Iran called. They wanted their extremist theocratic ideas back.

 

[inline]

I did a google search and only found articles written by this Annie Jacobsen person. How come no other news organization has written about this perplexing incident? A vast ACLU conspiracy? Or maybe its all a bunch of Bull$hit? I'm picking the latter. This whole thing doesn't smell right. My Bull$hit annuciator started flashing as soon as she mentioned Ann Coulter. Her credibility vanished just that fast.
Does anybody else think this is just bogus internet fiction?

When Michael Maggot Moore makes a movie or writes a book, then the New York Times and all the other leftist media take his views as gospel, but Ann Coulter weighing in? Horrors! Then its gotta be Bulls$hit!

 

[Cactus-Wrench]

C R U D, that's an ugly article, but the sad truth is that until the feds can implement policys without having to get approval of civil right leaders, activists, liberals, etc, were just spinning our heels frisking little old ladies old wwii vets.
Anybody that's works in this industry knows that the only real change since 911 is public awareness, the rest is (like pillows and blankets) just public perception. Lord help us if the public gets lax.

 

[SammyG]

So many opinions, so much fear as to what we can do withouth putting our (and others) civil liberties at risk.

-The guys on this NWA flight were up to no good. Can anyone dispute this?

-No one got up and did anything about it. Why? Because they were A.) Afraid that ordering them to sit down and be quiet might cause them to go bezerk and blow try to blow up the plane..B.) Afraid of making the situation worse (they were signaling each other and emptying McDonalds bags into the lavs....whats worse than that....um....blowing up?)...C.) Afraid to be labeled a racist and arrested upon landing for violating the civil rights of VERY suscpicious people.

I'm sorry, and I know it's easy to say because I wasn't there. But isn't it conceivable, that if the situation occured as reported in the article, that there might be SOMEONE on the flight who wasn't afriad of these 3 things happening? SOMEONE, who figured A.) Better to try to get them to sit down in case they ARE trying to blow us up. B.) Better to to make the situation into an "event" than sit down and not find out what the obviously suspicious activity actually was, even if it turned out to be nothing. ...C.) Better to be labeled a racist and arrested on landing, during a flight where many wittnesses would testify as to the susicious activity, and would all probably support your "violation" of their civil liberties as opposed to gambling and allowing them to romp around and do whatever it was that they were doing.

Intresting irony here....We're afraid to profile Arabs, even though a considerable few of them mean us harm, because those who desire to use profiling to protect themselves are then profiled as racists because of the many truly stupid-ass, ignorant bigots that unfortunately outnumber us.

 

[rumpletumbler]

To ensure we Americans never offend anyone - - - particularly fanatics intent on killing us - airport screeners will not be allowed to profile people. They will continue random searches of 80-year-old women, little kids, Airline pilots with proper identification, Secret Service agents who are members of the President's security detail, 85-year old Congressmen with metal hips, and Medal Of Honor winning former Governors.



Let's pause a moment and take the following test.

In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred by:

• (a) Olga Korbut
• (b) Sitting Bull
• (c) Mahatma Gandhi
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1979,the U.S. embassy in Iran was taken over by:

• (a) Flock Of Seagulls
• (b) Distraught Elvis fans
• (c) A tour bus full of grouchy 80-year-old women
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:

• (a) Malcolm X
• (b) Militant lesbians
• (c) Andre The Giant
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1983, the U.S. Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by:

• (a) An Army Corporal
• (b) An M-80
• (c) Geraldo Rivera making up for a slow news day
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked, and a 70 year old American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard by:

• (a) Captain Steubing
• (b) Captain Kidd
• (c) The Little Mermaid
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a U.S. Navy diver was murdered by:

• (a) Aristotle Onassis
• (b) Zorba The Greek
• (c) Mother Teresa
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:

• (a) Maverick & Goose
• (b) Jack Daniels
• (c) Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:

• (a) Crazy Horse
• (b) Tony Montana
• (c) Dennis Rodman
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1998, the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:

• (a) Mr. Rogers
• (b) Hillary, to distract attention from Wild Bill's women problems
• (c) The World Wrestling Federation to promote its next villain: "Mustapha the Merciless"
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked and destroyed, and thousands of people were killed by:

• (a) Bugs Bunny, Wiley E. Coyote, Daffy Duck, and Elmer Fudd
• (b) The Klingons
• (c) Deadheads
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2002 the United States is looking in Afghanistan for:

• (a) Chechnyans
• (b) Nigerian Christians
• (c) Enron employees
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by:

• (a) Bonny and Clyde
• (b) Pretty Boy Floyd
• (c) Floyd the Barber
• (d) Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40.

And don't forget the USS Cole....... Nope, no patterns anywhere to justify profiling.

 

[skeezer]

Someone always posts that quiz and everytime it is lacking one very big thing.

Until 9/11 the largest act of terrorism against the US was committed by a WHITE male who served in the military.

You can profile all you want (and I agree some degree is warranted), but you still cannot rule out everyone else.

Peace!

Skeezer