outerlimits
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 30, 2011
- Posts
- 486
Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
- Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
- Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
- Share the passion for aviation
- Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun
swatogether
- Thread starter scoreboardII
- Start date
- Watchers 31
Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
- Invite your friends
- Share the passion of aviation
- Friendliest aviation community on the web
We had to deal with you now let's see how you deal with us.
Outsourcing is probably something you'll have to embrace to grow your international flying. It's a reciprocity issue. And although I really get disgusted with a lot of you, I wouldn't wish pbs on you. If you're offered a 100% pay raise you should still turn it down. It's that bad.
Pensions becoming something of the past in this profession? Squarely and completely on you.
redflyer65
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2004
- Posts
- 4,456
Ends justifying the means?
No, I'm telling you those guys that you try to crap on for their 'low wages', retired MULTI-millionaires Flop. You understand that don't you? They reaped the rewards as SW flourished. It's part of the story that doesn't fit you agenda....so you ignore it.
401k vs. Pensions. Which one turned out better?
No, I get that Red. My point is: what if going thru bk proves to be what legacy pilots use as a springboard to retiring multimillionaires? Having shed the debt and with what looks like insane profits ahead, some version of that could happen.
And I agree 401ks have pensions beat, for now. What if 401ks were abandoned by one of our competitors to undercut both of us? You going to be cheering them on? You guys were running around ripping everyone's nuts off, now you're crying foul when someone might rip yours off.
Last edited:
HowardBorden
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2013
- Posts
- 889
You really can't be serious. Are you that obtuse or is your blind hatred for all things Southwest so strong that you must find a way to link all your misfortune to some one else?
http://fapa.aero/content.asp?id=80&Gateway=Career
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Pilots today are at risk--of various degrees--of losing some of their pension benefits. This is a scary statement, but it is also a true one. [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]What is happening, though, is that for several years the stock market has experienced a general decline. Simultaneously, interest rates are at 40-year lows, and interest rates play a major role in determining funding levels. Add to that the cash-flow crisis at most airlines, which makes it difficult for them to contribute the extra funds required to keep the pension adequately funded. This is what some have termed "the perfect storm" of pension underfunding, as all of these variables play a role in what is currently happening in the airline industry and others.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I missed the part where it says it's all Southwest's fault.
[/FONT]
redflyer65
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2004
- Posts
- 4,456
I'm not crying foul on anything. Just don't like revisionist history.
As far as legacy guys coming out from under bankruptcy and getting millions in retirement funds...I'd be happy for them too. I don't wish ill on those guys. I think it's a good thing for each pilot group to do well.
I don't blame the pilots of any of these work groups for the crappy management decisions these guys made. And there really were some horrible decisions. If you worked at NW, DL, UAL, US or CO...what could the employees do but sit in disbelief and watch? So it was really the executives that sent them all through bankruptcy. Poorly, poorly run companies. For years.
As far as legacy guys coming out from under bankruptcy and getting millions in retirement funds...I'd be happy for them too. I don't wish ill on those guys. I think it's a good thing for each pilot group to do well.
I don't blame the pilots of any of these work groups for the crappy management decisions these guys made. And there really were some horrible decisions. If you worked at NW, DL, UAL, US or CO...what could the employees do but sit in disbelief and watch? So it was really the executives that sent them all through bankruptcy. Poorly, poorly run companies. For years.
Turtle21
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 8, 2007
- Posts
- 1,683
PBS started at the regionals and is currently at more regionals than majors, from what I hear. That alone speaks volumes... Even if not true I have never seen it benefit employees to give the company more decision making power and employees less.
Suppose you look at the world through other than Unical-colored glasses. "Pensions becoming something of the past" is not even an airline-specific phenomenon, let alone something Southwest created. Private businesses over the spectrum are going this way, due to lots of economy-related factors: thinner profit margins, retirees living longer, spiraling healthcare costs, changing demographics and their demand from industry/technology; you name it. Defined benefits-based retirement plans are being replaced by defined contribution-based plans the world over. Even municipalities, which historically roll over and give their unions whatever they want are going this way. Hell, even the military is trying to do this.
Blaming Southwest for this just shows your anti-anything-that-has-to-do-with-SWA bias.
Bubba
nwaf16dude
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2008
- Posts
- 305
Jesus, that is obscene! Same pic at mamma D. We pilots are just fighting for the scraps from those b@stards.
Toecutter
going underground
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2002
- Posts
- 89
...and that's the one pay scale that AirTran had that was higher than SWA.
PHL? Really? Who gives a sh** about that rathole? We made tons of money carrying 45 Us Air lifer F/Os every day from PIT to PHL. They looked like they had the life sucked out of them from those AWESOME Europe trips.
Enjoy flying your dash 8 to Allentown
Last edited:
Roomwithaview
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 6, 2005
- Posts
- 494
Flopout
We held the line while you guys allowed your work to be farmed out, thru bankruptcy, and 40% wage cuts. Gutting of "A" funds, SCABbing and then the ALPULL scab forgiveness.
From where I sit we did a pretty awesome job while you dudes were getting your asses handed to you-You're welcome.
We tought you all to take control over your retirement money, early and often (100% vesting). Additionally, we have the only 401k where you can invest 95% of your assets as you see fit in the market. Govt rules and regs being the only restrictions. SWA files bk, shuts the doors tomorrow, we're full vested.
Evolve or die
We already have-And quite well I might add.
We held the line while you guys allowed your work to be farmed out, thru bankruptcy, and 40% wage cuts. Gutting of "A" funds, SCABbing and then the ALPULL scab forgiveness.
From where I sit we did a pretty awesome job while you dudes were getting your asses handed to you-You're welcome.
Oops! Forgot PBS. Thanks for the reminder. We'll see on the outsourcing. You're welcome on that one as well since we set the new std for keeping codeshare at bay.
BS and you know it. Weak at best. Bankruptcy and the unsympathetic public are your biggest enemies. That and the "save the A fund" at any cost that didn't work for APA either.
We tought you all to take control over your retirement money, early and often (100% vesting). Additionally, we have the only 401k where you can invest 95% of your assets as you see fit in the market. Govt rules and regs being the only restrictions. SWA files bk, shuts the doors tomorrow, we're full vested.
Evolve or die
slaquer5
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 21, 2005
- Posts
- 1,282
Flop is based in HOU. He could car less about his brothers getting kicked out of CLE.
Flop only cares about Flop .
RLAblows
like a man possessed
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2006
- Posts
- 238
That's rich coming from a Southwest guy. Now get out there pull your gear pins on your 300.
Roomwithaview
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 6, 2005
- Posts
- 494
CLE might be going away, but it's not gone yet. In fact, if you were informed you would know it was primarily express flying. Which is a reduction of outsourced flying, and for a moment had me thinking you SWA guys would appreciate the reduction in outsourced flying. Is that at all the case? Or are you just acting like a-holes?
Share this page
Latest resources
-
-
-
-
-
AC 90-89C - Amateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing HandbookAmateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing Handbook
- Neal
- Updated:
