SWA pilot rejects FDX

[Huck]

One extra 7-8 hour duty period puts another 6 hours pay in my pocket

Brotha man, you didn't just say that, did you??????????

 

[propjob27]

I have never heard a FedEx pilot say that he enjoys his job... you know, the part about actually flying airplanes. Someone from purple please tell me that you like to fly and aren't just trying to get a free lunch... please.

Did any of you guys take any financial classes in college? The best investment out there is the one you put the least amount into, and get the most out of.

My job is an investment in myself and my future, so I look at it just like Finance 101.

You guys probably haven't heard the cliche "Work smarter, not harder" either from the sounds of things.

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

you mean you would rather be unemployed that fly for the largest most profitable cargo airline in the world with the best vacation policy, retirement plan and work rules. i guess you don't want to fly widebodies all over the world or even domestically....i guess u don't want to retire a millionaire...and FDX is about 60% dayflying now...you aren't too bright huh?

Dude! Your company would love to have you negotiating for your fellow pilots when your contract comes up. I agree that y'all have it pretty good, but you can't let the head honcho's in MEM know that. Jeez.

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

Quite frankly its about time management woke up. Why in the hell would you pay someone to literally sit on their A$$ all that time. If they want to do that thats fine but dont pay them full salary for it. Time for people to start working.

Duh Angelo, I thought you had quit your regional job and went to work for Wal-Marts' corporate flight department....since you really don't care about pay, or benefits, or how much you do or don't fly....I mean, it's really all about shareholder value isn't it?

 

[Wingsweep]

Never fails to amaze me...

I flew with an engineer who flew all of three times in the last two months, and he's a new hire. He told me he sometimes forgets he actually has a job. Life's what you make of it, ground floor and all.

As far as I'm concerned, anyone who brags about how little they work should go get their unemployment vaccine renewed. ws p.s. I'll lay even money they are the same ones who complain most about work rules.

 

[D'Angelo]

Duh Angelo, I thought you had quit your regional job and went to work for Wal-Marts' corporate flight department....since you really don't care about pay, or benefits, or how much you do or don't fly....I mean, it's really all about shareholder value isn't it?

All im saying is its quite frankly insanity to pay people to sit on their arse all the time. You don't want senior people bidding reserve. Not only are they not doing anything but you have to pay them even more money. The goal is to find a way to make people work as much as possible on reserve. Reduce the staffing level. If you have guys sitting around never flying then obviously your overstaffed. Reserves should be flown right up to the monthly limit but not an hour more. You pay them a monthly guarantee why not make them work for it? You always need someone on call for sick calls so some days reserves may not work. Having them work once in two months is simply absurd. Airlines wonder why they are always in trouble!!! It starts with these ridiculous work rules. Good thing they are starting to make people actually work again.

 

[stonewall]

I like my job. And night hub-turning really isn't THAT bad. It sounds sh*tty, but you can actually enjoy the layovers and not be draggin' a** if you plan your sleep right. I usually get 6-8 hrs of sleep a day (from 7 am - 2 or 3pm), eat right, get a good workout in (never rushed), and then go to work. If you're one of those guys that just can't sleep during the day, then I guess it wouldn't work for you. However, it can be tough to get back on a normal schedule once you're done with a week of it. If night hub turns don't work for you, you can fairly quickly bid day Reserve or when you're senior enough bid day flying.

Less than year right now to widebody F/O. LOTS of day flying on the Bus, and it'll eventually be day on your international MD-11 hops. There are some valid reasons for turning down FDX, but night hub-turns SHOULD NOT be one of them. You will do them in the beginning, but not often enough to outweigh all the advantages to FDX. And, again, they look horrible on paper but they ARE manageable.

 

[propjob27]

Reserves should be flown right up to the monthly limit but not an hour more.

I think we spoke on the phone before. Did you used to work for Great Lakes? In the planning department? If your airline career doesn't pan out, you'll always have a job waiting for you as a scheduler.

Airlines wonder why they are always in trouble!!! It starts with these ridiculous work rules. Good thing they are starting to make people actually work again.

Airlines are in trouble. FedEX definately is NOT. Just let them keep on doing what they've been doing. It's worked fine for a LONG time. If we start to post some quarterly losses, well, then maybe think about changing some things. But until then, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

[Huck]

If you don't like reserves sittin', you DEFINITELY won't like the ~30 or so standby pilots who come in every night into the hub, sleep 5 hours in a company sleep room, then go home. Dozing for dollars.Of course, if they call, you're supposed to be BLOCKED OUT in 45 minutes (a tall order when your MD11 is parked 2 miles away).By the way, firemen get paid to sit around alot too.....

 

[D'Angelo]

I think we spoke on the phone before. Did you used to work for Great Lakes? In the planning department? If your airline career doesn't pan out, you'll always have a job waiting for you as a scheduler.



Airlines are in trouble. FedEX definately is NOT. Just let them keep on doing what they've been doing. It's worked fine for a LONG time. If we start to post some quarterly losses, well, then maybe think about changing some things. But until then, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Never worked for great lakes or been in crew scheduling. Those work rules are a big part of the reason why airlines are in trouble. Its simply bad buisness paying someone to do nothing. A good way to do this is reduce the lines a little bit and assign some flying to reserves. That way you pay your lineholders a bit less and you have to pay your reserves guarantee anyway. There is absolutely no reason why you cant find a way to give enough flying to reserves to build them right upto but not one minute past the monthly minimum. Sure if you get a sick call you may have to take some people over the minimum. For the most part however this is the best way to do things. Sorry the days of paying people to sit on their A$$ are over.

 

[HoursHore]

If you don't like reserves sittin', you DEFINITELY won't like the ~30 or so standby pilots who come in every night into the hub, sleep 5 hours in a company sleep room, then go home. Dozing for dollars.Of course, if they call, you're supposed to be BLOCKED OUT in 45 minutes (a tall order when your MD11 is parked 2 miles away).By the way, firemen get paid to sit around alot too.....

The FedEx ring tone in the sleep rooms automatically gets my heart rate up to around 180, even is I hear it in the AOC in the middle of the day.

By the way D angelo, I worked just shy of Reserve guarantee last month as a DC-10 SO, so stop crying. Must have been grandparents awareness month or something.

And yes paying people to sit around is stupid, unless you need the reliablity that said stupidity gives you. FDX is a shipping company known for its reliablity and not an airline who flies people.

 

[USMCFDX]

Or you can spend the bucks to fly three crews from MEM to ANC on the company Lear Jet since ANC pilots are not taking draft trips.

Hard to sell a draft trip anyway during the summer up here anyway. ANC pilots are sick a lot during the summer for some reason. I guess June and Jule is cold and flu season up here.

Also had the bottom two reserve line holders were inverse converted from R days to trips, and many people are having R days moved around to cover trips. So your more trips for the reserves theory is shot since they can not even cover ANC trips with ANC pilots. They are shipping them up from MEM to cover.

 

[Huck]

Must have been grandparents awareness month or something.

HA! I spent a year at the bottom of that list - 12 months on A reserve. Funny how every time I got short-called it was to some place raining or snowing.... Can't wait until they're all in the left seat until 65, blowing through their sick leave before they leave.

 

[Diesel]

The original post was about the pilot who decided that FDX wasn't for HIM. Him and hopefully his family looked at the PRO's and CON's of what he needed to do for THEM and HIMSELF.

He didn't bash FDX he just said thanks but no thanks. Whatever the reason was it was HIS reason.

Who really cares night or day, peanuts or catering, domestic or international. Its all time away from family and a personal choice.

 

[Ty Webb]

Its simply bad buisness paying someone to do nothing.

Duh Cameltoe, you really are a doorknob, aren't you? I bet you carry knee pads in your flight case and a little jar of vaseline, with some sand mixed in it.

A good way to do this is reduce the lines a little bit and assign some flying to reserves. That way you pay your lineholders a bit less and you have to pay your reserves guarantee anyway.

Uhhh, then who is covering the reserve pilots who are flying pairings, when they get sick or are illegal? Downline drafts at 150% pay, creating 30/7 problems later in the week, requiring . . . . you guessed it, more down-line drafting, more premium pay, or more use of reserves.

There is absolutely no reason why you cant find a way to give enough flying to reserves to build them right upto but not one minute past the monthly minimum.

You seem to think you know all the answers, but you really don't have a clue. My company used to operate like you are suggesting, before the union forced them to up the percentage of reserve pilots. Know what? Our pilot costs per ASM went DOWN when they had to add more reserve pilots, because they weren't paying premium pay for everything that they couldn't cover without drafting. Before the change, much of what guys were making was in the form of premium pay, probably because some chowderhead like you was tripping over quarters to pick up nickles.

Let me guess . . . you'd solve that problem by eliminating premium pay, too. Bet you fly broke airplanes and love to volunteer to do stuff that everyone else refuses . . . one like you in every flight dept.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Well, let's think about this. You are management and here are your choices:

1. Pay a crew to sit in the hub, or at home/crashpad on reserve and pay them about $600 each even if they don't go flying.

2. Save $1800 and then have a crew go sick and not be able to deliver a planeload full of packages with an estimated revenue of hundreds of thousands of dollars; and then have your business model crumble because you lost market share since you couldn't deliver on your promise.

Your call D? Whatya gonna do?


It's about reliability!

Duh Angelo is incapable of thinking more than one step ahead of the game. You'd think this would be obvious to him, but he's proven himself yet once again with his narrow-mindedness.

Think about how much money in overnight packages are on these planes? What's the smallest aircraft there, the 727? That's still alot of rubber dog ******************** to be delivered....and if it doesn't get there ontime, eventually your customers will move onto your competition.

 

[TheBaron]

The original post was about the pilot who decided that FDX wasn't for HIM. Him and hopefully his family looked at the PRO's and CON's of what he needed to do for THEM and HIMSELF.

He didn't bash FDX he just said thanks but no thanks. Whatever the reason was it was HIS reason.

Who really cares night or day, peanuts or catering, domestic or international. Its all time away from family and a personal choice.

I think maybe you missed the intent of the original post. The guy didn't pass on FDX for SWA; he passed on FDX in ANC with the misguided belief he will be called later for an opening in MEM. He still wants FedEx, just under his own conditions.

Maybe this will help clear it up.

Example:
Lottery official: Congratulations Mr. Jones, you have just won the lottery, can you come down to the state office to pick up your money...

Mr Jones: Can you deliver it to me?

Lottery official: Sorry Mr. Jones, we need you at the state office for a press conference and to fill out some paperwork.

Mr. Jones: That's OK. I think I'll just pass on it for now. Maybe later the rules will change and I will win again.

 

[cgri591982t44a]

Well I am glad he passed it up because I was the lucky SOB to get the last minute call to replace him in class. Who ever he is I owe him beer for life THANKS!!!!

 

[Whine Lover]

"If you live an average life span (76 yrs.) you'll get 27,777/year. Are you sure you're retiring, or are you moving on to another job?"

Well that would be a straight draw every year and that is NO way to structure a retirement. (!)

Now, $750,000 properly invested and assuming a conservative 6% return annually gives one about $45,000/yr to live on without even touching the principal.

If a person has no mortgage, car payments, or debts and is single one can do quite well.

A nice cottage near a lake, a pickup and a good duck boat are really all a man needs in life...( certainly, this is an oversimplification but you get the idea.)

And if a fella' can't eat well, take a few vacations, and buy a few beers on $45,000/yr, well he's got some serious money management problems to begin with and will probably be flying until he's 75 for some non-sched in Africa anyway.

Ouch.

 

[Diesel]

The email said that he declined because he was headed to anc. It says nothing about him still wanting FDX. He must have known that if he turned it down chances are slim that he was going to get called again.

Whatever it was it was his choice.

PS whats up with the screwed up with the screwed up screen name of cgri591982t44a . I'm sure there is some story behind it.

 

[kingairyahoo]

A nice cottage near a lake, a pickup and a good duck boat are really all a man needs in life...( certainly, this is an oversimplification but you get the idea.)

ding-ding-ding...we have a winner!

 

[propjob27]

He must have known that if he turned it down chances are slim that he was going to get called again.

To be honest, I would have thought the guy would have been OK passing on the ANC class, and would have gotten called again when MEM classes started.

As long as he was polite and apologetic about it, I don't see why there was a big problem. For YEARS and YEARS, the ONLY place new hires at FedEX have gone has been MEM (and SFS, voluntary only). So when the guy started applying, which he likely did several years ago, he was 100% expecting to get based in MEM. Now, at the last second, we start sending new hires to ANC. Thats a real shock when you were 100% certain you were going to get MEM.

Maybe he lives in Little Rock and has three little kids in elementary school. Maybe his wife has some kind of home business there. Maybe the grandparents live there too and help take care of the kids. He might have just been in an impossible situation to move to ANC, and did not want to commute that kind of distance his probationary year.

FedEX has seemed to me to be a very understanding company of situations like that. You have any family or personal problem in training, they'll pull you right out and send you back when you're ready. No questions asked. They are really big on the importance of family around here.

As long as he wasn't a di c k on the phone to KD, "Nah, my wife doesn't want ANC. Hah Hah Hah! Call me when there's a MEM class.", then I don't see why there was a problem. Maybe he just came across wrong during that phone call.

I think they were a little hard on the beaver.

 

[mule]

As long as he was polite and apologetic about it, I don't see why there was a big problem.

Maybe he lives in Little Rock and has three little kids in elementary school. Maybe his wife has some kind of home business there. Maybe the grandparents live there too and help take care of the kids. He might have just been in an impossible situation to move to ANC, and did not want to commute that kind of distance his probationary year.

Maybe he should have given more than a day's notice that he wasn't going to take the class....

 

[propjob27]

Maybe he should have given more than a day's notice that he wasn't going to take the class....

Ok, I completely missed that part of the story. I thought he declined the class on the initial "you're hired!" phone call, not called back the day before class saying "No thanks put me in a MEM class"

If he did that, well, then yeah, I wouldn't ask him back either.

My mistake.

 

[optimater]

The best thing about this thread is that no one really rejected FedEx ANC. If anyone had read the thread, they would notice this is what it said.

"I can't imagine ANYBODY doing this, but, could you imagine." And then he proceeds into his Mr. Jones, KD conversation.

And we wonder how rumors get started.

 

[Rekks Inbound]

D'Angelo,
You obviously don't understand what reserves are. Think insurance policy. You pay a premium every year for homeowners, or auto, life, or health insurance. How often do you collect on that? The answer for most people in this country is NEVER! And yet we all pay out those premiums.

Reserves are a cost of doing business, and in theory should not be used except for currency issues. Just like you should never hopefully have to make a claim on your car or home insurance.

Rekks

 

[propjob27]

The best thing about this thread is that no one really rejected FedEx ANC. If anyone had read the thread, they would notice this is what it said.

"I can't imagine ANYBODY doing this, but, could you imagine." And then he proceeds into his Mr. Jones, KD conversation.

Huh?

From a JL e-mail...

One pool person from Southwest declined
to come because he was headed for Anchorage.

It sounds to me like someone definately DID reject FedEX ANC.

 

[Diesel]

Maybe he interviewd for the experience with no realy thought of taking the job.

 

[TheBaron]

The best thing about this thread is that no one really rejected FedEx ANC. If anyone had read the thread, they would notice this is what it said.

"I can't imagine ANYBODY doing this, but, could you imagine." And then he proceeds into his Mr. Jones, KD conversation.

And we wonder how rumors get started.

Maybe you missed the first post which was an excerpt from JL's e-mail (or FCIF).
"One pool person from Southwest declined
to come because he was headed for Anchorage."
No Rumor

 

[sandman2122]

I learned this a loooong time ago not to pass judgment on others when you don't know all the facts - or it's really none of your business. That being said who knows, or should care, why this individual passed on an ANC job offer. Sounds like a slow night on Flightinfo for the rumormill.......

Try not to let ego's get bruised over this - go out and have a beer, or two......AND talk to some college chicks over at the local bar!! They dig pilots.

Now back to my brew and to chase down that brunette I call my wife....