SWA memphis

[RVR300]

SWAdude, I stand corrected. I guess my confidence level was a little higher than yours was when we interviewed. Obviously it worked out well for each of us.

But you're pushing this prep thing onto these guys making it sound like they will be disadvantaged if they don't do it. And, using your position as a member of the interview team gives it officiality, and you know that is not the official company line.

 

[SWAdude]

SWAdude, I stand corrected. I guess my confidence level was a little higher than yours was when we interviewed. Obviously it worked out well for each of us.

But you're pushing this prep thing onto these guys making it sound like they will be disadvantaged if they don't do it. And, using your position as a member of the interview team gives it officiality, and you know that is not the official company line.

I'm not pushing anything. Its up to the individual and how they want to approach the opportunity. Some would be at a disadvantage if they didn't prep. Some would not. I'm not trying to suggest anything of the sort. Just supporting the option. Prep is also a benefit to the company. It can allow us to really get to know the person. It helps relax them. I have no doubt that we have not hired great people because the interview was difficult for them. Prep has been a large part of this business for going on 20 years. Remember FAPA? Irv Jazinski? I am no longer a member of the team and I would not be partaking in this type of discussion if I was. I have been very clear that I am a former member of the team on any of my posts that I have mentioned this experience. Once again you are just plain wrong. So tell me. Your in the know. What is the "companies official line". In all the symposiums that I attended and meetings with Paul Sterbenz then Greg Crum the Team had weekly during interviews, not once was preparation a subject or for that matter even mentioned.

This all started with this post from you:

"DON'T PREP.

Prep yourself: Write down every question you can think they might ask you, then answer them yourself.

Who would you rather talk to, a ANG mx who went forth and got his time and ratings, etc; OR A ROBOT WITH PROGRAMMED ANSWERS?

Trust me, be yourself. Don't be everyone else."

Then someone challenged you and you said:

"Okay guys, I just work there, what do I know."

Thats when I chimed in. You give advice to some that sounds like an authority when you are not. Prep is not a bad thing and you make it sound like the team knows when one has received it when that also is not true. The more you try to sound like an expert on this issue the more credibility you lose.

Were you more confident than I going through the interview? Maybe. But I think you certainly were more arrogant. Congratulations on earning the job 8 years ago.

Respectfully,

SWAdude

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

And by the way, out interview team can smell an interview prep answer a mile away. This is what they do.

I thought they did a better job of sniffing out dickheads than this!

 

[canyonblue]

I believe the reason is simple; they do not portray their strengths and personality when they tell a story, because they do not know "how" to tell a story effectively.

Kathy

Well I sure found a way to portray my strength and personality in story telling for my interview which I recommend to all:

"It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was open time"

 

[RVR300]

"It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was open time"

Canyon,
Now that is funny! I don't think I've ever picked up an open time trip that didn't somehow turn into a complete cluster! But it does make the job more interesting.

I know SWAdude will jump on this, but a direct quote from a good friend who is currently on the interview team, when I asked if my other bud should do the prep, he said: "NO, we hate that."

THAT is from the source. SWAdude may not agree with it, and many of you guys on here may not as well, but I'm passing along what was told to me by the guy in the comfy seat.

 

[SWAdude]

RVR300,

Ask your friend how he can tell with certainty who and who hasn't received the prep. It was NEVER an issue when I was there.

Were not talking about your "imaginary" friends are we. I find it interesting that you have found a "good" friend on the team during this discussion. Why didn't you say that to begin with??

No credibility.

 

[RVR300]

SWAdude,
I wasn't aware one had to post their qualifications on here before posting. But you obviously won't let this go.

With all that is Holy, I do indeed have a good friend currently on the interview team, who has given me the information which I have posted here. This individual has earned my admiration and respect. I flew with him as a First Officer years ago and have used his cockpit management skills as the basis for my own. Out of all the Captains I flew with as an FO, this is the one that really stands out. There is probably no one in our company better suited to conduct interviews. So you'll have to forgive me if I hold his viewpoints and advice a few rungs higher than your attack-style barbs against mine.

It serves absolutely ZERO purpose to proport any knowledge or inside info for the prospective new hires that would be to their detriment.

As far as their ability to 'spot' a prepped guy, I imagine its about the same as being able to tell within a few minutes of meeting, the background of your first officers.

In any case, I don't doubt you have these guys best interests at heart, as do I. I just wish you could acknowledge another viewpoint besides your own. You are for prep, and said you wished you had done it; I'm not, and didn't, and will continue to pass along my friend's advice to anyone who asks.

 

[SWAdude]

You are for prep, and said you wished you had done it

RVR300,

Show me where I said that. My direct quote:

"I too interviewed at SWA and got the job without any prep. But I can also see where prep would have benefitted me even more."

Again, you have no credibility.


I imagine its about the same as being able to tell within a few minutes of meeting, the background of your first officers.

No, Your imagination is wrong.


I just wish you could acknowledge another viewpoint besides your own.

I have. My direct quote:

"I'm not pushing anything. Its up to the individual and how they want to approach the opportunity. Some would be at a disadvantage if they didn't prep. Some would not. I'm not trying to suggest anything of the sort. Just supporting the option."

You seem to think there is no option. And that is terrible advice. And I quote you again:

"DON'T PREP.

Prep yourself: Write down every question you can think they might ask you, then answer them yourself.

Who would you rather talk to, a ANG mx who went forth and got his time and ratings, etc; OR A ROBOT WITH PROGRAMMED ANSWERS?

Trust me, be yourself. Don't be everyone else."


So you'll have to forgive me if I hold his viewpoints and advice a few rungs higher than your attack-style barbs against mine.


I'm sorry you feel like your being attacked. You are just plainly passing off bad information.

If all your looking for is for me to admit that both are acceptable. I do. Never thought otherwise. But I'm certainly not going to discourage anyone asking for help on either or any front.

Remember RVR300, this thread is about someone seeking some information so they might be able to better themselves. And you flat told them not to. That is very self-righteous.

 

[RVR300]

Dude you sound like an angry guy.
Sorry you think I lack credibility. Sorry I disagree with you. Sorry you can't let it go. Oh, and sorry I paraphrased when I should have gone back, copied, bold typed, and pasted your direct quote.

Actually, you sound like one of the regulars in the RP.

But I'll give in to this: if a guy thinks he needs prep, then he should get it. If you feel qualified, confident, and secure, then don't. But all you've done here is make these guys second guess themselves; criticizing my advise, questioning my credibility, etc. Your theme is very familiar. Are you sure you're not a regular in the RP? Maybe on the editorial board?

If that makes me sound self righteous, well I'm sorry, because I'm not. As a matter of fact, I'm about the most altruistic person you'll ever meet. SWA hired me because of my personality. My resume is what got me in the door, but the person is what got me the job offer.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

SWA hired me because of my personality.

 

[TonyC]

I second that.

 

[SWAdude]

Dude you sound like an angry guy.
Sorry you think I lack credibility. Sorry I disagree with you. Sorry you can't let it go. Oh, and sorry I paraphrased when I should have gone back, copied, bold typed, and pasted your direct quote.

Actually, you sound like one of the regulars in the RP.

But I'll give in to this: if a guy thinks he needs prep, then he should get it. If you feel qualified, confident, and secure, then don't. But all you've done here is make these guys second guess themselves; criticizing my advise, questioning my credibility, etc. Your theme is very familiar. Are you sure you're not a regular in the RP? Maybe on the editorial board?

If that makes me sound self righteous, well I'm sorry, because I'm not. As a matter of fact, I'm about the most altruistic person you'll ever meet. SWA hired me because of my personality. My resume is what got me in the door, but the person is what got me the job offer.

RVR300,

You are a wonderful person. You get the last word. Happy holidays.

SWAdude

 

[InHot]

To Prep or Not to Prep

Interesting discussion.

My .02 - Three interviews at SWA. Got hired the third time. Did the interview prep for the 3rd interview. Maybe it was just a coincidence?

You decide.

Merry Christmas to all.

 

[Hobiehawker]

DON'T PREP.

Prep yourself: Write down every question you can think they might ask you, then answer them yourself.

Who would you rather talk to, a ANG mx who went forth and got his time and ratings, etc; OR A ROBOT WITH PROGRAMMED ANSWERS?

Trust me, be yourself. Don't be everyone else.

I have been a lurker for a long time and as read this entire thread I nod at SWAdude's posts and shake my head at yours. I have spent over 20 grand for my ratings and I just spent another 6 on my type. Why on earth would I not spend another 300 bucks for preparation and a little effort for what I am going to assume my one shot at my dream job. I don't care how confident I am about myself. Why would you tell anyone not to do that. Do you not prepare using all the available resources for your checkride? Why would you let the checkride of your life slip by not doing the same? Most all I know have recieved the preparation and came out very glad they did. Even the ones not offered jobs. In another thread you say that 99 percent are great people. So how is preparation messing the system up.



I appreciate your time and input.

 

[RVR300]

There seems to be this idea out there that you can't get hired here if you don't do the secret southwest prep course. Look at all you guys who have jumped on me for not agreeing with you. The former AA, former interviewer now line guy certainly let his AA colors come through and questioned my credibility. I post a direct quote from a fellow insider and he thinks I'm lying about it.

I think it's absolutely brilliant these prep courses. They've made you all think you can't possibly be good enough to do it on your own.

For my part, I'd rather talk to someone and hear what's really going on inside them then a springloaded answer given to them by a prep service.

But that's just me. If you guys feel that the prep is something that you can't live without, then do it. What's unfortunate is the feeling here on this forum that you'd be disadvantaged if you don't.

 

[Resume Writer]

I think it's absolutely brilliant these prep courses. They've made you all think you can't possibly be good enough to do it on your own.

RVR, I cannot speak for the other prep people on this board, but I believe if you check my posts, you will see that I have said that not everyone needs prep. I have never said that people cannot do it on their own.

For my part, I'd rather talk to someone and hear what's really going on inside them then a springloaded answer given to them by a prep service.

Like it or not, the people that sit on hiring boards, for the most part, are judging every answer that someone provides. As I said before, (and as SWInflight said) if someone does not know how to tell a story, then it makes the job much more difficult for the interviewer. I do not give people "spring-loaded" answers. I teach them to tell a story effectively.

Part of being a professional in the interview prep business (not just someone that does this as a hobby), is the amount of time spent talking with HR people, reading up on the subject and helping people to frame stories that will help them; not hurt them.

Do I assist people with challenges in their background? Absolutely! Should someone not be given another chance because of a poor choice made many years ago? I don't think so. As long as a person has learned from their mistakes, and is sincere about it, then they deserve another chance.

Let me tell you this. If someone comes to me and has not learned their lesson from a previous mistake or acts cocky, I will call them on it. I tell them how that will appear to the interviewer and how they will blow their chances. Ultimately, if they do not listen to me, I cannot help them. Thankfully, I have been very lucky and have had wonderful people that I have worked with that truly want the help; not just to punch some card saying they did interview prep.

What's unfortunate is the feeling here on this forum that you'd be disadvantaged if you don't.

Let's turn that phrase around. Instead of being "disadvantaged," let's say they are being "competitive." As I stated before, no one ever teaches people how to interview. Further, if you have not been on the other side of the desk hiring people, which, by the way, I did for 6 years, then you are at a disadvantage, in my opinion. The behavioral and situational questions are asked for a reason; to obtain an answer from which they can form an opinion about the person's character, leadership and ability to handle problems.

Effective interviewing skills from an HR perspective is something they work on constantly. Do you think that SWA just sends people into the room without any guidelines as to what they are looking for? They have to write their opinions after each question on the form, which is then used in the hiring boards. Those notes are based on perception.

I will agree with you that if someone comes in with "canned answers," then they do not deserve the job. However, if that is what people are doing, then they were not prepped correctly in the first place.

Kathy

 

[miles otoole]

RVR's a tool

 

[Juvat]

The first thing I did was to read Cheryl Cage's book: "Checklist for Success." It explains how you really need to know yourself and your personal flying history well enough before you can tell others your stories. I spent weeks looking over my logbooks and doing some soul searching to really understand "who I am."

The next thing I did was ask my wife to ask me some of the example interview questions out of Cage's book. About 3 questions into our mock interview, I said "I feel like a dork." My very kind and supportive wife agreed with me.

With that, I signed up for an interview prep session. I wasn't interested in getting a bunch of canned answers (nor was my paid consultant.) I just wanted to be able to correctly deliver what was already inside of me and struggling to get out. It was the best $300 I ever spent. When I went to my SWA interview, I felt relaxed, excited, and yes, a little bit nervous. But most of all, I knew who I was, and I knew how to present myself so that others could get to know me in a short period of time.

There are some interesting opinions in this thread, and I've enjoyed reading them. I like to see opposing points of view, especially from people who know what they're talking about (ie: SWA CAs with more time in the flare than I have total time). Since I just interviewed 6 months ago, and my pool time is going to end in 2 weeks (Jan 10 class!!), I thought I could add my .02 FWIW. I hope it helps.

Good luck to you!

 

[SWAdude]

The former AA, former interviewer now line guy certainly let his AA colors come through and questioned my credibility. .

What colors are you showing?

I try to give you the last word and you can't leave it alone. You have first hand ignorance on this subject.

 

[Hobiehawker]

Swadude, I am sorry that my post brought out a rather personal response from RVR300. That was not my intent. I too question his credibility based on his responses. I have read all of this thread again and see nowhere that anyone has said or given the impression that you can't get hired here if you don't do the secret southwest prep course. RVR300, Why are you so emotional about this??

 

[SWAdude]

Swadude, I am sorry that my post brought out a rather personal response from RVR300.

No worries. One of the interesting sides of this type of format is some get to hide behind an alias and say what they normally wouldn't. One had better have a thick skin to partake in this kind of forum.

RVR is thinking that getting prep is some kind of mask that one wears to the interview and I think differently. Neither one will guarantee a result one way or another. I think he's getting frustrated that most if not all disagree with him.

Or maybe I'm senior and younger than him and that really pisses him off.

Respectfully,

SWAdude

 

[SWA/FO]

Hey SWAdude hire my buddy!!! Great guy

 

[JTB]

Send a pm to AlbieF15

The first thing I did was to read Cheryl Cage's book: "Checklist for Success." It explains how you really need to know yourself and your personal flying history well enough before you can tell others your stories. I spent weeks looking over my logbooks and doing some soul searching to really understand "who I am."


The next thing I did was ask my wife to ask me some of the example interview questions out of Cage's book. About 3 questions into our mock interview, I said "I feel like a dork." My very kind and supportive wife agreed with me.

With that, I signed up for an interview prep session. I wasn't interested in getting a bunch of canned answers (nor was my paid consultant.) I just wanted to be able to correctly deliver what was already inside of me and struggling to get out. It was the best $300 I ever spent. When I went to my SWA interview, I felt relaxed, excited, and yes, a little bit nervous. But most of all, I knew who I was, and I knew how to present myself so that others could get to know me in a short period of time.

There are some interesting opinions in this thread, and I've enjoyed reading them. I like to see opposing points of view, especially from people who know what they're talking about (ie: SWA CAs with more time in the flare than I have total time). Since I just interviewed 6 months ago, and my pool time is going to end in 2 weeks (Jan 10 class!!), I thought I could add my .02 FWIW. I hope it helps.

Good luck to you!

needsumluv,
Emeraldcoastinterviewconsulting.com. He could possibly coordinate with you in Memphis. Juvat's advice above is excellent! Cheryl Cage's book will get you into the right mindset. I've heard many folks say either "prep" or "don't prep." In the end, it depends on you. Having wondered this same question, I decided to do a professional prep for a recent interview. I can honestly say I felt more prepared, open and relaxed to show the interviewers who I am. A good prep will help you focus on YOUR stories and bring out what makes YOU unique and different.
Writing down various questions and detailing how you would answer them (as previously stated) is an okay start...an even better approach is to go through your log book and write down your experiences (successes, failures, conflicts, etc.) that only you have experienced. Focusing on these experiences rather than particular questions will make your stories unique. I found that prepping gave me that little bit of confidence to better frame the story and, as ResumeWriter states, end it well too. You absolutely want to be yourself...canned and phony is not what they want - nor who you are either...the best way I can describe pre and post professional prep is this: pre - when I was asked a question, I thought of the best way to answer it, where to begin the story, oh, don't forget to smile, find meaning to what they asked and end it on a positive note; post - when asked a question, I was confident (and humble) in how to frame the story, relaxed and open to the interviewer. I accomplished the same amount of "stuff" as I did in the "pre," but I had fun during the "post" and smiled because I knew that what I was saying was the real me. That little bit of confidence is huge - and will let you really reveal the true you.

The fact that your on this forum searching for help is also telling about you as well - Good luck with the interview!

jtb

 

[needsumluv]

THANKS EVERYBODY FOR THE INFORMATION!!!!!

It will help me much.

Needsumluv

 

[Hobiehawker]

JTB,

Excellent post. I have a friend that used Emerald and another that used I think his name is Craig Thorton, a Southwest Pilot, and both gave high remarks. The one that used Craig said he is extremely busy and almost couldn't get an appointment in time.

I also asked them about the preparation and if they would have looked prepared and they both said no. They said it wasn't as much of a mock interview as much as it was how to approach the big day. Neither gave them a list of questions or anything of the sort. Although both had received a list of questions online to help them jog their memories.

After all this discussion why would anyone reccommend not to get the preparation?

 

[Sy-bill]

After reading this thread a couple times I have come to the conclussion that RVR300 is a prima donna. Just because he has interviewed once and he "knows" an interviewer he is an expert on the subject. I know a few SWA pilots and he certaintly doesn't act like one. Another one slips through the cracks. He is luckier than most to have that job. Show some humility man!!

 

[RVR300]

GUYS, this isn't rocket science! Sheesh!

Have some confidence in yourselves.

End of story. Prep, don't prep, dismiss what I've said, or don't.

If you want me to look like the bad guy, then you go girl.

I have no doubt SWAdude and I both have your best interests at heart, but we disagree on methodology. Why keep something simple when you can split its atoms?

Hope everyone has a great and safe 2005. Those of you waiting on the Jan 11th DB, best of luck to you and look forward to buying you all all beers.

 

[Sy-bill]

GUYS, this isn't rocket science! Sheesh!

Have some confidence in yourselves.

End of story. Prep, don't prep, dismiss what I've said, or don't.

If you want me to look like the bad guy, then you go girl.

I have no doubt SWAdude and I both have your best interests at heart, but we disagree on methodology. Why keep something simple when you can split its atoms?

Hope everyone has a great and safe 2005. Those of you waiting on the Jan 11th DB, best of luck to you and look forward to buying you all all beers.

What are you Manic? You are such an ass.

 

[RVR300]

Thank you Cybil, that's nice of you.

 

[Sy-bill]

Thank you Cybil, that's nice of you.

Your welcome. Your not a very nice person....Donna.