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Stop extending Nja brothers

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Jtf
I am in the top 20 to be recalled. Thank you very much for doing what you did and continue to do. Please also tell others that you talk to on line that do the same I said thank you as well. While I am paying my bills fine and my family is fine I have to maintain 2 jobs to do it. So I am in the I would take the recall right now if it were offered. Thank you again.
 
Spoke with an XLS crew today in the van to the same hotel today. Both pilots seemed quite unhappy with the situation at Netjets complaining that:

1. Understaffed (reason why you need to bring furloughees back)
2. Shorter overnights leading to much higher fatigue levels
3. No real movement from fleet to fleet unless your fleet loses airplanes
4. Claimed certain fleets are proving very unreliable (thank goodness CL350s are coming)
5. Claimed many FOs "talking" about applying to legacies but waiting to see new contract terms

It was an eye-opening conversation but I always take them with a grain of salt, but I have heard this theme consistently recently. Tough situation. I hope some furloughees get called back gradually to provide some schedule relief (especially with the busy holidays approaching) because QOL sounded like it has degraded. Makes you wonder how many furloughees now employed elsewhere (e.g., Jet Blue, Part 91, etc.) would even consider returning to be on the bottom of that list...
 
Heavy Set said:
Spoke with an XLS crew today in the van to the same hotel today. Both pilots seemed quite unhappy with the situation at Netjets complaining that:

1. Understaffed (reason why you need to bring furloughees back)

Some fleets are. Some fleets aren't. Overall, my WAG is we're currently about 150 short due to training float and increased demand.

2. Shorter overnights leading to much higher fatigue levels

That happens when computers do most of the scheduling with ZERO lookback at the crew's previous workload.

3. No real movement from fleet to fleet unless your fleet loses airplanes

Getting a LITTLE better with the arrival of new airframes.

4. Claimed certain fleets are proving very unreliable (thank goodness CL350s are coming)

Some fleets have always had more "issues" than others. If anything, the previously reliable fleets are starting to have more problems primarily due to age and short-sighted maintenance policy.

5. Claimed many FOs "talking" about applying to legacies but waiting to see new contract terms

Good surfers ride the FRONT of a wave. This contract fight will be another 24 months, minimum. Why wait to apply? You can ALWAYS say no. Anybody at NJA with a 4 digit seniority number and still in the career window for a legacy that isn't applying to every legacy even considering adding pilots, needs to rethink. Immediately.

It was an eye-opening conversation but I always take them with a grain of salt, but I have heard this theme consistently recently. Tough situation. I hope some furloughees get called back gradually to provide some schedule relief (especially with the busy holidays approaching) because QOL sounded like it has degraded. Makes you wonder how many furloughees now employed elsewhere (e.g., Jet Blue, Part 91, etc.) would even consider returning to be on the bottom of that list...
Click to expand...

Degradations in QOL on the road have many causes including, but not limited to, Jordy and the union-busting playbook, metrics and the union-busting playbook, schedulers and the union-busting playbook, and the vagaries of this stupid career we hate to love. Or love to hate. Or something like that.

Did I mention the union-busting playbook?
 
Just for the record I'm in the Falcon and was offered to start a day early this week. It seems to be more and more prevalent lately. Needless to say I did not dignify their request with a response.
 
Anyone FO not taking a good hard look at the legacies, given a longish career still, should have their head examined.....if ya wait til after a NJA contract you'll be about 3 years too late.

Of course sugar momma's, independently wealthy or special situations are the exception. But if you're a normal everyday Joe not married to a Dr. What are ya waiting for.... Upgrade into a Phenom after a 15+ year stint as a SIC????
 
Pretty good summary of what's going on.

Heavy Set said:
3. No real movement from fleet to fleet unless your fleet loses airplanes
Click to expand...

This particular issue has done a fine job of ticking-off the group.

Officially, the company has declared every fleet type "in disposal" which allows them to displace pilots into other fleets at will.

Seniority has little bearing on who goes where.

They're able to do this by exploiting a loophole within the contract (which I can't fault them for utilizing, considering it's most likely saved them lots of $$ in training costs), but that doesn't make it any more palatable.
 
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Earlier in the day I run into a captain I used to fly with at NJ. He declared it would be a matter of months for recalls to start. Running ragged and no way they can keep the pace through the busy season. 3 hours later, different FBO, different NJ captain I used to fly with told me it would be years. Nothing will happen until a contract is signed at that will take some time. So that's the latest I heard from guys on the road.
 
gunfyter said:
My guess is CBA first unless forced by sell offs. They are doing it with the flight attendants ... Not hiring even though we need more now. Like maybe 30.
Click to expand...

I agree.





But dude, bring back Clint....the new avatar ain't cutting it. Jussssss sayin'
 
Heavy Set said:
Spoke with an XLS crew today in the van to the same hotel today. Both pilots seemed quite unhappy with the situation at Netjets complaining that:

1. Understaffed (reason why you need to bring furloughees back)
2. Shorter overnights leading to much higher fatigue levels
3. No real movement from fleet to fleet unless your fleet loses airplanes
4. Claimed certain fleets are proving very unreliable (thank goodness CL350s are coming)
5. Claimed many FOs "talking" about applying to legacies but waiting to see new contract terms

It was an eye-opening conversation but I always take them with a grain of salt, but I have heard this theme consistently recently. Tough situation. I hope some furloughees get called back gradually to provide some schedule relief (especially with the busy holidays approaching) because QOL sounded like it has degraded. Makes you wonder how many furloughees now employed elsewhere (e.g., Jet Blue, Part 91, etc.) would even consider returning to be on the bottom of that list...
Click to expand...

Why not, I mean the pilots are going to get "10/250", which should put the FOs easily in the 150K range........:laugh:
 
No extended days for me "buckos"!!

The word is pretty well out that if they are offering you and extended day at the end of your tour, they are working you on the last day and may not be able to get you home in 14 hours or before midnight. Most guys are opting to turn down the extended day and go for the much better "after midnight" pay.

Sorry Buck, the other rumor is that FAA and age 67 is a done deal. My rumor cancels out yours.

I do anticipate a bunch of old guys retiring after the contract is finalized depending on what they get as far as a signing bonus?

(Go to your plan "B")

Conditions have never been better for the recall due to more than 11 days of sell offs. There is no telling what kind of B.S. the company will try to pull if this actually happens?

Good luck to us all!

Semore
 
Interesting conversation fellas however be aware that union official with the last name of Ward is telling the furloughed guys on the furloughed board a different story. He says that when he flys the line he gets 12 hours rest never 14 and 10 and he just does not see the staff shortage everyone is talking about and he is never offered extended days. Just saying.
 
DC-4 said:
Interesting conversation fellas however be aware that union official with the last name of Ward is telling the furloughed guys on the furloughed board a different story. He says that when he flys the line he gets 12 hours rest never 14 and 10 and he just does not see the staff shortage everyone is talking about and he is never offered extended days. Just saying.
Click to expand...

Keep in mind, if memory serves me correctly, Ward, Timko, and Rimon were basically telling furloughed guys they would be furloughing more come Spring 2012..... This was after several heated debates about the very same extended day conversations..... And how we were wrong....

One of the guys who was part of the Presidential recall, emailed me once and I asked him if the company was in as dire straights as those 3 made it seem.. He flat out said that he thinks the company was doing well enough, and the rhetoric from the leadership was embellishing the state of the company for their own political purposes... And " the bull in a China shop" metaphor used for the then president was pretty accurate.

I came to believe nothing that came outta those 3-4 guys mouths.....
 
I don't see BW as the same type of creature as the other two mentioned. I may have missed something but he's is one of only two "brothers" left talking to the furloughed scum.

I don't care for his message sometimes, but he has tried to keep us in the loop as much as possible.

Looking forward to having a voice again with the active group, light will be shed on the bad behavior.......
 
Xcorporate said:
I don't see BW as the same type of creature as the other two mentioned. I may have missed something but he's is one of only two "brothers" left talking to the furloughed scum.

I don't care for his message sometimes, but he has tried to keep us in the loop as much as possible.

......
Click to expand...

Now that I think about it, you're correct, BW did seem to have a more level head than the other guys...

I still think that if you're going to forecast more furloughs, especially in the position the Union guys are in, you better be right.. And not just riling up the troops..
 
just wanted to clarify

Most people I know are not doing extended days (Nor am I). My post was to say that even more so we are so not doing it because of support for the furloughed people.

(If they are trying to "skank" us all, we want them to pay)
 
ragman said:
Where did you hear this rumor?
Click to expand...
Congressman's aide. I won't say which. Apparently one or more of the 91k/135 companies (perhaps NJA among them) have been quietly lobbying for it. Something about the least-productive & coupled with the most costly labor... Along with a growing fear of liability that a "well-seasoned" pilot may have a cardiac event and the deteriorating skill and physical incompetence (lifting heavy bags, etc)...says the companies are too afraid of a age discrimination lawsuit to bust'em out in the sim (+they get too many damned chances per union). Thinking the recent UAL 63-yr-old CA recent incident may have had something to do with it
 
Hey, this is about bashing a different group of guys. Unless it's a gummer that stays out for an extra day. Ill start another thread on why guys that have mismanaged money,ex wife's and have a crappy home life need to hang it up at Medicare age.

Before I get jumped at Golden Corral after early bird dinner with a walker and force fed bp meds I'm only kidding.
 
Hey Cav
First off thank you very much for doing that, second if I may ask what fleet are you on, just wondering.
 

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