Sleepy NWA pilots?

[veneratio]

Fox news is reporting that the NTSB only has the last 30 minutes of the CVR. Not the two hour like they thought they had.

So normally the CVR records the past 2 hours? You think the crew manipulated the CVR recording time (if it's even possible).?

 

[aussieflyboy]

So normally the CVR records the past 2 hours? You think the crew manipulated the CVR recording time (if it's even possible).?

I sure hope not, if that happened the two guys would be looking at criminal prosecution instead of just being fired.

Of course, if there's not more than 30 minutes of recording then they'll probably get away with it. That being said, I'd really like to hear their explanation of how they could still be at FL370 250 miles or so after their expected descent point... On a three hour flight? Please, we're all clock watching toward the end... we all know exactly how long there is to go.

 

[FlyAuburn]

Simple. Every time I have a CA ask me to ask for one, it is to determine the "factor" we add to Ref speed. Once the Auto-Throttles are off we are required by Boeing to have it.

The "How Long is Final?" question is generally asked by guys in jets that have a hard time getting down. Also 210 KIAS is right above the speed at which we need to dirty up. Ergo, if it is going to be a 20 mile final there is no need to get dirty. We will keep it clean and come down slowly. Anything under seven or eight miles requires most of our jets to dirty up to make the base turn at seven or eight miles and below 4500 feet which is the altitude required by ATL Tracon.

So why not add the factor when you get the ATIS?

 

[Bringupthebird]

Suppose the issue was that they de-selected the com1 on both the audio panels and never heard ATC calling and really were in a "heated discussion" (aka not minding the store) and simply weren't paying attention to where they were. Maybe dispatch was trying to reach them through ACARS, maybe not.

While they were certainly negligent, it might be a more benign story that folks imagine.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

I've lost track of time with my pants down. It happens.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

So why not add the factor when you get the ATIS?

Do you really have to ask that? Is ATIS the latest wind?

I typically have it in my mind what it is and listen to tower giving out winds as they clear people to land... its pretty rare for me to actually get a "wind check" unless the winds on the FMC are looking a lot different.

 

[Wankel7]

Was listening to npr and a passenger said they saw two officers leave the cockpit with a plastic case. Something you would store a drill in. I wonder what that was?

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Here is a quote from General Lee:



There were many more quotes like this....You get the point...Now that Delta pilots are the one with the black eye, they've gone from offense to defense...The double standard continues with each post they make....

The anger runs so deep in you that even if someone gave you a complement on here you'd turn it around.

I don't see anyone defending these guys on here... There is always someone calling out to restrain yourselves and wait for the investigation in any thread, which is the appropriate thing.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Was listening to npr and a passenger said they saw two officers leave the cockpit with a plastic case. Something you would store a drill in. I wonder what that was?

Typically the data download devices look like that.

 

[Bluejob]

They might be alive today, but by luck or design??

Just because there HAPPENED to not be anyone taxiing on the taxiway in ATL, and just because the NWA guys HAPPENED to wake up 150 nm east of MSP and not during the spiralling death plunge of a fuel exhausted Airbus somewhere over central Ontario, do you think that excuses their actions? Maybe next time they wouldn't be so lucky, just like the Comair and Colgan crews weren't so lucky.

Incidentally, I don't recall an incorrect runway being used in SDF any time recently... Refresh my memory?

Sorry Aussie, I stand corrected. It was LEX. Not that I'm old, but maybe I'll take a nap now.

 

[relief tube]

Probably been asked (don't feel like looking through 109 posts), but how old are they? My 62 year old dad has been falling asleep on the couch at 1030pm every night after work for the last 10 years...so my mom says.

 

[airplane wizard]

How come no one is asking where they went to flight school? Are these guys PFTer's? Maybe this guys went through Gulfstream Academy? LOL
Where are all you that sh$t on low-time people. What's the excuse now? I bet the morons on the Airbus had like atleast 15,000 hours between the two of them. Come on guys if any regional crew would have done this or landed on a taxiway there would have been loooooooong thread about PFT and lowtime and blah blah blah. Some of you on this board are giving these guys a pass. Just think about that.

Right on, maybe this incident will shut these little cry babies up. The autopilots in these aircraft should be deactivated, and you guys should have to hand fly everything. Oh, and only VOR/DME too, no FMS/GPS/moving maps either. At least you guys will stay awake then.

 

[xray678]

Suppose the issue was that they de-selected the com1 on both the audio panels and never heard ATC calling and really were in a "heated discussion" (aka not minding the store) and simply weren't paying attention to where they were. Maybe dispatch was trying to reach them through ACARS, maybe not.

While they were certainly negligent, it might be a more benign story that folks imagine.

They were very negligent. Messing up the comm panel or having a discussion that caused you to miss some radio calls, I can understand. But how do you not notice the destination on the map display? I mean, past TOD, past the last point on the arrival, aircraft probably changing modes because it had no more route to follow? How does that happen to two professional pilots?

Even if their story is true, they should have lied and said they fell asleep. I think that is less negligent than what they are claiming happened.

 

[Flyingcat]

I would be very curious as to the situational awareness of everyone else such as the flight attendants. They were going to MSP so at least some of the passengers would have connections. We all know if there is a five minute delay they are already worried about those connections. I would think that even the most clueless of flight attendants would be wondering if they were holding because by now someone has complained they are not going to make that connection.

I will certainly not pass judgment since I was not on the flightdeck, but there are definitely a lot of things to make you go Hmm!

 

[densoo]

I would be very curious as to the situational awareness of everyone else such as the flight attendants.

Controllers on the ground, pilots of other planes, even a flight attendant back in the cabin tried to alert the crew as the U.S. passenger airliner overshot its destination of Minneapolis at 37,000 feet.

I've gone coast to coast with one call from the back.

 

[SLUF4]

There was a retired Delta pilot on WSB this morning saying that it was highly unlikely that they fell asleep since it's only a 3hour and 30 min flight and it was mostly during the day.

 

[JetSpeed219]

There was a retired Delta pilot on WSB this morning saying that it was highly unlikely that they fell asleep since it's only a 3hour and 30 min flight and it was mostly during the day.

I wonder what he has to say about the GO! pilots that fell asleep on a 30 minute flight...

 

[semperfido]

The solution: Put coach seats on the flight deck.

How bout cockpit tours at .25 per tour. .....that may be too much:smash:

 

[SLUF4]

wouldn't the company have tried to selcal them or something?

 

[Green Banana]

Take it for what it is, but here is an artical that names both pilots and states that the CVR only got the last 30 minutes.
http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/dpp/...port_police_report_nwa_flight_188_oct_23_2009