Skywest, ASA DOH integration?

[PBRstreetgang]

hey,
Don't worry about gaynation, after reading AMLP, I couldn't find a single reference to non-union pilots rights, in fact it appears to only apply to collectively bargained pilot groups. In theory the SKYW pilots could be stapled to the bottom of the ASA pilot but AMLP act prohibits the ASA pilots from being stapled to the bottom of the SKYW pilot seniority list. The AMLP protects collectively bargained pilots and ignores everyone else except to say that the collectively bargained must be treated according to the act. I guess "at will employee" means you are the equivalent to a cup of warm spit.
PBR

 

[Skywest Pylot]

Surely Skynation considered a possible merger before taking his/her anti-ALPA stance. All I want is a simple answer. Doesn't seem like too much to ask from someone who is h3ll bent on keeping ALPA out. I will wait for an answer.

 

[SkyNation]

NO

Skynation,

If you get your wish and the ALPA drive fails, who we gonna have representing us at the negotiating table during a potential merger? Jerry? SAPA?

since you asked so politely.

We are 2800 some odd pilots to their 1700 whatever. We were the profitable company that bought them. They are the proverbial red-headed step child, we are the foster-parents who were bullied by a bankrupt company that we sell services to into taking them into our fold. This is not the pilot's fault or a character assessment of them (even though Jmoney shortsightedly and incorrectly sees it that way).

IF the vote goes NO and IF they decide to merge us, then I'd expect the outcome to be reflective of those items above, using the ALG/Mohawk deal to structure it, using fences, 2 to 1 or any number of things to offer some sort of 'protection.'

SkyWest Airlines is Jerry's baby that he brought back from the dead and built into what it is today. There's no way he regards us the same as the company he was cornered into buying to keep his relationship with DAL.

what I tend to believe more is what I thought at the outset, which is that ASA will continue to shrink and/or be sold off.

there, that's the best I can do in a hurry. I already know you'll disagree, Jmoney will wet his pants replying, and all the usual SkyWest haters will pile on. so...

enjoy it!

 

[Skywest Pylot]

So you're saying Jerry will be negotiating on behalf of the Skywest pilots?

 

[PCL_128]

since you asked so politely.

We are 2800 some odd pilots to their 1700 whatever. We were the profitable company that bought them. They are the proverbial red-headed step child, we are the foster-parents who were bullied by a bankrupt company that we sell services to into taking them into our fold. This is not the pilot's fault or a character assessment of them (even though Jmoney shortsightedly and incorrectly sees it that way).

IF the vote goes NO and IF they decide to merge us, then I'd expect the outcome to be reflective of those items above, using the ALG/Mohawk deal to structure it, using fences, 2 to 1 or any number of things to offer some sort of 'protection.'

ALG-Mohawk LPPs only provide a structure for the process of integration. They don't provide any "2 to 1" guidelines, or anything of the sort. They provide a process which is basically identical to the ALPA process: direct negotiations, mediation, and finally binding arbitration. During the direct and mediated negotiations, JA or his designee would be negotiating for you, and ALPA would be negotiating for the ASA pilots. JA has absolutely no vested interest in protecting your seniority. His vested interest is only in getting the integration done. I would wager that he would take a very bad deal for you before he would deal with allowing it to go all the way to arbitration just so he can waste time and resources to protect the seniority of some "little people."

SkyWest Airlines is Jerry's baby that he brought back from the dead and built into what it is today. There's no way he regards us the same as the company he was cornered into buying to keep his relationship with DAL.

Jerry doesn't give a flying fu&^ about you. You are just a line item on a balance sheet, and if he decided to integrate the two airlines, then you are nothing but a speed bump on the way to getting it done. If you think for a second that he will waste time or resources on defending your seniority, then you're nuts.

Jerry and friends have their representation (Ford & Harrison among others). Don't you think it's time that you got some representation of your own?

 

[viper548]

Do you think Jerry gives a rats ass about your seniority, or the rest of management for that matter? If it were left to skywest management, it would be DOH. Take a look at the ASA seniority list and see where you'd fit in. Most SkyWest people wouldn't do so well with a DOH integration. There's lots of things ALPA cant promise or deliver, but they'd at least get us a seat at the negotiating table instead of us looking in through a window

 

[SkyNation]

PCL_128,

I don't subscribe to your socialist 'all management is evil and out to get you' POV. so, that being the case, we don't have much to discuss. BTW, are you represented by ALPA?

SkyWestPylot
I don't think so, since he's the president of Inc.

BH would, I guess. The same BH that has made millions under the tutelage of JA, who is a pilot on the SkyWest seniority list, and really owes everything he has to the company that he helped JA build into what it is.

regardless of what you think of BH, what makes you think he treat JA's baby so casually?

 

[PCL_128]

regardless of what you think of BH, what makes you think he treat JA's baby so casually?

You aren't JA's baby. The airline that generates the profits is his baby. You are just one line item out of hundreds on the balance sheet, and a bothersome one at that. You can't possibly be clueless enough to believe that these guys care about you one bit. You are nothing to them.

 

[PCL_128]

I don't subscribe to your socialist 'all management is evil and out to get you' POV. so, that being the case, we don't have much to discuss.

You're right. We don't have much to discuss because you are living in a fantasy world that only exists in your mind. Trust JA and the rest of your management at your own peril.

BTW, are you represented by ALPA?

I was at Pinnacle where I served as an ALPA rep for 5 years. At my new carrier, we have an independent union, unfortunately. You have no idea how much I miss the protection, experience, and influence of ALPA. There's simply no comparison.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Hey,
skywinkie has it's head in the sand. Single carrier petition, and AMLP will be the order of the day. Except there is no provision for the SKYW pilots, there is no mention of non-union being merged with the union pilots. There must be a time limit as it regards the "purchase" phase. ASA has been owned for awhile, I guess SKYW will spend lots of it's money to insure skyturds senority will be honored. Yeah, right, sure they will, they wouldn't even give the EMB pilots a raise, BH was a EMB Capt. too. The kool-aid hangover won't even be gone till the D.O.H. merger is done and inked into the ASA contract(and I hope they get DOH), and skyturd gets frustrated and goes away. He thinks JA can tell federal Judges what to do and how to do it, its gonna get interesting. ASA guys good on ya, go for that single carrier petition ASAP, I would like you guys out further west to dilute the stench of skyturd and it's ilk.
PBR

 

[SkyNation]

I was at Pinnacle where I served as an ALPA rep for 5 years. At my new carrier, we have an independent union, unfortunately. You have no idea how much I miss the protection, experience, and influence of ALPA. There's simply no comparison.

then why did you leave? and why would you join a place that doesn't have this glorious ALPA of which you speak?

I had an FO from Pinnacle recently. I asked him how he liked it here compared to there. His response was exactly what you've posted above when he said 'There's simply no comparison.'

how do you feel about the current pay scale at Pinnacle? if ALPA is so powerful, why isn't it way, way better?

 

[PCL_128]

then why did you leave? and why would you join a place that doesn't have this glorious ALPA of which you speak?

I think we will have ALPA within the next few years. As it stands right now, we have an in-house union that purchases various services from ALPA to help us out. Definitely not as good as actually having ALPA on property, but better than nothing.

Why did I leave? Because Pinnacle isn't a career airline, and neither is any other regional for that matter, including Skywest. Your flying is all at the behest of someone else. DAL and UAL can decide to RFP your flying and suddenly you're left with nothing.

how do you feel about the current pay scale at Pinnacle?

It needs to go up, just as yours does.

if ALPA is so powerful, why isn't it way, way better?

The contract that the Pinnacle pilots have right now was negotiated in 1999, before Pinnacle even had jets. For the time, the payrates and work rules were industry-standard. It wasn't a bad contract at all. Now, 8 years later, the agreement is substandard and needs improvement. ALPA is working hard to accomplish that goal. They will end up with a TA at some point that will probably be similar to the current ASA TA. And unlike you guys at Skywest, they have career protections, aeromedical, legal, accident investigation, etc....

 

[PBRstreetgang]

......

 

[Skywest Pylot]

SkyWestPylot
I don't think so, since he's the president of Inc.

BH would, I guess. The same BH that has made millions under the tutelage of JA, who is a pilot on the SkyWest seniority list, and really owes everything he has to the company that he helped JA build into what it is.

regardless of what you think of BH, what makes you think he treat JA's baby so casually?

Not very comforting considering pay/QOL negotiations with B.H. in recent years. Skynation, were you here when B.H. came into newhire groundschool and told everyone they would not be paid through training? What financial hardship was Skywest experiencing at the time? Is this the same B.H. that will be negotiating for us?

 

[Gobi Gred]

Skynation, Jerry and Co. at the end of the day will do what is best for the stockholders and if that means screwing the SkyWest pilot group they will do it. Nothing personal it's just business. The problem with you and so many SkyWest pilots is that you put management on this pedestal that they don't belong and somehow think they will always do us right. Wrong!