SKYW ALPA convert

[CoAlpha]

After seeing what they pulled out in CA, and with what MN said, way to go!! They just converted one of the most anti ALPA pilots in the group. Now for spite and fair representation my card has been sent in!

game over.

 

[Spicepilots]

Hmm, how do we know all of the closet ALPA supporters in SAPA aren't sabotoging the process just so SAPA looks more ineffective? Of course, our pilot group is so apathetic, nobody bothers to check up on these guys. I wish they'd publish the actual minutes from every meeting. I don't think anyone on either side is telling the full truth.

 

[XPOO]

Welcome to the extreme minority!

 

[Ski Bum]

Glad to have you onboard.

If anything the MN letter makes it painfully clear that SAPA is not the PILOT'S representative, but rather a representative of managment.

 

[Morning Wood]

Glad to have you onboard.

If anything the MN letter makes it painfully clear that SAPA is not the PILOT'S representative, but rather a representative of managment.

Where is this letter, on his website?

 

[Burt Reynolds]

It was sent to all pilots via SWOL

 

[John Pennekamp]

After seeing what they pulled out in CA, and with what MN said, way to go!! They just converted one of the most anti ALPA pilots in the group. Now for spite and fair representation my card has been sent in!

game over.

Next, the "Elders" will be stopping by to tell you about The Church...

 

[skypine69]

amazing that ME and JB and DL testified on behalf of skywest inc. in support of sapa. i thought sapa was a pilot group. why would management have such a vested interest in having these guys testify in court? and to not invite the president? this is going to be very interesting....i for one am glad MN did what he did, finally a pres standing up and telling the pilot group how jacked up sapa can be.

 

[CoAlpha]

amazing that ME and JB and DL testified on behalf of skywest inc. in support of sapa. i thought sapa was a pilot group. why would management have such a vested interest in having these guys testify in court? and to not invite the president? this is going to be very interesting....i for one am glad MN did what he did, finally a pres standing up and telling the pilot group how jacked up sapa can be.

Thats one mistake skyw will regret. That was by far the last straw for me, who do these clowns think they are, and what compensation did they get for stabbing the pilot group in the back? I know I probably wont be on property when the skyw pilot group gets its first contract, but this is no way to represent a pilot group.

 

[WWEfan]

After seeing what they pulled out in CA, and with what MN said, way to go!! They just converted one of the most anti ALPA pilots in the group. Now for spite and fair representation my card has been sent in!

game over.

I doubt you will be the only one. The SKYW pilot group was split down the middle prior to this announcement. This will definitely turn the tide in ALPA's favor.

 

[HockleyPilot]

Yep, SKW screwed the pooch on this one. Having the Executive Board testify for SKW exposed SAPA for what it is, a representative organization to control and manipulate SKW employees. Or as some call it, the good ole' boys club. Obviously, MN isn't included. There are a couple bad apples in SAPA. Fortunately, many of the good apples (reps) work very hard to represent the pilots interests despite the "structured" organization of SAPA.

We might as well have BH on the SAPA Executive Board.

 

[FlySacto]

amazing that ME and JB and DL testified on behalf of skywest inc. in support of sapa. i thought sapa was a pilot group. why would management have such a vested interest in having these guys testify in court? and to not invite the president? this is going to be very interesting....i for one am glad MN did what he did, finally a pres standing up and telling the pilot group how jacked up sapa can be.

Even more amazing is what some of the testimony apparently was and the stealth tactics. Gosh, so we wonder how we got such a good pay proposal after all that hard work SAPA put in. This is too bad. Not a good way to inspire or keep faith in anyone involved.

 

[skypine69]

dont get me wrong, there are some guys (and one gal) on sapa that really try hard to do what is best for the group. however, i think the structure is what the problem is. there is an apparent conflict of interest, and when 3 of the reps testify on behalf ot skywest to help keep sapa around, then that apparent conflict of interest seems less apparent and more realistic.

anyway, fun times...i hope i am not around too much longer to see how it all ends up!

 

[FmrFreightDog]

Ok, since I'm obviously the only one who doesn't know what you guys are talking about, what happened?

 

[CheeseDick]

Check your SWOL. All info is in there

 

[FmrFreightDog]

Check your SWOL. All info is in there

I work for ASA though. I was just curious what you guys are so hot about.

 

[XPOO]

I work for ASA though. I was just curious what you guys are so hot about.

They've seen the quote I have of yours, and they don't much care for your opinion. LOL!

 

[Ski Bum]

A letter was put out from the SAPA President to the pilot group (summary)

- President was asked and refused to sign a confidentiality agreement with the company that would prohibit him from having open communication with the pilot group.

- President was not asked to attend the Skywest Pilots OC vs SKYW trial in SFO. Although the Secretary of SAPA and 2 other management supporters from SAPA were asked to attend and testify on behalf of SKYW. President of SAPA was not even told of the trial or that the others would be attending. The President attended the trial anyway and observed the following.

- SKYW claimed that SAPA is our pilot representative and they have a contract with SKYW...not true

- The secretary of SAPA claimed under oath in his testimony that he was the administrative head of SAPA. This is a big issue because the pilots are under the impression that the elected President is the administrative head of SAPA.

- Question was brought up about the eligibility of one of the members of the SAPA executive board (read - not really a pilot anymore, purely management)



- On another note the company is awarding the backpay for the cancellation pay issue that was brought up, but they are not going to pay it that way in the future. They admitted they did it wrong (ie paying it back to the pilots) but are basically saying that they are going to continue to do it wrong in the future.

Hope that helps for those of you that don't have access to SWOL.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

They've seen the quote I have of yours, and they don't much care for your opinion. LOL!

XPOO,

Q) What's worse than being a pilot at a Regional Airline?
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A) Being a Dispatcher at one.


Sorry, you broke rule #11

 

[XPOO]

XPOO,

Q) What's worse than being a pilot at a Regional Airline?
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
A) Being a Dispatcher at one.


Sorry, you broke rule #9

Just for that, its swaps all around. Every leg is now an aircraft swap, with no APU. ENJOY!

 

[HockleyPilot]

- On another note the company is awarding the backpay for the cancellation pay issue that was brought up, but they are not going to pay it that way in the future. They admitted they did it wrong (ie paying it back to the pilots) but are basically saying that they are going to continue to do it wrong in the future.

Hope that helps for those of you that don't have access to SWOL.

And with this, they are awarding the cnx pay to 57 PIC'S or so. That is nothing compared to the amount of PIC's that are on file due to cancellation pay. They admit they were wrong, yet won't reconcile ALL of them, and won't in the future. And who is the one creating the adversarial relationship?

 

[SkyNation]

yes, let's all rush out to vote in ALPA and infect our work environment the it's inherent animosities, distrust, and adversarial positions. that'll show 'em! right guys?! and then, and then we can be like, like.......ummm, let's see...scratching my head here, ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm.............


of course there are things at any company that go on that are undesirable to someone. you have to look at what we have overall, and compare it the industry. overall I feel we have it better. If you disagree and feel like you will force the companies hand by voting in ALPA and that we'll walk down some primrose path to better pay, benefits, etc., then I wish you luck. if that happens, then I'll mimic all the crybabies who currently shout 'where are you SAPA?' and 'what are you gonna do SAPA?', but obviously replace 'SAPA' with 'ALPA.'

be careful what you wish for. don't be too anxious to give up what we have at SkyWest for stickers, magazines, etc.

HATERS-LOAD UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I look forward to all the same tired arguments. I'm more interested in results.

 

[buscap]

yes, let's all rush out to vote in ALPA and infect our work environment the it's inherent animosities, distrust, and adversarial positions. that'll show 'em! right guys?! and then, and then we can be like, like.......ummm, let's see...scratching my head here, ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm.............


of course there are things at any company that go on that are undesirable to someone. you have to look at what we have overall, and compare it the industry. overall I feel we have it better. If you disagree and feel like you will force the companies hand by voting in ALPA and that we'll walk down some primrose path to better pay, benefits, etc., then I wish you luck. if that happens, then I'll mimic all the crybabies who currently shout 'where are you SAPA?' and 'what are you gonna do SAPA?', but obviously replace 'SAPA' with 'ALPA.'

be careful what you wish for. don't be too anxious to give up what we have at SkyWest for stickers, magazines, etc.

HATERS-LOAD UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I look forward to all the same tired arguments. I'm more interested in results.

Hey Dude,

Everyone in the industry knows why SKW doesn't have a union. You've been treated and compensated just well enough to keep a union off the property. However, we also know that level of compensation and QOL is based on that attained at union carriers. We also know the rising tide effect at SKW can only last so long.

I personally hope SKW joins ALPA as it would benefit the SKW pilots, ALPA, and all ALPA regional pilots. But I beleive the biggest winner of the three would be the SKW pilots.

Good luck with the union drive, but please don't vote against it just because you don't like stickers.

 

[Tarzan]

HATERS-LOAD UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I look forward to all the same tired arguments. I'm more interested in results.

I am not what you call an ALPA Kool-Aid consumer. Nor do I buy what the company presents either. However, when the company decides they will abide by an agreement even it is the wrong thing to do, how else do get them to abide? At the very least, the union presents an avenue to attain such results. Whereas now you have no real legal course of action to right a wrong.

If the SW group votes in a union, I believe it benefit us all now and in the future. Such a large pilot group helps reach the point where the plumbers and electricians held enough clout to get the job done properly with fair pay. Remember, these guys were the best at what they did. If you wanted something installed right, you got a union guy to come to it. In today's climate, take a look around. People what everything for nothing. Not there is anything wrong with wanting a free ride but there needs to be adequate compensation for the amount of effort put forward by pilots. Most folks don't know we climb into a sim twice a year and practice the worst case deals. The don't know we could lose our jobs at any point if your blood pressure comes back to high.

I am a free market believer..... To a point. If a free market runs wild, you eventually have a monopoly which leads to subrogation of the employee's. Nowhere else to go. It also leads to the consumer getting fleeced. The union has been the counterweight to this sort of stuff. It is not without its shortcomings but there is also much be gained.

 

[mavdog]

- President was asked and refused to sign a confidentiality agreement with the company that would prohibit him from having open communication with the pilot group.

It is not uncommon for ALPA MECs to sign these agreements with management, so I wouldn't get too worked up over that point.

 

[Weasil]

the fact is the company showed their hand. They claimed in court that we had a "contract" under the RLA via our SAPA policy manual, and then in the same week they made a pen stroke change to the manual, even while they agreed that cancellation was paid in the past the way the PIC's said it was, they will no longer pay it that way. This is why we need an actual collective bargaining agreement! You can bet your boots that the guys who run the company have individual employment contracts. Why shouldn't the pilots have a contract? I don't understand why pilots would not want one.
I know there have been a lot of concessions with all airlines in recent history, and a lot of people blame ALPA for these, saying ALPA is not effective anymore, but I say - the pay/benefits that were given up would never have been gained without ALPA, and just imagine what would have been taken away were it not for ALPA.

 

[reno]

Visit www.skywestalpa.org for all of the litigation documents.

 

[bender]

...or instead you could just recall the good 'ole boys out of our student council.

 

[Ben Dover]

Two things:

They claimed in court that we had a "contract" under the RLA via our SAPA policy manual, and then in the same week they made a pen stroke change to the manual...

If the policy manual/"contract" says the company can unilaterally change anything in it at any time. How is that a breach of "contract"/manual?

Secondly, the only suprise about this latest message from Mark is that many of you didn't already know that such tom foolery has been standard fair within SAPA for years.

 

[Weasil]

If the policy manual/"contract" says the company can unilaterally change anything in it at any time. How is that a breach of "contract"/manual?
.

I guess that was kind of my point. The whole idea that our agreement meets the requirements of the RLA is a joke of an argument, just the mere fact that they can change it without our agreement should be enough for the judge. But who knows these days. I have seen many legal decisions go in favor of management vs labor lately that nothing surprises me anymore.