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flyboyike

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PCL_128

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Funny I read plenty of MSNBC and Huff post. I already know what I believe so I don't need to watch fox. That is unless I want to see what is actually going on in the world. Instead just about every network covering for O. I also need to try and understand the massive reality distortion field that the left actually feed on.

Just today on Huff post there was an article on how the Koch brothers were destroying the united states with their influx of money to the politicians. Of course it never once mentioned that they are number 15 on the donor list with 12 democrats such as Soros, Bloomburg, Jeffrey R. Immelt, Etc out spending them on their political causes. A little hypocritical but about par for the course.

Another example is Huff Post and MSLSD spent over a month of non stop coverage over closure of the bridge by Chris Christie. Doing in depth reporting on anyone Christie has talked too in the last 50 years that had the word bridge in it. Now compare that with the massive in depth reporting on the IRS destroying "less than 20" hard drives while being investigated by Congress all related to the targeting of Tea party groups, the "lost" emails and not even telling congress about the destruction and loss until after a year and a half had passed. What did those two hard hitting news agency put out? A picture of Obama saying there "wasn't a smidgen of corruption" in the IRS. And that was pretty much the last thing we heard about it on those sites.

Try watching fox and even with their slant you could probably learn a lot more that what you are fed by the other Obama cheerleader "news" stations.

You mistake my dislike of Faux as a fondness for MSNBC. I rarely watch MSNBC, either. And CNN is just downright awful, not because of a slant, but because it just plains sucks. If you want real news, you get it from traditional print journalism. TV is all sensationalism. It's good for some entertainment value, but not for real news.
 

redflyer65

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Dragging?
That's what you call this?
Where on earth do you get data to support that?

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-KVRKBohVk...AaFE/XnVvpvEbAn0/s1600/EmployRecApril2013.jpg

The absolute worst recovery of any recession since WWII. By far. Obama and Co have no idea how to spur a recovery except for spending more of our money. After their stimulus package didn't 'stimulate' enough, their reasoning was..it wasn't enough. Absolutely amazing.

So yes Wave.....this 'recovery' has been DRAGGING on for way too long. Check the chart above..
 
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HowardBorden

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Just today on Huff post there was an article on how the Koch brothers were destroying the united states with their influx of money to the politicians. Of course it never once mentioned that they are number 15 on the donor list with 12 democrats such as Soros, Bloomburg, Jeffrey R. Immelt, Etc out spending them on their political causes. A little hypocritical but about par for the course.

These lists only show personal, reportable donations. Enter the 501(c)(4) also known as a Super PAC and personal donations are minuscule by comparison on both sides of the argument. If you truly believe that this list accurately depicts the political donations of Soros, Bloomberg or the Koch's you are sadly mistaken.

The role of outside political contributions has increased significantly over the past few years. Billionaires both liberal and conservative alike continue to pour money into the electoral process in ever increasing amounts. This upcoming election will prove no different as both the Koch brothers and George Soros bankroll the 2014 midterm elections.
 

waveflyer

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Red-
You're right, I'm sorry
With such definitive experts and authorities such as 3bp.blogspot, how could I argue?

We are all better off today than we were the year before- for all 6 years running

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/07/05/5-reasons-why-us-economy-is-recovering/
5 reasons why US economy is recovering

Published July 05, 2014
Associated Press

WASHINGTON ? How does the U.S. economy do it?

Europe is floundering. China faces slower growth. Japan is struggling to sustain tentative gains.


ADVERTISEMENT
Yet the U.S. job market is humming, and the pace of economic growth is steadily rising. Five full years after a devastating recession officially ended, the economy is finally showing the vigor that Americans have long awaited.

Last month, employers added 288,000 jobs and helped reduce the unemployment rate to 6.1 percent, the lowest since September 2008. June capped a five-month stretch of 200,000-plus job gains ? the first in nearly 15 years.

After having shrunk at a 2.9 percent annual rate from January through March ? largely because of a brutal winter ? the U.S. economy is expected to grow at a healthy 3 percent pace the rest of the year.

Here are five reasons the United States is outpacing other major economies:

AN AGGRESSIVE CENTRAL BANK

"The Federal Reserve acted sooner and more aggressively than other central banks in keeping rates low," says Bernard Baumohl, chief global economist at the Economic Outlook Group.

In December 2008, the Fed slashed short-term interest rates to near zero and has kept them there. Ultra-low loan rates have made it easier for individuals and businesses to borrow and spend. The Fed also launched three bond-buying programs meant to reduce long-term rates.

By contrast, the European Central Bank has been slower to respond to signs of economic distress among the 18 nations that share the euro currency. The ECB actually raised rates in 2011 ? the same year the eurozone sank back into recession.

It's worth keeping in mind that the Fed has two mandates: To keep prices stable and to maximize employment. The ECB has just one mandate: To guard against high inflation. The Fed was led during and after the Great Recession by Ben Bernanke, a student of the Great Depression who was determined to avoid a repeat of the 1930s' economic collapse.

Janet Yellen, who succeeded Bernanke as Fed chair this year, has continued his emphasis on nursing the U.S. economy back to health after the recession of 2007-2009 with the help of historically low rates.

STRONGER BANKS

The United States moved faster than Europe to restore its banks' health after the financial crisis of 2008-2009. The U.S. government bailed out the financial system and subjected big banks to stress tests in 2009 to reveal their financial strength. By showing the banks to be surprisingly healthy, the stress tests helped restore confidence in the U.S. financial system.

Banks gradually started lending again. European banks are only now undergoing stress tests, and the results won't be out until fall. In the meantime, Europe's banks lack confidence. They fear that other banks are holding too many bad loans and that Europe is vulnerable to another crisis. So they aren't lending much.

In the United States, overall bank lending is up nearly 4 percent in the past year. Lending to business has jumped 10 percent.

In the eurozone, lending has dropped 3.7 percent overall, according to figures from the Institute of International Finance. Lending to business is off 2.5 percent. (The U.S. figures are for the year ending in mid-June; the European figures are from May.)

A MORE FLEXIBLE ECONOMY

Economists say Japan and Europe need to undertake reforms to make their economies more flexible ? more, in other words, like America's.

Europe needs to lift wage restrictions that prevent employers from cutting pay (rather than eliminating jobs) when times are bad. It could also rethink welfare and retirement programs that discourage people from working and dismantle policies that protect favored businesses and block innovative newcomers, the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development has argued.

Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has proposed reforms meant to make the Japanese economy more competitive. He wants to expand child care so more women can work, replace small inefficient farms with more large-scale commercial farms and allow more foreign migrant workers to fill labor shortages in areas such as nursing and construction.

Yet his proposals face fierce opposition.

"Europe and Japan remain less well-positioned for durable long-term growth, as they have only recently begun to tackle their deep-rooted structural problems, and a lot remains to be done," says Eswar Prasad, a professor of trade policy at Cornell University.

China is struggling to manage a transition from an economy based on exports and often wasteful investment in real estate and factories to a sturdier but likely slower-growing economy based on more consumer spending.

LESS BUDGET-CUTTING

Weighed down by debt, many European countries took an ax to swelling budget deficits. They slashed pension benefits, raised taxes and cut civil servants' wages. The cuts devastated several European economies. They led to 27 percent unemployment in Greece, 14 percent in Portugal and 25 percent in Spain. The United States has done some budget cutting, too, and raised taxes. But U.S. austerity hasn't been anywhere near as harsh.

A ROARING STOCK MARKET

The Fed's easy-money policies ignited a world-beating U.S. stock market rally. Over the past five years, U.S. stocks have easily outpaced shares in Europe, Japan and Hong Kong. That was one of Bernanke's goals in lowering rates. He figured that miserly fixed-income rates would nudge investors into stocks in search of higher returns. Higher stock prices would then make Americans feel more confident and more willing to spend ? the so-called wealth effect.

Most economists agree it's worked.
 
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redflyer65

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Wave,

It's just the first chart I grabbed, but they are all the same so the source shouldn't matter.

The point being, many of us are NOT better off. The Democrats love to point to the stock market being up, so all is good right? Well, you know there's been 'quantitative easing' pretty much the whole time. You can't discount that. I'm not saying it wasn't the right thing to do, but definitely effects the market.

Part two, who's invested in this great market? Not the lower and middle class...so how does that help them? There median income has been going down under this administration. Why is that? More part-time jobs and food stamps than ever! Could you imagine us continuing down this road longer than 2 more years? It's a disaster for many.
 

waveflyer

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You aren't better off red?

Well, the disappearing middle class has everything to do with the current tax situation and millionaires paying 15% or less with carved out deductions and low to middle class paying well north of that-

That's a democratic platform issue-
And republicans keep blocking any attempt to address it.

So you're saying you will join me in voting democrat this year?
Bc that is the logical conclusion from the post above

As Clinton says often we all do better with a strong middle class

Millionaires become billionaires- those who would be stuck in survival mode are freer to get to the top-
 

redflyer65

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Am I doing better off? Sure.

You think the reason is because of the Dems? No. (well, maybe because of their bond buying program) I'm probably upper middle class but live WELL below my means. Invest heavily for my future...not for others. So instead of 'you didn't build that', I say I have built it through my saving and investing.

I think it's funny that the Dems like to claim victory for the stock market, but you'll notice they don't give a rats arse about the price of gas right now. You remember when they were screaming about Bush driving the price of gas up? They were calling for Congressional Hearings. You know they needed to get to the bottom of it. Now? Nothing...

Food prices are up, gasoline is up....but hey, much like SW....the stock prices are up, so who gives a sh!t right?

You good with 17+ Trillion in debt Wave? I'm not and the Dems could care less. Do you honestly think I have that wrong?

Here's the other interesting thing about the 'bond buying'. Who do you think it's helped? The people who had excess money!
 
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redflyer65

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One more question Wave...


Every wonder why DC talks about the Social Security insolvency, but nobody talks about Welfare insolvency? Why is that?

Those in the first group actually paid into something, those in second group paid nothing.

Mark my words, there will eventually be a SS means testing, and when that goes down I hope your cool with losing every bit of SS that you paid in. That's where we are headed....guaranteed.
 

PCL_128

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wave, why are you beating your head against the wall? You know you're not going to teach economics to people with the collective intellect of a cantaloupe.
 

bluesideup1

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wave, why are you beating your head against the wall? You know you're not going to teach economics to people with the collective intellect of a cantaloupe.

You mean passing a 447 Billion dollar shovel ready jobs bill that cost the taxpayer around $300,000+ for every temp job created? If that is the kind of economics that you teach then yes I am a cantaloupe. Or maybe we can look at all the other bastions of economic growth were the Dems have had a Majority for the last 30 years such as Stockton, CA, San Bernidino, CA, Mammoth Lakes, CA, Central Falls, RI and of course the ever illustrious and largest city to ever default Detroit, MI.

This is where you oh so wise in economics Democrats lead to when you continue to throw money at those who don't work and raise taxes on those who do.

Please PLC show this poor cantaloupe how the GOP in calling for fiscal responsibility and trying to get Obama to stop running Trillion dollar deficits is better than a Tax and spend attitude of the Dems?

But then again it is quite typical of left thinking that name calling and comparing their intelligence to those of a cantaloupes instead of spelling out how your economic plans work is once again par for the course. It is typical when the Dems "economic plan" is such a failure that the only thing you can do is call names. Next I am sure you will call me a racist for disagreeing with the disaster we now have as a president.
 

PCL_128

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wave may engage you, but I won't waste my time. Go read some Keynes and get back to me.
 

waveflyer

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Once again reading comprehension not your strength. A Scab...Really? You are a ********************ING MORON. Not even close to the same thing. Free ride my ass. I pay my share in taxes. I pay more yearly than my parents or grand parents ever did. Save your liberal number skewing for someone who believes your BS. I would be willing to pay more if it didn't go to growing the govt. You libs like to parrot CNN in the GOP blocked this and blocked that. Take all the BS spending out of the bills and maybe they will pass. You need more govt control Wave. I simply want less and will never agree with or vote for anyone who does.
Figures lie and Liars figure. You may skew you stats anyway you like. It's still BS. Once again write a bigger check to the IRS you ********************ing hypocrite.

I pay a hell of a lot more than my parents and grandparents, but I make a lot more than they ever did. Or you for that matter I would imagine.
Adjusted for inflation, you're saying that people who make what we make today, pay more taxes than they did? That's false. Unequivocally false.

I must have hit a nerve.
You don't like viewing yourself as a freeloader. Yet if we pass along debt to the next generation that is this substantial, like you've apparently convinced yourself is your right to do- then you are exactly that

Submit all the rationalizations a scab would make. You disagree. If the terms were only better. Etc etc. the end result is the government that our generation is responsible for is transferring a debt that we voted to accumulate onto our children.

Sorry, that deserves as much respect as a scab. And I certainly don't need to be lectured by someone who has no accomplishments that I don't. I have your job. I know what we did to get here, and I work for the airline that has held up wages in america for a decade. Add our business and unless you've got substantial incomes on the side, then I pay a much greater amount than you do.

None of that means we can just stand indignant and pass our debt. OUR DEBT SCAB! Ie: not THEIR DEBT. OURS!! Onto our kids.

And until we choose not to do that- we are fu(king freeloaders.

Whether you like that or not. It is what you are.
At least I'm actively working to not be that.
 

J.Otto

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Wave, how do you find the time to take these irrational posters seriously. You expend way too much energy and patience with lucid profundity to those with potatoes in their ears and the reasoning of a loyal pet dog.
 

waveflyer

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wave may engage you, but I won't waste my time. Go read some Keynes and get back to me.

I'd settle for them reading the cliff notes of Adam smith...
 

PCL_128

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redflyer65

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Why would we read that when we've been under the philosophy of John Keynes the past 6 years? You know, there is no bounds to government spending. But hey, I guess you guys are good with that..
 

J.Otto

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Why would we read that when we've been under the philosophy of John Keynes the past 6 years? You know, there is no bounds to government spending. But hey, I guess you guys are good with that..

these Kenyan philosophers need to butt-out of the us economy and deal with their ebola epidemic. What does Africa know about out our money system anyway. We like to borrow and spend beyond our means. What business is it of theirs anyway.
 

jonjuan

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If our national debt--just under Obama--were its own country, it would be the third largest econom in the world. Our total debt-- $17 trillion--is about the size of the entire US economy as of last year. To pay it off, we'd have to take every penny earned by every man, woman, child, business, corporation, pot dealer and street walker for the entire year of fiscal 2013, while not spending a single additional penny. On ANYTHING.

Borrowing trillions to pay the equivalent of six Ecuador's ($101B) worth of welfare and unemployment is not solving any problems.
 
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