Recalls at Delta?

[JB Bus Drvr]

Had dinner last night with some crashpad buddies who fly for DL. They seem convinced that all furloughs will be recalled by the end of the year and hiring off the street by '06. Any thoughts or is this wishful thinking?

 

[acarpe3448]

I hope they are right! That would be great.

 

[TankerPuke]

I work in the Guard with a DL fur-log and he said just last week that he was told by ALPA that he can't expect a recall until 2008. He was in one of the last 2 classes at DL. Having said that - fingers crossed for everyone that the rumor is true


PUKE

 

[Launchpad]

I'd say somewhere in between 06 and 08. No way we will all be back by the end of the year. I doubt they will even get through the 125 recalls by summer that has been advertised. It's going pretty slow... Better than nothing I guess.


Later-

 

[satpak77]

They seem convinced that all furloughs will be recalled by the end of the year and hiring off the street by '06

No and No

wishful thinking and hopeful rumors, dont we all need it

 

[av8n]

Delta Furlough Update

Item 2. Recall Update:

T.K. moved up nine numbers on March 1 and is now seniority #7629.


17 Pilots returned to active status for March:

1 - Effective March 5, 2005
7 - Effective March 7, 2005
9 - Effective March 15, 2005


April
Delta sent letters to offer recall for April classes.

They plan to return ten pilots to active status on April 3, 2005 and ten on April 13, 2005.

Delta is not offering 3-yr or 5-yr PLOA as an option with this recall class and probably will not do so in the future.

May?

We haven?t received any word yet on the numbers or timing for the May classes.

 

[DAL737FO]

We are suppose to recall 125 by the end of the year. (that was a correction from the recall coordinator, BB, at the recall reorientation class when asked how we are going to recall 125 for the summer schedule) The current LOA allows the company until 2008 to get all of the furloughee's back on property. We are going to be critically short of pilots this summer but it will even out once PBS scheduling takes effect this fall. If the schedule continues to increase then recalls will continue.


DAL M-88 FO

 

[General Lee]

Right now we are limited by lack of sim time. We have so much training going on due to the recent retirements, and at the same time we don't have a lot of extra funds to buy more sim time from someone else. We have expanded our ATL schedule by 81 flights a day since Jan 31st, and that has helped bring back the above mentioned 125 recalls. Word on the street is that we will need more due to the possibility of decreasing the turn times even more on certain aircraft in ATL, requiring more pilots. Our depeaked hub system at ATL is supposedly doing well. I hope they all come back soon and TBKANE is back on the line pronto. Then we can start hiring ASA and CHQ guys......


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[P38JLightning]

he's back!

>>>>Then we can start hiring ASA and CHQ guys......


Bye Bye--General Lee


I will be very dissapointed in you if your 5000th post isn't dedicated exclusively to this very topic!

By the way, what an empty promise you are making. Delta always hired tons of ASA guys and some CHQ guys (especially ASA guys) so what you are saying is that when Delta hires off the street again, you will, as a "reward", continue to hire at or less than the normal ammount of ASA guys you have always hired. There is no way you can think you are going to take 50 a month or something.

So ASA's "reward" will be not being blackballed. Wow I bet next time Delta furloughs there will be shockwaves of fear throughout the industry as a lesson learned from this that you better take DAL furloughs or there will be hell to pay! Why, that's better than actually "spending negotiating capital" getting their jobs back, isn't it? (well on the bright side at least the class of 2004 got theirs, and you still keep your "night override" LMAO)

Oh I almost forgot to tell you that you are 100% powerless to stop the hiring of Comair pilots that are:
1. Delta interns
2. WMU "fast tracks"
3. close relatives of DAL pilots
4. other special interest groups

So your big threat will I guess only apply to line pilots, most of which are not part of the RJDC (although you will of course hire droves of ASA RJDC pilots, won't you) line pilots who in some cases lobbied extensively to get DAL furloughs here, and some who even gave money to your furloughs (yeah that's right) Yep, I guess your big lesson will reverberate throughout the industry and protect future Delta furloughs.

Green slips anyone?

 

[General Lee]

>>>>Then we can start hiring ASA and CHQ guys......


Bye Bye--General Lee


I will be very dissapointed in you if your 5000th post isn't dedicated exclusively to this very topic!

By the way, what an empty promise you are making. Delta always hired tons of ASA guys and some CHQ guys (especially ASA guys) so what you are saying is that when Delta hires off the street again, you will, as a "reward", continue to hire at or less than the normal ammount of ASA guys you have always hired. There is no way you can think you are going to take 50 a month or something.

So ASA's "reward" will be not being blackballed. Wow I bet next time Delta furloughs there will be shockwaves of fear throughout the industry as a lesson learned from this that you better take DAL furloughs or there will be hell to pay! Why, that's better than actually "spending negotiating capital" getting their jobs back, isn't it? (well on the bright side at least the class of 2004 got theirs, and you still keep your "night override" LMAO)

Oh I almost forgot to tell you that you are 100% powerless to stop the hiring of Comair pilots that are:
1. Delta interns
2. WMU "fast tracks"
3. close relatives of DAL pilots
4. other special interest groups

So your big threat will I guess only apply to line pilots, most of which are not part of the RJDC (although you will of course hire droves of ASA RJDC pilots, won't you) line pilots who in some cases lobbied extensively to get DAL furloughs here, and some who even gave money to your furloughs (yeah that's right) Yep, I guess your big lesson will reverberate throughout the industry and protect future Delta furloughs.

Green slips anyone?

Wow. Bitter, bitter, bitter. Greenslips? Yeah, because we really are short on pilots and cancelling flights now wouldn't help. Acutally, greenslips HELP Delta because those flights will fliy regardless, and greenslips are time and a HALF, while inverse assignments (getting guys in the jetway or on the phone at home) actually pays double time. So, greenslips save the company money, and allow people who want to fly to get the trip, instead of people coming off of trips that want to go home.

Also, we really have no more sim time available to call back huge amounts of recalls. We would like to, but right now we can take about 30 a month max. Thanks to about 1000 captains leaving since last May, we are jammed full of training sims right now, and that also leaves open trips to cover. We are trying to balance greenslips with recalls, and trying not to cancel flights. Also, the cap was increased on many categories from 75 hours to 81 or more hours, and greenslips do not count (time and a half) until you reach the cap, which is tougher to do now that the cap has been raised. Not many people can squeeze them in because the trips are longer.

AS far as NOT hiring Comair pilots, I never said that would happen, I just said that many of us will go straight to the hiring people when we starting hiring and DEMAND that we hire as many ASA and CHQ pilots as possible. I am sure there are plenty of Comair pilots that have Delta dads, and WMU people or interns. But, I will be on the phone CONSTANTLY and showing my FACE ALL OF THE TIME down at the employment office, giving my OPINION. It may be awhile until we hire again, we want the furloughs to come back first obviously. But, when we have everyone back and we eventually hire again, I will be there.


You really seem bothered by my statements I see. I can tell you are threatened yourself because you think you deserve some sort of special treatment. Well, you really don't. Your group of pilots should have been more vocal in your support of our furloughs. You never were. You really didn't offer squat, and the ASA and CHQ guys came through, BECAUSE IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. You can't seem to understand that.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[180ToTheMarker]

Then we can start hiring ASA and CHQ guys......

If Citrus doesn't hire all of us first

 

[P38JLightning]

missing the point

You really seem bothered by my statements I see. I can tell you are threatened yourself because you think you deserve some sort of special treatment. Well, you really don't.

You are incorrect. I don't think I or any other Comair pilot deserves "special treatment". I guess I just enjoy pointing out that your blackball threat is unfounded and misdirected as much as you enjoy making it.

Your group of pilots should have been more vocal in your support of our furloughs. You never were.

Define "your group" and explain to what extent we should have done differently. Quite a few Comair pilots called/spoke to our reps and MEC immediately and throughout the whole issue, walked in furloughed DAL pilots resumes and wrote checks to help the furlough emergency relief fund and secret santa fund. The MEC was against this, IMO because they are mostly either outright or closet supporters of the RJDC and we all know they think (or at least thought at the time) that DAL furloughs are some kind of onelist forcing leverage.

So my "group" actively did more than the ASA and CHQ groups. Those places simply hired them according to their long standing policy and their pilots had nothing to do with it. Sure the ASA MEC may have been "consulted" as a heads up, but it was never their decision to make. Hiring the ASA and CHQ MEC's with preference may be appropriate, but I just don't see how blackballing all Comair pilots (except interns, fasttracks, sons/daughters and mil buddies...they of course will still get hired regardless of your efforts and you know it) makes any sense.

So lets say you were exclusively in charge of hiring. You have 2 apps for one position. One is an ASA pilot who you know for a fact did nothing but sit back and watch (not actively helped) and is an RJDC supporter. The other is a Comair pilot who called and talked to status reps, walked in resumes, wrote checks to help your furloughs, and is not part of the RJDC. Who do you hire?

You really didn't offer squat, and the ASA and CHQ guys came through, BECAUSE IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. You can't seem to understand that.

There are plenty of ASA and CHQ pilots who "didn't do squat" and many Comair pilots who tried their best. You don't think there is a difference and I disagree. Don't forget, you owe JB pilots big time, because they "stepped up to the plate" and made sure many DAL furloughs got hired (into higher paying jobs than ASA) and that, too, should "be remembered."

 

[AMRCostUnit]

Acutally, greenslips HELP Delta because those flights will fliy regardless, and greenslips are time and a HALF, while inverse assignments (getting guys in the jetway or on the phone at home) actually pays double time.

Time and a half for make-up and DOUBLE time for involuntary reassignments? Next you'll tell me you have trip guarantee (pay protection for cnx) too!

Unit
All straight time for us and zero trip guarantee...

 

[General Lee]

If Citrus doesn't hire all of us first

If you want that, then go for it!


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

You really seem bothered by my statements I see. I can tell you are threatened yourself because you think you deserve some sort of special treatment. Well, you really don't.

You are incorrect. I don't think I or any other Comair pilot deserves "special treatment". I guess I just enjoy pointing out that your blackball threat is unfounded and misdirected as much as you enjoy making it.

Your group of pilots should have been more vocal in your support of our furloughs. You never were.

Define "your group" and explain to what extent we should have done differently. Quite a few Comair pilots called/spoke to our reps and MEC immediately and throughout the whole issue, walked in furloughed DAL pilots resumes and wrote checks to help the furlough emergency relief fund and secret santa fund. The MEC was against this, IMO because they are mostly either outright or closet supporters of the RJDC and we all know they think (or at least thought at the time) that DAL furloughs are some kind of onelist forcing leverage.

So my "group" actively did more than the ASA and CHQ groups. Those places simply hired them according to their long standing policy and their pilots had nothing to do with it. Sure the ASA MEC may have been "consulted" as a heads up, but it was never their decision to make. Hiring the ASA and CHQ MEC's with preference may be appropriate, but I just don't see how blackballing all Comair pilots (except interns, fasttracks, sons/daughters and mil buddies...they of course will still get hired regardless of your efforts and you know it) makes any sense.

So lets say you were exclusively in charge of hiring. You have 2 apps for one position. One is an ASA pilot who you know for a fact did nothing but sit back and watch (not actively helped) and is an RJDC supporter. The other is a Comair pilot who called and talked to status reps, walked in resumes, wrote checks to help your furloughs, and is not part of the RJDC. Who do you hire?

You really didn't offer squat, and the ASA and CHQ guys came through, BECAUSE IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. You can't seem to understand that.

There are plenty of ASA and CHQ pilots who "didn't do squat" and many Comair pilots who tried their best. You don't think there is a difference and I disagree. Don't forget, you owe JB pilots big time, because they "stepped up to the plate" and made sure many DAL furloughs got hired (into higher paying jobs than ASA) and that, too, should "be remembered."

Look, this is really simple, and you are making it complex. When it comes down to it, the ASA and CHQ pilot groups did not oppose the help of our furloughs, allowing them to have a job offer without losing their number at Delta. Comair, on the other hand, was different. I know that the Comair pilots did not have the ability to change their management's rule, but at the same time they never really vocally opposed that same rule. Most of the Comair people on this forum and those out there on jumpseats stated that it was too expensive to train our people (even though DL would have ultimately footed the bill) and then have them leave, or it just wouldn't be fair to the other furloughed newhires from other airlines (too bad, DL owns Comair), etc..... Too many excuses and not enough "hey, these guys are in a time of need and maybe we should try to help them out." There was a lack of compassion there, and Lawson wanted more 70 seaters in return and was vocal about that. That was a SLAP in the face to many of our people that were in need. And, I am not the only person who feels that way. Everyone over here knew that Comair wasn't helping our furloughs, and this was after a lot of our people wrote checks (along with everyone else at ALPA) to help you guys out. That was fresh in our minds, and the negative press sure doesn't help. So, I would like to stress again that some Comair pilots probably will be hired in the future. Great. But, I will personally go to the employment center when we eventually start hiring again someday and I will voice my opinion to the powers at large who will do the hiring, and I am sure I won't be the only one. What is wrong with me WANTING TO HELP HIRE AS MANY ASA AND CHQ PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE? Note please that my statement doesn't say anything about Comair or it's pilots. Have a great one.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Tomct]

P38...you need to relax. Don't be making statements about another companies pilots (with regards to donations etc.) without having all of the facts! I donated and I work for ASA! Your comment that we just sat back and watched while the "almighty Comair pilots" did everything in their power makes me want to PUKE! By the way...NICE VOTE! Thanks for the Knife in the back....MY sticker is in the mail back to you!

 

[Tomct]

Delta guys...I hope that all of the furloughs are back online ASAP!! I don't wish that situation on anyone!
General...I look forward to meeting you in the "Widget City Employment Office!"
...everybody freeze...everyone down on the ground!

 

[General Lee]

Delta guys...I hope that all of the furloughs are back online ASAP!! I don't wish that situation on anyone!
General...I look forward to meeting you in the "Widget City Employment Office!"
...everybody freeze...everyone down on the ground!

Tomct,

I hope we get those furloughs back quick and we do start hiring again someday soon. If it were up to me (and I will see what I can do about that) I would stick all of the ASA and CHQ guys in the front of the line..... It may be awhile, though. Thanks for your support of our furloughed pilots.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Tim47SIP]

So my "group" actively did more than the ASA and CHQ groups. Those places simply hired them according to their long standing policy and their pilots had nothing to do with it. Sure the ASA MEC may have been "consulted" as a heads up, but it was never their decision to make.

You know, I have heard this several times, but it is just plain wrong. I was approached by the Dallas LEC and talked with the ATL LEC and both said the same thing. They asked what my thoughts were if we were to hire furloughed Delta pilots. Both were getting opinions to pass on to management through our MEC. The way I took it is that we could have stopped the hiring if we felt that was something we wanted to do. We had no clue of what Comairs stance on this would be.

I can unequivocally remember the posts on this and other boards by Comair pilots that stated what the General is testifying to. I also remember when Comair guys came to ATL for their expansion. That was quite comical in that they would consistently demand that they get special treatment and would not be delayed because they were Comair. You should of heard the calls on the radio. They quickly learned that technique wasn't going to work.

On a side note: I am one of the few that doesn't think Comair guys screwed anyone with their recent vote. I think they made the right decision. We have to learn when to fight our battles. I also think that they may have helped us get a Comair +1 contract sooner than we could have done on our own. Time will tell.

 

[General Lee]

Tim,


I remember those quotes on this forum, and from Comair guys in the jumpseat, telling me that it was too expensive to train Delta furloughs and then allow them to go back to Delta, even though Delta was footing the bill. Ridiculous. That won't be forgotten.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[P38JLightning]

perspective

>>>>P38...you need to relax. Don't be making statements about another companies pilots (with regards to donations etc.) without having all of the facts! I donated and I work for ASA! Your comment that we just sat back and watched while the "almighty Comair pilots" did everything in their power makes me want to PUKE! By the way...NICE VOTE! Thanks for the Knife in the back....MY sticker is in the mail back to you!


Tomct,

I didn't say that all Comair pilots helped out more than all ASA pilots. I did say that some Comair pilots had crappy attitudes about it and their motivations were sinister at best. I criticized the MEC's stance on the whole issue too. I'm sure there were ASA pilots who bent over backwards to help. I'm just trying to dispell the notion that all ASA pilots "stepped up to the plate" and actively helped while all Comair pilots "blocked" their coming here. That notion is clearly proliferated by the General's broad brushed statements about how all ASA and CHQ pilots should be pre-hired at Delta while all Comair pilots should be blackballed, regardless of the individual's stance on this issue and regardless of how much the individual helped or didn't help.

As for the vote, sorry. I voted against the LOA. What more can I do? If you go on strike I'll donate twice the ammount of my pay this LOA gave up for as long as you're on strike. What else can I do?

So my "group" actively did more than the ASA and CHQ groups. Those places simply hired them according to their long standing policy and their pilots had nothing to do with it. Sure the ASA MEC may have been "consulted" as a heads up, but it was never their decision to make.

You know, I have heard this several times, but it is just plain wrong. I was approached by the Dallas LEC and talked with the ATL LEC and both said the same thing. They asked what my thoughts were if we were to hire furloughed Delta pilots. Both were getting opinions to pass on to management through our MEC. The way I took it is that we could have stopped the hiring if we felt that was something we wanted to do. We had no clue of what Comairs stance on this would be.

I can unequivocally remember the posts on this and other boards by Comair pilots that stated what the General is testifying to. I also remember when Comair guys came to ATL for their expansion. That was quite comical in that they would consistently demand that they get special treatment and would not be delayed because they were Comair. You should of heard the calls on the radio. They quickly learned that technique wasn't going to work.

On a side note: I am one of the few that doesn't think Comair guys screwed anyone with their recent vote. I think they made the right decision. We have to learn when to fight our battles. I also think that they may have helped us get a Comair +1 contract sooner than we could have done on our own. Time will tell.

That's not at all what happened here. We wer enever consulted, and our MEC (according to all sources available) were never approached by management of any kind. All there ever was was a meeting by the DAL MEC chair in which he came right out of the gate saying you will do this or there will be hell to pay. Our MEC took the bate, got emotional, and acted like babies right back at them. They should have taken the high road and didn't. We were never asked. As for the infamous "jumpseaters" there were probably the same num nutz who thought they were getting a seniority ratio when the PID was in full swing. Sorry about that too, but they are in the minority and I think you know that. (You have a few of them over there BTW).

General,

I don't have a problem with your proposed preferential hiring of ASA and CHQ other than its very thinly veiled threat to all Comair pilots. It seems getting "those who helped" hired takes a back seat for you to punishing every pilot on the list at Comair regardless of what that person did. Over.

 

[General Lee]

P38,


No threats here. I am not in charge of any future hiring at Delta. But, I will stress to those people that I hope they hire many ASA and CHQ pilots. But, my personal thoughts about Comair and their reluctance to help our guys in need made an impression on a lot of people over here, not only on me. We will see what happens....



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[doh]

P38,

I have been on the other side of the rude jumpseater coin. You know, you get on to go home and you get the nth degree about how you're not worthy blah, blah, blah. My solution for you would be to get contacts at other places. Delta was never a first choice of mine because they fly too little long haul. Get over and meet some people at NWA. They have great unity and are really fun to fly with! Look at UPS and FEDEX. They have better job security and the pacific rim! Really, there are places where I think you can have a lot more fun. If you did get hired at Delta, I think you would always get sunshine blown up your skirt by some people when they found out you were Comair during this time period. Why go through the hassle? Like I said, go some place that flys the pacific! Trust me, it was the best time I ever had on layovers!

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

P38,


No threats here. I am not in charge of any future hiring at Delta. But, I will stress to those people that I hope they hire many ASA and CHQ pilots. But, my personal thoughts about Comair and their reluctance to help our guys in need made an impression on a lot of people over here, not only on me. We will see what happens....


Bye Bye--General Lee

General,

I wouldn't be so hard on the Comair guys if I were you. FedEx, and others, refuse to interview furloughed DAL, AA, and NWA folks because they BURNED FedEx in the past. I am told this applies mostly to Delta guys. These people said yep I really want to be at FedEx and resign from XXX airline. Then, when the recalls came, the CP's called their furloughed folks and threw out the resignation letters. I can only imagine the CP's did it to save interview costs and didn't give a hoot who they pissed off. The improper actions of Delta guys near your seniority, Labor and management, are having a profound effect on Delta furloughees out there now. A bigger impact than the perceived inaction of Comair guys who have little to no say in hiring. Should you punish these Comair guys, Labor, for the actions of Comair management?

Should we treat you like a red-headed stepchild because of that or, since you are a Delta guy, the treacherous actions of your LABOR group should be forgotten even as you brag about who will feel your wrath when you can next exercise it??

I think the previous near sighted actions of Delta, AA, and NWA guys should be forgiven and forgotten. And the perceived actions/lack of action from Comair guys, especially since it not even in the same league, should also be forgiven.

I am literaly shocked that you could hold such a petty attitude toward Comair guys.

For your own good, get out of the cockpit (and off flightinfo.com) for awhile to get a different perspective. Comair may be a competitor for 90-100 seaters but they aren't guiltier than thou.




Regards,

FBJ

 

[doh]

Wow, I did not know that about the folks at big D. I guess they don't like being done unto as they have done. Still, I agree that we should have been more vocal about our MEC's gaff in meddleing in the airlines hiring.

 

[General Lee]

P38,

I have been on the other side of the rude jumpseater coin. You know, you get on to go home and you get the nth degree about how you're not worthy blah, blah, blah. My solution for you would be to get contacts at other places. Delta was never a first choice of mine because they fly too little long haul. Get over and meet some people at NWA. They have great unity and are really fun to fly with! Look at UPS and FEDEX. They have better job security and the pacific rim! Really, there are places where I think you can have a lot more fun. If you did get hired at Delta, I think you would always get sunshine blown up your skirt by some people when they found out you were Comair during this time period. Why go through the hassle? Like I said, go some place that flys the pacific! Trust me, it was the best time I ever had on layovers!

We don't fly enough long haul? Ok...... Oh, to the Pacific......Oh yeah, alright. Hey, I never said I was rude to any jumpseaters, I just asked them why Comair wasn't allowing our furloughs jobs, to which most stated it was too expensive FOR COMAIR. I just looked at them and said "Ok, riiiight" and then went on doing my job.




Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[doh]

General, don't get touchy. I just said, if Delta is not going to hire Comair pilots, it ain't the end of the world for those who want to move on. There are other places to go. And they csn have a pretty good time over there too. Delta has the highest percentage of domestic flying out there. So, if you go to Delta, you are not going to fly long haul as quick. My comment wasn't derogatory to Delta, I just am pointing out alrenatives for Comair guys, because I'm pretty sure you are blackballing, or doing your best to blackball them.

 

[General Lee]

General,

I wouldn't be so hard on the Comair guys if I were you. FedEx, and others, refuse to interview furloughed DAL, AA, and NWA folks because they BURNED FedEx in the past. I am told this applies mostly to Delta guys. These people said yep I really want to be at FedEx and resign from XXX airline. Then, when the recalls came, the CP's called their furloughed folks and threw out the resignation letters. I can only imagine the CP's did it to save interview costs and didn't give a hoot who they pissed off. The improper actions of Delta guys near your seniority, Labor and management, are having a profound effect on Delta furloughees out there now. A bigger impact than the perceived inaction of Comair guys who have little to no say in hiring. Should you punish these Comair guys, Labor, for the actions of Comair management?

Should we treat you like a red-headed stepchild because of that or, since you are a Delta guy, the treacherous actions of your LABOR group should be forgotten even as you brag about who will feel your wrath when you can next exercise it??

I think the previous near sighted actions of Delta, AA, and NWA guys should be forgiven and forgotten. And the perceived actions/lack of action from Comair guys, especially since it not even in the same league, should also be forgiven.

I am literaly shocked that you could hold such a petty attitude toward Comair guys.

For your own good, get out of the cockpit (and off flightinfo.com) for awhile to get a different perspective. Comair may be a competitor for 90-100 seaters but they aren't guiltier than thou.




Regards,

FBJ

FBJ,

Ok, what? There is a huge difference here that you are obviously not aware of. Delta owns two regional carriers, ASA and Comair. They both are equally owned by Delta. When we started having major problems, only ASA came through and allowed our people to have a job. Now, I know where you will go with this, but the problem that everyone has here is the Comair attitude during this. They were not very caring or did not vocalize any sympathy towards our furloughs and their plight. No, they continued to state that they couldn't change their rules, even though their sister airline easily did so. Instead of stating, "We are sorry and we will try to get this worked out" they stated "Nope, can't change the Comair 10 commandments...." That is the difference. Now, I am allowed to voice my opinion anytime, and I will voice it towards the hiring people when the time comes, stating that I hope they hire as many ASA and CHQ (the other group that helped without a carrot) pilots as possible.


Now, as far as your diatribe on how "we redheaded stepchildren" should be treated, I say "HUH?" What? Treachorus actions by our labor group? Huh? Please say again what our labor group did to affect our furloughs? We have just lost 1000 Captains since last May, and our union has been fighting to get our furloughs back, and they recently got approval for atleast 125 more recalls this year, after the company initially said NONE. We are limited by lack of sims, since losing 1000 Captains has thrown everything into disaray. We have so many people transitioning and upgrading to fill in those spots left by those Captains, it is a wonder that there is any room to add people back. Delta, as you know, doesn't have a lot of extra cash on hand to buy additional sim time, and we are doing what we can to turn this big boat around.

As far as you being SHOCKED at my attitude....Where were you when this was actually happening? You didn't see these arguments on this board? You didn't see that we, along with other ALPA carriers, helped Comair through their toughest time (the Strike) and when we had our toughest time they refused to help like their sister airline ASA and an outsider CHQ? A lot of our pilots were pi$$ed to say the least. If it were a mainline vs DCI deal, wouldn't ASA also have been not allowed to help? The problem here is their lack of vocalization----not their management's rules. They turned their heads---that is my opinion and many others out there.

And now you want me to get off flightinfo and get another perspective? Ok Dad. I see it all the time in the crew lounge. I know what most feel out there, I also have plenty of Delta friends that were furloughed and are back now, and they all feel the same. And, no way they(DCI) are getting anything larger than 70 seats for the Delta side, as stated by our VP of Flt ops in a recent (3 weeks ago) lounge show.

So, before you lambast me, you need to read up more on your Comair/ASA/Delta history. Quit preaching when you don't know the facts....


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

General, don't get touchy. I just said, if Delta is not going to hire Comair pilots, it ain't the end of the world for those who want to move on. There are other places to go. And they csn have a pretty good time over there too. Delta has the highest percentage of domestic flying out there. So, if you go to Delta, you are not going to fly long haul as quick. My comment wasn't derogatory to Delta, I just am pointing out alrenatives for Comair guys, because I'm pretty sure you are blackballing, or doing your best to blackball them.

Ok, maybe I got touchy. You made it sound like Delta didn't fly a lot of INTL, when we do. It actually doesn't take too long to get INTL flying--maybe the 5 or 6 year mark. I am sure NW is the same or longer. You can't start off that way unless you get on with ATLAS or POLAR. Even UPS and FEDEX usually start you at FE on something domestic. (I know UPS was offering INTL 757FO on this last bid, but I bet that was abnormal)


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[~~~^~~~]

General:

I hope that Delta figures out how to make money again and gets the pilots recalled to enjoy a good career. Two thoughts that I would like to read your comments on:

(1) How is any airline going to make money with oil between $50 and $60 a barrell?

(2) Figure that Delta is positioning Comair for the 100 seat battle ground? Tossing the E Jet type into the heart of ALPA's representational battle seems like lighting a fuse. I know you think your scope has this wrapped up, but are you sure?

Rumors from a wide variety of sources are that the ASA MEC was playing footsie with the Delta MEC on a J4J type agreement while LOA 41 was being negotiated. Surely Delta management knows something of it and perhaps is angling to get the type going at a subsidiary with a less cozy relationship between labor leadership.

I would sure like to see ALPA provide some sort of leadership that would get your pilots off the street now and provide some future for the RJ's pilots as the type gets phased out in favor of larger, more efficient airplanes.

We can probably forget the days of $40 oil. As China's economy spins up demand is going to soar.

~~~^~~~