RAH Representation Election - Write in "RPC"!

[StaySeated]

I found this language in the Republic contract and can't find anything similar in the Frontier contract: "The Company will not transfer any Company aircraft or schedule any pilots to fly any trips for airlines that are on strike unless mutually agreed by the Company and the Union."

Did Frontier pilots approve a contract where they can be forced to fly for an airline on strike? Seriously?

Thank you for pointing out a rather significant difference between Frontier and RAH.

Frontier doesn't "fly any trips for airlines". Frontier only flies trips for Frontier.

The language that you cut and pasted, and bolded again for unnecessary emphasis, only applies for a fee-for-departure airline.

That would be 0-3. You are out.

I can only imagine the amount of time you just wasted trying to find "bad" things about the "evil" frontier pilots.

The RPC is an effort to bridge what all of us (3000 RAH pilots) have today into a functioning bargaining unit.

Forcing 700+ pilots into the IBT is not the answer.

If you vote for the RPC, you keep everything you have today with the IBT, and you benefit from an engaged group of experienced pilots that care about the progression of all of our careers.

 

[StaySeated]

I cannot believe this is serious.

You FAPA folks are drinking some dirty dirty Kool-Aid, from both management AND your representatives.

One list, one voice, one contract. Vote IBT. Period.

Honest question Jack,

When do you believe we will have "one contract"?

This is a post from the rahpilots.com website...

"We will not have one contract or one voice for a very long time.

The RPC is the only structure that really works while we are working towards the "one contract" and "one voice".

357 is currently in mediation. They have a schedule until November. That is it for the rest of 2011. Then they will be back at the table sometime in 2012. Keep in mind, another airline labor group has been in mediation for 36 months. They are no where near done and no where near being released. The 357 contract negotiations are much closer to the beginning then the end.

Meanwhile, the FAPA CBA remains in effect until an amalgamated CBA can be negotiated.

None of the CBA issues are going to be resolved any time soon. We are looking at several more YEARS of having two CBA's. That is just the unfortunate reallity of our situation.

Anytime someone says "one Contract", they are either not accepting reality or they do not understand our reality.

Therefor, how can we have "one voice" when we still have "two contracts"?

Why should we have "one voice" when we still have "two contracts"?

We have a very unique holding company structure at RAH today. We need a very unique representation structure to function in today's reality.

The RPC is that structure.

357 keeps doing what they do.
Fapa keeps doing what they do.

The CBA's are still administered by the guys that understand them.

Simultaneously, we begin to work together on the pieces that can be merged immediately. We also begin to work together on the pieces that are going to take more time to merge.

One list, one voice, one contract is a shangri-la dream. It doesn't come close to capturing the challenges we face today.

RPC will work.

 

[StaySeated]

Rpc = fapa...

You are halfway there....

RPC = FAPA + 357

working together

We need a unique structure to represent a very unique holding company

RPC is the only structure that will work

If you vote RPC, you will keep everything you have today with the 357 and you will inherit another very engaged pilot group.

 

[arjayeffo]

Congrats China Clipper, you have secured way more votes for IBT than any actual IBT member could have dreamed. Regardless, this vote was dead before it started. The numbers will never work. It won't even be close.

 

[ChinaClipper]

F9 is in the process of being spun off...all this angst is for naught......move on with your lives. The FAPA guys will try and make a reconfigured F9 work, funded in part, by work rule concessions and the IBT can get back to Section 6 and not be so spellbound and "distracted" by the $$$ and power they are chasing now. RPC was a good idea, thankfully, the IB won't have to worry about a poisonous snake in the tent. As for F9? Who knows, the IBT has made giving up $$$ for an unknown future a better option than spending the next 7 years keeping a seat war for RAH lifers....BTW This "case" will serve as a template for Mergers for a LONG TIME! Greed and power are corrosive personal faults, just as dangerous to a Union than to management. Don't expect a beaten house wife to not slip ya a Mickey.....

 

[SF340Guy]

F9 is in the process of being spun off...

That would solve a lot of problems...

 

[Beetle007]

I can only imagine the amount of time you just wasted trying to find "bad" things about the "evil" frontier pilots.

The RPC is an effort to bridge what all of us (3000 RAH pilots) have today into a functioning bargaining unit.

Forcing 700+ pilots into the IBT is not the answer.

If you vote for the RPC, you keep everything you have today with the IBT, and you benefit from an engaged group of experienced pilots that care about the progression of all of our careers.

That is what happens when a smaller airline is bought by a larger airline. The union of the larger airline often becomes the surviving representative.

You are wrong about the Frontier pilots not approving Lynx. It would have never been allowed under the previous contract. Frontier might have created a holding company prior to the contract, but they had to wait for the Frontier pilots to sign on the dotted line before it could start operations.

You keep saying that Frontier pilots should have an equal voice in the "council" that is the bargaining representative for all the pilots. That just doesn't work when Frontier represents a significant minority of the pilots for which the "council" would have to bargain.

This is the most insane idea if I have seen in a long time.

 

[jacksjj]

Honest question Jack,

When do you believe we will have "one contract"?As soon as they are amalgamated.

This is a post from the rahpilots.com website...

"We will not have one contract or one voice for a very long time.I don't care what someone wrote on rahpilots.com. It is more than likely the misguided opinion of a Frontier pilot. Misguided, mind you, by most likely YOU - who I can only assume were part of the FAPA leadership. Correct me if I am wrong.

The RPC is the only structure that really works while we are working towards the "one contract" and "one voice".Works for the FAPA leadership in their pathetic attempt to stay in "power", maybe.


357 is currently in mediation. They have a schedule until November. That is it for the rest of 2011. Then they will be back at the table sometime in 2012. Keep in mind, another airline labor group has been in mediation for 36 months. They are no where near done and no where near being released. The 357 contract negotiations are much closer to the beginning then the end. And you hope to help this situation? How so? Throwing up your hands and saying "sorry guys - it is what it is..."?

Meanwhile, the FAPA CBA remains in effect until an amalgamated CBA can be negotiated. Congratulations on losing every single job you farmed out with your pathetic scope clause.

None of the CBA issues are going to be resolved any time soon. We are looking at several more YEARS of having two CBA's. That is just the unfortunate reallity of our situation. Reallity?

Anytime someone says "one Contract", they are either not accepting reality or they do not understand our reality. And which reality is that? I believe "your" reality of which you speak is nothing but a misguided opinion.

Therefor, how can we have "one voice" when we still have "two contracts"? Simple - one representative body elected to represent both with no preference for one group over the other. See: NOT RPC.

Why should we have "one voice" when we still have "two contracts"? Simple - whipsaw. Which, I will add, is exactly what is happening every single time FAPA sits down with the company and negotiates something in their short sighted interest.

We have a very unique holding company structure at RAH today. We need a very unique representation structure to function in today's reality.

The RPC is that structure.No it most certainly is not.

357 keeps doing what they do.Fighting for all RAH pilots.
Fapa keeps doing what they do.Selling all non FAPA pilots down the river.

The CBA's are still administered by the guys that understand them.

Simultaneously, we begin to work together on the pieces that can be merged immediately. We also begin to work together on the pieces that are going to take more time to merge.

One list, one voice, one contract is a shangri-la dream. It doesn't come close to capturing the challenges we face today.

RPC will work.

Please please please please please please show the ISL number of any native RAH pilot involved with the RPC! I would be willing to bet everything I have (not much) there isn't one.

You're wasting your time.

 

[Beetle007]

The Republic Pilots Council (RPC) is an umbrella joint Council that would be certified by the NMB as the designated bargaining representative for all Republic Airways Holdings pilots under the Single Transportation System if it prevails in the coming election. The RPC members will initially consist of equal representation from the current FAPA and Local 357 leadership.

Why would Frontier pilots expect equal representation on a council that is the bargaining representative for ALL Republic Airways Holdings pilots.

That would be like the Airtran pilots saying that they should form a council that is half Airtran and half Southwest that will bargain for both of them but that each pilot group will fight individually for its own interests. Does that really not seem crazy to you?

 

[trainer8]

You are halfway there....

RPC = FAPA + 357

working together

We need a unique structure to represent a very unique holding company

RPC is the only structure that will work

If you vote RPC, you will keep everything you have today with the 357 and you will inherit another very engaged pilot group.

I find it interesting that there is not one name, not one reference, not one contact number for this .org posing as a NPO and "council." If RPC is a legit 501(c)3, lets see the proof. If it is a Council, it has listed members and a leadership committee, at least. None are mentioned in the propaganda on this thread, nor in the mailing I received via USPS. Nothing. What? I have to sign up to see who you are? Nice try.

So, RPC Council, time to fess up. You want votes? Quit hiding. Names, phone numbers, address and your source of finances to put out the mailings and web site. Otherwise, you are a scam to skim votes and nothing else.

T8

 

[jacksjj]

After careful consideration, I have decided this is either a joke or what WH does in his spare time. Neither is funny, or even remotely entertaining.

 

[Axel]

Thank you for pointing out a rather significant difference between Frontier and RAH.

Frontier doesn't "fly any trips for airlines". Frontier only flies trips for Frontier.

The language that you cut and pasted, and bolded again for unnecessary emphasis, only applies for a fee-for-departure airline...

By your reasoning above, should the RAH group strike, F9 should keep flying their Airbus schedules? Would you then be OK with a Airbus flying over a route RAH struck?

I think you too may have managed to point out a very significant difference between the two groups. I really hope I misunderstood you, because there is a very, very naughty "S" word for people who would do that.

 

[A320kid]

By your reasoning above, should the RAH group strike, F9 should keep flying their Airbus schedules? Would you then be OK with a Airbus flying over a route RAH struck?

I think you too may have managed to point out a very significant difference between the two groups. I really hope I misunderstood you, because there is a very, very naughty "S" word for people who would do that.

Get over yourself, you are the typical RAH 2%er who is so hung up on yourself you come across like a complete ass. Let me help you out in my best "Timmy" voice - you ply por a wegional on other air wines wrouts. Better?

Just give it a little more time and F9 will no longer be apart of this "family." Your wet dream will be ending soon and you will then be able to go back to yanking gear on that mighty 170 for Delta.......express.

 

[dlzav8tr]

The funny thing is you know that RAH pilots would come in with their 190's to do all f9's routes given the chance. Then they would try to extend the fence indefinatly.

 

[trainer8]

The funny thing is you know that RAH pilots would come in with their 190's to do all f9's routes given the chance. Then they would try to extend the fence indefinatly.

Yeah, the RAH pilots make all the management decisions at RAH...pshhh...

 

[embraerjetpilot]

Funding source: Maybe the money that FAPA took out of their "contingency fund" that they sent the letter out a week or so ago?

 

[Bolo]

By your reasoning above, should the RAH group strike, F9 should keep flying their Airbus schedules? Would you then be OK with a Airbus flying over a route RAH struck?

I think you too may have managed to point out a very significant difference between the two groups. I really hope I misunderstood you, because there is a very, very naughty "S" word for people who would do that.

If RAH group go on strike then The FFD carriers should go on strike as well(Delta, U.S. Airways, United)? Wake up Axel your living in your own dream world. Be careful how you use that "S" word!

 

[Axel]

Get over yourself, you are the typical RAH 2%er who is so hung up on yourself you come across like a complete ass. Let me help you out in my best "Timmy" voice - you ply por a wegional on other air wines wrouts. Better?

Just give it a little more time and F9 will no longer be apart of this "family." Your wet dream will be ending soon and you will then be able to go back to yanking gear on that mighty 170 for Delta.......express.

Couple of things:

I am not RAH. I was, but I'm not. When I was, my indifference to who flew what was wider than the sea. People like you seem to care much more about which people don't fly the Airbus than people at RAH care who do.

Wet dream? To commute from the East Coast to DEN for long trips rather than drive 10 minutes to work and be home almost every night, all just so I could have sex with your airplane? Hardly.

You got awfully mad. The "S" word is certainly incendiary but even so, you got pretty shrill. With the invocation of that word, some anger is expected, but I find it disturbing that rather than address what I wrote you instead attempted (unsuccessfully, I might add) to insult me with tired cliche rhetoric.

Having left the slow-motion train wreck that now exists at that happy house, I feel as if a great weight has been lifted from my shoulders. Enjoy your Airbus while it lasts. Enjoy your station above the RJ scum while it lasts, keep the RJ scum out of the Airbusses until the last one is sold and above all else, keep up the fight.

 

[chqflyer]

By your reasoning above, should the RAH group strike, F9 should keep flying their Airbus schedules? Would you then be OK with a Airbus flying over a route RAH struck?

I think you too may have managed to point out a very significant difference between the two groups. I really hope I misunderstood you, because there is a very, very naughty "S" word for people who would do that.

Technically, since we're just a contract feeder and don't "own" the flying we're doing, there is absolutely no reason for any mainline pilot group to honor our strike when it gets to that point. It would be a perfect opportunity to take it back. I'm not trying to be a total Debbie Downer, just pointing out the reality that no one really gives a ******************** about the labor issues at a POS regional except those employed here. Hell, I'd be surprised if more than 20% of our pilot group even bothers voting.

 

[Axel]

The funny thing is you know that RAH pilots would come in with their 190's to do all f9's routes given the chance. Then they would try to extend the fence indefinatly.

If a Airbus replaced a Embraer on any or all routes, that is just management exercising their prerogative. Likewise if a 170/190 replaced a Airbus route. As bitter a pill as it can sometimes be to swallow, it is management's job to best allocate their equipment. And as bitter a pill as it seems to be, the Airbusses and the Embraers all belong to the same management.

If on the other hand, F9 struck, no animal painted Embraer would move.

For you, bolo, it is not inconceivable in that event that ALL the RAH Embraers would be parked. The contract language is unambiguous that while the groups are still separate management can't shift assets to cover struck work. Even if they tried, the RAH group (despite what some on these boards may shout) would honor the line.

Should RAH strike, it would not be expected for all the legacies to conduct a general strike of all their flying. It would be expected that all the legacies and all the other FFD carriers attached to them would honor the specific routes RAH published as struck work.

Since (never at heart, but still on paper) F9 and RAH are the same company, if either went on strike, the other should cease operations also.