Quality of Regional Training

[flyinloki]

Likewise just because it's hard doesn't mean it's good.

Hell, in college, the worse the teacher, the harder the class, cause they didn't teach you anything and you had to learn it on your own.

d@mn right Ralgha!

 

[Birddog]

Well, whether you like it or not, I think GIA has some of the hardest training on the regional side...
Also, just because it's hard doesnt mean it can't be good too. Sit in and enjoy.

On what do you base this assumption? Based on some personal and some anecdotal evidence, 1900 operators seem to love overteaching the airplane. Knowing the psi in the stabilon boot does not make the training good. A high failure rate is not indicative of good training. That only shows that the level of screening and instruction does not match the desired outcome of the training program.
The pace of training at Comair is relaxed (stated mildly), but they do have a high passage rate. Training costs money after all. I have been told the training at Mesaba is moderately paced, but pretty thorough and mostly relevent material. I have also heard mostly good things about Air Willy. I can't vouch for other operators.

 

[MECH]

A high failure rate is usually an indication of a poor training program. In a typical training class the bust rate should not go above 20 to 25%. Anything above that shows that the training has failed not the applicants. Our company use to have great checking progam but a lousy training programing. Thankfully that has changed.

 

[The_Russian]

Actually the training is very good. It is slow paced, much like you mentioned CMR's training. Four weeks of ground on initial, then 30 hours in the 1900C, then 30 hours in the 1900D level C or D sim.

The high failure rate for street CPT's at GIA seems to stem from the "I know everything already" additude people come in with. The training is difficult on purpose to weed out the bad apples. GIA doesn't want just anyone to be a CPT. We need quality pilots who can handle a low time pilot next to them while performing the neccessary duties of the PIC. That part goes with the job.

 

[Ty Webb]

Actually the training is very good. It is slow paced, much like you mentioned CMR's training. Four weeks of ground on initial, then 30 hours in the 1900C, then 30 hours in the 1900D level C or D sim.

Don't forget the 30 hours a week in the left seat of a Honda, delivering pizzas to pay Tom Cooper . . . . .

Originally Posted by The_Russian:

Ty, Baby, you want happy ending with that pizza?

 

[The_Russian]

Don't forget the 30 hours a week in the left seat of a Honda, delivering pizzas to pay Tom Cooper . . . . .

That's how I pay for the wedding bills honey pie. If you made any money at A S S Tran you could help pay to feed the kids and dog.

Looks like we need marriage counseling Ty.

 

[The_Russian]

PS

I told my sister and mom how you treat me.

 

[Ty Webb]

Yeah, between my "city house" and my "beach house", it's a little tight . . . . but I did budget enough for an occasional pizza from my favorite delivery girl . . . . just don't get too cheezy on me, Becky. . . and if it comes with a sausage, you should probably take it over to snake or Freddie- I hear they like that.

Originally Posted by The_Russian:

Ty, Baby, you want happy ending with that pizza?

 

[NEDude]

Mostly from Indy (ACA). This is not the first time it has happened. On average, two 121 or 135 street pilots coming to GIA out of every class fail out of 1900 training.

I could see a guy who has been flying an RJ for quite some time having a hard time trying to be a street captain in a BE-1900. Totally different kind of flying. I think a person with only BE-1900 time would have a hard time trying to go to street captain of an RJ as well. I think it has more to do with a complete change in the type of flying rather than Gulfstream being tough.

 

[The_Russian]

I could see a guy who has been flying an RJ for quite some time having a hard time trying to be a street captain in a BE-1900. Totally different kind of flying. I think a person with only BE-1900 time would have a hard time trying to go to street captain of an RJ as well. I think it has more to do with a complete change in the type of flying rather than Gulfstream being tough.

I can agree with that. However a 1900 CPT going to the CRJ would be a systems lesson rather than systems and re-learning how to fly an airplane again. Turbo props are a lot harder to fly than jets, especially without an autopilot to aid in those engine failures. Most of the Jetstream pilots at ACA made it through the training just fine.

 

[Ty Webb]

I can agree with that. However a 1900 CPT going to the CRJ would be a systems lesson rather than systems and re-learning how to fly an airplane again.

Not necessarily true at all. Lots of differences, in aerodynamics, operationally, performance planning, and just the sheer difference in speed all take some getting used to, just as going back to a t-prop does.

Turbo props are a lot harder to fly than jets, especially without an autopilot to aid in those engine failures. Most of the Jetstream pilots at ACA made it through the training just fine.

Engine failures are done without the autopilot in the sim, generally. . . .

Now, stop typing and get that d amn pizza over here before it gets cold . . . and remember to keep the Honda coordinated in the turns on the way here . . . I don't want all the good stufff sliding to the outside in the turns, like last time.

 

[hotwings402]

What airplane do you use the autopilot for in a engine failure? (ERJ I take it) What does it do? What does the pilot have to do? Excuse the ignorance I've never heard of that.

 

[Rook]

I've heard that Eagle is top notch. Comair made learning a tough plane like the Brasilia fun believe it or not. 9E...well my initial was self-study but the upgrade was a lot better. Heard good things about XJ and XJT as well.

Rook

 

[exchexflyer]

I am definately not trying to turn this thread into a chautauqua bash, but I have to complain about the upgrade course. Initial training was good, but they are trying to save money by making us do an accelerated upgrade class. 4 sims and then your type ride. I started upgrade on the 6th and I will be done with ioe at the end of this month. Maybe this is enough since the pass/fail ratio is about 80/20. I am curious is to how the other regionals conduct their ungrade course. How much are they going over systems? We had two days, what a joke. How many sims do you get before your type?

 

[Rook]

I am definately not trying to turn this thread into a chautauqua bash, but I have to complain about the upgrade course. Initial training was good, but they are trying to save money by making us do an accelerated upgrade class. 4 sims and then your type ride. I started upgrade on the 6th and I will be done with ioe at the end of this month. Maybe this is enough since the pass/fail ratio is about 80/20. I am curious is to how the other regionals conduct their ungrade course. How much are they going over systems? We had two days, what a joke. How many sims do you get before your type?

Same story at 9E (almost) they implemented a short course for those that had time in type a couple of years ago. 5 sims and the type ride. Systems was a quick brushup. Better than initial even though initial was longer for obvious reasons. Good luck.

Rook