PSA: Tower closed courtesy

[BoilerUP]

Why in the eff would ATC 1. not issue "hold for release" instructions and 2. issue void times in excess of 10 minutes?

Sure its courteous to not call ready until you're #1, but sounds like ATC down there is seriously lacking...

 

[DrProc]

If I was #1 for departure and it's a full clearance you are still going to wait 10 mins while I plug it into the FMS and verify It's correct. :crying:

Good thing you don't fly to Mexico, where they give you the clearance along with the t/o clearance while you backtaxi down the runway for departure.

 

[goahead]

That's what bad English education gets you.

UMMMMM Incomplete Sentence, Sound the alarm!!!!

 

[centralpilot]

Hold for release is fine. However if crews are receiving a void time and accepting it while still at the gate there is a problem that needs to be addressed.

This is my gripe. I'm fully aware of hold for release procedures. However, in AVL and MGM PSA has frequently gotten released by center while still on the ramp. I just don't appreicate being told to hold for release due to departing traffic, only to find that the "departing" aircraft was still on the ramp while I was approaching the hold short line.

 

[centralpilot]

Well I see you are at a regional who hires low timers as well. Perhaps you yourself should review your way of getting a release and inform the center there as well. You can get a clearance at a closed tower via center whenever! However center should thus tell you to HOLD for release. Thus this is what happens at many MANY uncontrolled fields throughout the United States. I did all my IFR training at an uncontrolled field by Indianapolis and this is exactly what happen all the time. We fly pleanty into OAL (JAX NC) with you're CRJ200s and they do the same thing (while at the gate getting clearnace and told, "hold for relase")

Perhaps one needs to educate themselves first and also edcuate those down in MGM ATC about how to effectively use the "hold for relase." Anyways continue to rant if you wish.

I'll admit I used poor terminology in my first post. My gripe pertained to requesting release from center while still at the gate, not the initial clearance.

 

[Metro752]

Wow, someone pushed someones buttons. Haha!

 

[meyers9163]

I'll admit I used poor terminology in my first post. My gripe pertained to requesting release from center while still at the gate, not the initial clearance.

So now you are telling me that they are declining a hold for release and demanding a release? I will say that operations into CLT as of late especially for AVL allows for the pilots to tell ATC while on the ground the time they will be ready for TO in order to allow flow into CLT. Some new operations CLT has set up. Anyways I also know ATL center hates the operation in general.

If they are indeed saying, "no I want to be released" and refusing to do hold for release then yes you have a gripe. If indeed ATC has given them a release and ATC has done so that's ATC fault not the pilots IMO.

 

[centralpilot]

So now you are telling me that they are declining a hold for release and demanding a release? I will say that operations into CLT as of late especially for AVL allows for the pilots to tell ATC while on the ground the time they will be ready for TO in order to allow flow into CLT. Some new operations CLT has set up. Anyways I also know ATL center hates the operation in general.

If they are indeed saying, "no I want to be released" and refusing to do hold for release then yes you have a gripe. If indeed ATC has given them a release and ATC has done so that's ATC fault not the pilots IMO.

All I know is that they were released while back at the ramp and not #1, and that is has happened often enough to be a pattern. In my experience, center has always asked if we were #1 at the end of the runway before releasing us. I have no idea if PSA has been claiming to be #1 while still on the ramp or if ATC just hasn't been asking before issuing the release. It is possible that it is an ATC issue and if so I appologize. In any case, if I hadn't been sleep deprived this morning I probably wouldn't have been irritated enough to rant in the first place. Now that I've had some sleep, I've remembered that I'm not getting paid nearly enough to get worked up over these things. Please disregard & get back to important matters, like how much mesa sucks.
:beer:

 

[buxflyr]

We fly pleanty into OAL (JAX NC) with you're CRJ200s and they do the same thing (while at the gate getting clearnace and told, "hold for relase")

If you fly plenty into Jax NC, you would know its OAJ.

The real danger there are those crop dusters!

 

[meyers9163]

If you fly plenty into Jax NC, you would know its OAJ.

The real danger there are those crop dusters!

Ah forgive a typo when I'm typing at damn near 100+wpm and making a quick post. I'll be sure to break down on your spelling errors in the future !


The danger at OAJ is the damn FBO manager thinking he owns that field. Trying to yell at the ASA guys when they get clearned straight in at times etc. Saw that dude try to say something to one of their guys the other day. Guess he files a crap load of reports on both ASA/PSA and just wants them out.... Too bad those loads are too packed for both Delta/Airways to pull out!

 

[J32driver]

Had to deal with this in a past life at one particular western airport. The "other" company would always call and get the clearance at the gate. We were scheduled out 5 minutes before they were. Invariably, they would always shut the airport down on us. It got so predictable, that we'd just taxi out before them. Let them pull up behind us where they couldn't turn around... and then we'd refuse to move until they called ATC back and canceled their clearance. Had to go through that twice, and then magically, they quit calling until they were number 1. No more problems for the rest of the year.

 

[belchfire]

Had to deal with this in a past life at one particular western airport. The "other" company would always call and get the clearance at the gate. We were scheduled out 5 minutes before they were. Invariably, they would always shut the airport down on us. It got so predictable, that we'd just taxi out before them. Let them pull up behind us where they couldn't turn around... and then we'd refuse to move until they called ATC back and canceled their clearance. Had to go through that twice, and then magically, they quit calling until they were number 1. No more problems for the rest of the year.

Ya know, that's classic...the other thing to do would be to call Center and say "Scumbag 401 is still at the gate and I'm here at the end of the runway ready to go if you can clear me as filed...your choice, but I'm not going to leave the hold short line and taxi out if his way on an uncontrolled airport."

The other thing you could do is-if your opsspecs allow and the WX is good is to blast off VFR and pick up your clearance airborne. When Center inevitably asks about "Scumbag 401" you can tell him/her that you saw "Scumbag 401" still on the gate and perhaps you should chastize them for blocking the airspace before they are fully ready and thus you won't be compelled to take off VFR and get the clearance airborne...

 

[Metro752]

Omg 100 Wpm!

Blasting off VFR this day and age with a good number of people in the back, in the United States, is just ********************ing stupid.

 

[LandRoverNut]

If you fly plenty into Jax NC, you would know its OAJ.

The real danger there are those crop dusters!

Now you did it! Why did you have to bring up the crop dusters? They are only trying to have fun and make a living!

 

[ThrottleJockey1]

Get it...

Get block or better in your contract and STFU