Please provide advice to father...

[pilotyip]

The college flying programs do not prepare a pilot for an entry-level job, except maybe CFI. The college grad has to go out and built time. When the college graduate starts building time he is four years behind the HS grad. The college grad may know more about Greek Literature but his pilot skills are indistinguishable from the HS grad. Just to add, since you are looking into flying as a career and want to get a degree in anything to cover all the boxes. Get a degree in business by going through the community college or on line degree route while building flight time. It is a degree that you can use throughout your life. It is essential to understand how to manage your life and your household as it though it was a business. Knowledge of budgeting, cash flow and finance will assist you making sound decisions. The pilot shortage will return in the future, those with flight time will the first hired.

 

[Caveman]

I think the only advantage to a degree from Riddle is the alumni network. As time passes more and more Riddle grads are working at the majors and all else being equal a fellow alumni will get the nod. Military pilots have been helping each other get hired for years and to some degree the large Riddle alumni network is starting to do the same thing.

Pilotyip has been banging the drum regarding flight hours vs degree for years and I basically agree with him. If your son knows he wants to fly then start flying now. The most important attribute on a pilot resume is experience. That means experience measured in years and hours in his logbook. Get his ratings as soon as possible and get started as a working commercial pilot. Then have him get to work on his degree while he is getting paid to fly. Almost all college kids have to work while in school. He might as well work in his chosen career. When he's done with college he'll have a couple thousand hours and 4-5 years experience as a pro pilot. That puts him well ahead of a college based aviation graduate IMO.

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

I think the only advantage to a degree from Riddle is the alumni network. As time passes more and more Riddle grads are working at the majors and all else being equal a fellow alumni will get the nod. Military pilots have been helping each other get hired for years and to some degree the large Riddle alumni network is starting to do the same thing.

Pilotyip has been banging the drum regarding flight hours vs degree for years and I basically agree with him. If your son knows he wants to fly then start flying now. The most important attribute on a pilot resume is experience. That means experience measured in years and hours in his logbook. Get his ratings as soon as possible and get started as a working commercial pilot. Then have him get to work on his degree while he is getting paid to fly. Almost all college kids have to work while in school. He might as well work in his chosen career. When he's done with college he'll have a couple thousand hours and 4-5 years experience as a pro pilot. That puts him well ahead of a college based aviation graduate IMO.

The above is great advice. Well said....and accurate too. That is the only advantage of an aviation schools: The networking opportunities that pay off sooner or later.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

The above is great advice. Well said....and accurate too. That is the only advantage of an aviation schools: The networking opportunities that pay off sooner or later.

I never afforded myself the priveldge of dumping large buckets of cash and intrests to an aviation school.....

Networking is important and I got all my jobs due to it.. Air Inc... didn't do anything.....

Perhaps if someone wasn't the networking type... but there are plenty of organizations to get involved with to network without having to pay the money to a UND or ERAU school......

 

[JettBoii]

Send him to law school.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Send him to law school.

I'd say ANYTHING BUT LAW.

Trust me.

 

[CMI]

Tell your son to get a college degree. The robots and computers will take over piloting jobs in the next 20-30 years. Look at how fast unmanned vehicles are taking over the military flying. I am not saying all piloting jobs will be gone, but the industry will change.
http://www.aviationtoday.com/av/iss...-Unmanned-Aircraft-Can-They-Coexist_6115.html
Checkout the last sentence in the article.
"And while it may take somewhat longer for FedEx founder Fred Smith to realize his long held dream of unmanned intercontinental air freighters, that too can no longer be seriously discounted."

 

[pilotyip]

Fly because you like to. I am always high, high on my chosen profession, every day in this business a happy day. It goes back to the days of sitting in the Howard Johnson's in Belleville Michigan back in 1964. Listening to the Zantop pilots talk about their adventure in their C-46's. Having one of their pilots, 'Firecan Haddock" solo me in the C-172 at YIP in 1965. I am still living the dream, and cannot believe I have been so lucky to be where I am today. I guess there is not much of that anymore, particularly on this site. I would change little and looking back am happy I did it this way.

 

[FLYHY]

The most important thing for your son to do is go to college and get a degree. It does not matter what field of study he pursues, and with time he will be able to acquire his licenses and ratings, but if he does not go to college right after high school he may never get there.

 

[nosehair]

Fly because you like to. I am always high, high on my chosen profession, every day in this business a happy day

I will second that emotion !

I am in my retirement years, and am very greatful that I have lived my dream, and am still doing so.

I didn't finish college. I started flying first, then worked my way thru a couple years of college, but never finished.

Of course, there was some down times during the 50 years of flying, and I might have changed careers somewhere along the way, if I had been able to make another profession,...but I really don't think I would have arrived at this point in my life with a complete head full of wonderful life experience memories if I had been in an office somewhere.

Do it for the passion, not for the money. In the end, it is worth it. You can't buy what I have.

 

[Way2Broke]

I second or third the degree outside of aviation along with the ratings. It might be hard to get him to bite at the idea, but if you lose your medical, or lose your job it can be your one saving grace.

I am doing what you mentioned before, I became a established professional pilot and then went back to school while flying. The time management can be very difficult, but I was not as mature as your son sounds and at 18 I would have just found a kegger and flunked out of college. Everyone is different with how they achieve a flying career, and that is the one thing that makes flying with different people so interesting, they all have a story to tell.

Whatever you do, avoid the sales pitches and future economic struggle of the "pilot mills" as mention previously. Remember who is paying for that big glossy ad in the magazine at the end of the day, and that is the consumer.

 

[pilotyip]

Coming hiring boom

Now most likely is a good time to start building for a flying career. Much like 2002 when everyone said the flying business is dead, the hiring boom of 2007 followed that. That is when fogging mirror qualified you for a pilot job. When economy recovers, flying jobs will return. I have seen it too many times, 1978, 1984, 1996, and 2007.

 

[ualdriver]

Now most likely is a good time to start building for a flying career. Much like 2002 when everyone said the flying business is dead, the hiring boom of 2007 followed that. That is when fogging mirror qualified you for a pilot job. When economy recovers, flying jobs will return. I have seen it too many times, 1978, 1984, 1996, and 2007.

I agree with somewhat concerning the booms, but where are all the guys that got hired in 2007 now? Back on the street again! Heck, granted I work for a crappy airline but some of the guys that got hired on the "boomlet" before that are on the street, too!

And yeah, it was true that if you could fog a mirror a couple of years back you could get a job.......but only a $20K/year regional airline job- not a REAL** job. A real job like other professionals get when they graduate from college. A REAL job where one could earn a REAL living that would allow them to service their flight training debt, and......perish the thought....be able to afford their own apartment. Perhaps a decent used car, and.........God forbid......perhaps a real job that would allow them to start saving for the future.

I think the little "boomlets" that this industry goes through are extremely misleading. The bottom line is that for now, and for the foreseeable future, there is a huge oversupply of pilots, there has been for at least a couple of decades, and the continuing degradation of pilot wages, retirement, work rules, and general quality of life is the manifestation of that oversupply.

**when I say "real" job, I'm not saying that to disparage regional airline pilots. I'm referring to the fact that most of you guys are woefully underpaid for the job you do.

 

[pilotyip]

Real Job?

when I say "real" job, I'm not saying that to disparage regional airline pilots. I'm referring to the fact that most of you guys are woefully underpaid for the job you do.

So ualdriver are you one who says the only way to a real job is 4 years of college before taking your first flying job? BTW What defines a real job?

 

[ualdriver]

So ualdriver are you one who says the only way to a real job is 4 years of college before taking your first flying job? BTW What defines a real job?

I think I defined what a "real" job is in the second paragraph. I'm speaking strictly in a financial sense. A job where the person who chooses the "piloting" profession can get a job flying ANY airplane making a wage that covers the costs associated with the training required for the profession (which in my opinion practically demands a 4 year degree AND commercial/multi/instrument/probably CFI) and also pays you a premium for the "risk" we all take getting into this profession that isn't present in other careers. That's a "real" job to me. Flying a 30M dollar jet around for 20K/year is not a real job. Flying a C172 around the pattern for 15K/year is not a real job. You can't support yourself, a family, nor your future on those types of wages.

Nope, in my opinion, I don't think one needs a 4 year degree to become a pilot. I don't think anyone needs any type of degree to become a pilot. However, I can't imagine sending one into this profession without a 4 year degree for a variety of reasons, nor would I recommend the "no degree" path to others seeking advice about entering the profession.