Please provide advice to father...

[Tristar]

While Yip is correct that you certainly don't need a degree to become a pilot, and there are plenty of non-degreed pilots running around - not having one greatly limits your choices of where you will eventually work, and makes you much less competitive for many jobs. The bottom line is when the majority of applicants have a four year degree, you are the odd man out without one.

I am also not enthusiastic about aviation universities. They may be great for networking, and it's certainly fun to hang out with like minded people. If the day comes and you lose your medical or just get fed up with the BS involved in many flying jobs, a degree from a well recognized school will go much farther (and provide more of those networking opportunities) than one from a "pilot school."

When it comes to airlines or even more so with any corporate department I've been familiar with, a business or technical degree from a well known school trumps one from a pilot school hands down.

I do agree with the idea of getting your ratings as soon as practical, and then instructing while you're in college. Then you're building time and getting a degree simultaneously.

What I would caution against is the temptation which will surely come when the economy picks up to drop school and hook up with the first regional he can get hired at. In the past doing so might have led to a shortcut to a major job, and ultimately a lower seniority number and all the benefits which came along with that. I believe the entire career paradigm has shifted and that is no longer the case. Many guys now are making lateral moves between regionals looking for a slightly better deal than where they are now - the path to the majors is uncertain and there are MANY people who will be lifers at the regionals. I think he will be much better served by having a good education in the event that he someday decides to leave flying for any of a variety of reasons.

 

[pilotyip]

Still a good path

While Yip is correct that you certainly don't need a degree to become a pilot, and there are plenty of non-degreed pilots running around - not having one greatly limits your choices of where you will eventually work, and makes you much less competitive for many jobs. The bottom line is when the majority of applicants have a four year degree, you are the odd man out without one.

I do agree with the idea of getting your ratings as soon as practical, and then instructing while you're in college. Then you're building time and getting a degree simultaneously.

What I would caution against is the temptation which will surely come when the economy picks up to drop school and hook up with the first regional he can get hired at. In the past doing so might have led to a shortcut to a major job, and ultimately a lower seniority number and all the benefits which came along with that. I believe the entire career paradigm has shifted and that is no longer the case.

He can still do a degree on-line while flying for a regional. Then when UAL, DAL, etc is hiring he has his degree in "Whatever" and he has 1000's of hours of MEL 121 turbine. You get hired on flight time, the degree just opens the door. BTW as posted by a UAL pilot

PilotYIP,
I am with ya! I was a 60 College Credit wonder that was a NAVCAD-got hired at UAL when I was 27-and finished my degree on the side before hand.

My Degree is WORTHLESS....

I would take a "Hard Knocks" Pilot anyday. I have no idea why people are SO WRAPPED around the AXEL about a Four Year Degree!

 

[Way2Broke]

Yip,

I want all doors open! I do agree that a degree is not required to get started, but depending upon what you want it is require to finish the marathon. A career is not a sprint, it is truly a marathon. Look at you career, it was the ultimate in marathon, granted all around one airport, but you kept up the pace all around perimeter. The simple fact of the matter is that each person has to find their own way. I think getting a private before entering a degree program that involves aviation is critical. That way you can make sure that you are not just caught up in the youthful idea flying being a "romantic" career.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

How about getting an education for the sake of learning more about your world beyond the fundamentals found in a H.S. graduate.

College isn't always about getting a job in aviation or some other particular field. One should learn about things that don't necessarily have a direct connection to ones vocation. College will help broaden and expand your knowledge and introduce you to cultures and subjects you might not learn elsewhere. It can be the starting point for many great things besides a degree in a chosen field.

 

[Way2Broke]

Amish,

I see your point. But I have learned way more about the world traveling around as a pilot than I could ever possibly learn in the classroom.

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

"He who hath a trade or a profession, hath an estate."

 

[ualdriver]

"He who hath a non-pilot trade or a profession, hath an estate."

I fixed it for you. Benjamin Franklin would probably approve.

 

[pilotyip]

Should to it your way

How about getting an education for the sake of learning more about your world beyond the fundamentals found in a H.S. graduate.

College isn't always about getting a job in aviation or some other particular field. One should learn about things that don't necessarily have a direct connection to ones vocation. College will help broaden and expand your knowledge and introduce you to cultures and subjects you might not learn elsewhere. It can be the starting point for many great things besides a degree in a chosen field.

If thatis the way you feel then you should encourage everyone to follow your advice, the same as I have done.

 

[Tristar]

Amish,

I see your point. But I have learned way more about the world traveling around as a pilot than I could ever possibly learn in the classroom.

Not completely disagreeing with you, but I find that traveling around the world as a pilot adds a different dimension to anything I could learn in a classroom. That said, without some background to draw from (and I am admittedly weak on history and cultural geography), I don't get as much out of being there as I otherwise could. All to often I go somewhere, then learn more about it after I've been there - it would have been nice to have had a greater appreciation and understanding BEFORE I spent a week there!

That said, that's really icing on the cake. The meat of it still is giving yourself a solid foundation on which to build the rest of your life and giving yourself options - isn't that one of the basic concepts we try to teach students? Would you encourage a student to take off with 30 minutes of fuel reserve on a cross-country in conditions conducive to TRW's with a planned arrival time at dusk and no knowledge of diversionary airports along the way? I would certainly hope not, yet in out obsession with getting hours, turbine time, and a seniority number (not that any of those are unimportant) many pilots are essentially doing the same thing to themselves. I have several friends who stopped a few classes short of a degree and are now stuck (both in aviation, and in their current positions in aviation) where they are because they
don't have a four year degree.

You can argue whether or not it really makes a better pilot or not, but empirical evidence is clear - a four year degree (preferably from a "name brand" school) is a basic entry requirement for most aviation jobs anymore, and it certainly provides a lot of other options if aviation doesn't work out for whatever reason.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Amish,

I see your point. But I have learned way more about the world traveling around as a pilot than I could ever possibly learn in the classroom.

Hey W2B, my post wasn't negatively directed towards you. Just followed in sequence as I was addressing the thread.

It's certainly true one gains some life experience traveling as a pilot. My point was that there is more than the bulls-eye for a job when it comes to attending college. That's what trade schools are for. College exposes you to concepts within the social sciences which leads towards an education devoid of ignorance about how our world works. Some people are blessed with a thicket of education, yet lack real-world experience which is certainly a disadvantage. While real world knowledge is highly prized, its important to have a solid foundation from which to expand on. One cannot break the rules truly, until one has followed them excruciatingly. One needs their head below water in order to understand and relish having it above.

At any rate, education is a primer to embracing lifes experiences. It provides a neutral reference point, the framework, if you will, for the acquisition of further knowlege that which is built on the educational primer.

Basically, one should seek a college education not necessarily for the sole purpose of procuring stable employment, but to broaden ones understanding of the world around us. Taking classes in a variety of subjects is very good for the mind and soul. We should all be introduced to the wonders of this world, even if only a glimmer. Knowing about unrelated subjects and domains makes one a more complete person and actually enhances ANY occupation to an extent.

 

[Way2Broke]

I'm going to go along with the thread drift: what do you guys think of online college?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I'm going to go along with the thread drift: what do you guys think of online college?

Is it acreddited and does it check the box?

Or what is the difference between what a traditional college degree gets a student.

Universities don't do what they should, which is expand ones understanding of the world. Rather college simply gives a person advance training. Consider a BA/BS an advanced vocational training....

So does it matter if it is online or on campus?