Pinnacle pilots can do better

[PCL_128]

YOU were part of that leadership...YOU failed! There are very few "leaders" in ALPA...mostly followers....YOU are a follower...I've been thru ALPA leadership training as have you...They teach you to fight behind closed doors and come out unified...You know that, and you followed that...I don't believe in that, and that is why I was shunned....If you disagreed, you should have made that public...If you didn't, then you are part of the problem.

Did you go public with that? Did you take it to the message boards? Did you publically tell this to the pilots? If not, why not?

Yes, Joey, I did go public. I didn't bring it to FI, because quite frankly, it wasn't any of your business, but the pilots I represented in DTW knew that I was fighting for a leadership change, and I reported my disappointment to them at my last Local Council meeting after it didn't happen.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Yes, Joey, I did go public. I didn't bring it to FI, because quite frankly, it wasn't any of your business, but the pilots I represented in DTW knew that I was fighting for a leadership change, and I reported my disappointment to them at my last Local Council meeting after it didn't happen.

You need to take things public....To message boards...That is how many pilots find out about things...The fact is, ALPA doesn't like to take internal issues public. Like it or not, most pilots don't go to meetings....If you feel strong about something, you need to use the internet these days..

You say it isn't "any of my business"...If we are to be one "brotherhood" fighting for each other and the profession, then it is my business....If we are going to do what is best for each of us....then it isn't any of my business....Which is it?

 

[PCL_128]

You say it isn't "any of my business"...If we are to be one "brotherhood" fighting for each other and the profession, then it is my business....If we are going to do what is best for each of us....then it isn't any of my business....Which is it?

The PCL TA is your business. The election of a PCL MEC Officer is not your business. Do you expect to be kept in the loop on every MEC election at 36 ALPA carriers?

 

[JoeMerchant]

The PCL TA is your business. The election of a PCL MEC Officer is not your business. Do you expect to be kept in the loop on every MEC election at 36 ALPA carriers?

If you felt strongly about it, you should have taken it public....Otherwise you are part of the problem...This keeping ALPA dirty laundry private is BS....Air it out for everyone to see...If you don't, you are part of the problem....

 

[buscap]

Are you really that afraid of Skywest and so smitten by ALPA....Here is the king ALPA cheerleader admitting he had no idea what was going on during his watch....He is the one that told everyone that voting for Obama would make everything better....He is the one that told everyone to believe in ALPA....Then this turd of a TA comes down the pike....Whoops!

Why are you such a true believer? I was at one time...and I was wrong...What's your excuse?

My point is you should tighten up the language in your wish. Remember the movie BEDAZZLED? Brendan Frazier ended up as a stupid small-peckered seven foot basketball player just because he didn't properly word his wish.

 

[PCL_128]

If you felt strongly about it, you should have taken it public....Otherwise you are part of the problem...This keeping ALPA dirty laundry private is BS....Air it out for everyone to see...If you don't, you are part of the problem....

Joey, the only one around here who's part of the problem is you.

 

[701EV]

PCL128,

You are sadly mistaken if you think Joe is part of the problem!

Take a look in the mirror!

701EV

 

[dondk]

Me too...What are you still doing at a "regional" then...ALPA and PCL_128 say you should have moved on by this point.

it isn't for lack of trying! I guess I just don't know the right people. I also was only interested in NON-ALPA carriers.

ALPA hated the first Compuserve message boards....That's where the first dissention started...It's been all down hill since then....Compuserve and AOL message boards started all the trouble making....ALPA would just prefer that we simply agree with them and send them money....uke:

Ah, that was it.. the AOL boards I am familiar with. Man, its been a long way and time.

 

[cessnamann]

PINNACLE MEC=FAIL!

If all you pinnacle pilots had your ALPA dues returned to you from the last 3 years it would probably equal the raise most of your FO's will be receiving with your "contract."
How any of you can defend this is beyond me. All the Pinnacle pilots I know will be voting no on this POS. I hope they spread the word.

 

[cessnamann]

Why do all the loudest ALPA cheerleaders (PCL_128) always come from the airlines with the worst contracts?

 

[JoeMerchant]

Joey, the only one around here who's part of the problem is you.

Specifically, how am I to blame? Am I to blame for the PCL TA? Am I to blame for the failure of scope? Am I to blame for the outsourcing of flying? Am I to blame for you paying to sit in the right seat as an airline pilot? Am I to blame for you not knowing what your own CNC agreed to?

Am I the ONLY one around here who is part of the problem....If I was gone, would all these problems go away?

 

[JoeMerchant]

it isn't for lack of trying! I guess I just don't know the right people. I also was only interested in NON-ALPA carriers.

Very smart.

Ah, that was it.. the AOL boards I am familiar with. Man, its been a long way and time.

I wonder if PCL_128 remembers the AOL boards?

 

[JoeMerchant]

Why do all the loudest ALPA cheerleaders (PCL_128) always come from the airlines with the worst contracts?

Makes them feel better about themselves....They can pontificate to us mere mortals about how they are trying to improve the industry for us...

 

[PCL_128]

Specifically, how am I to blame?

You spend all of your time attacking and none of your time looking for solutions.

Am I to blame for the PCL TA?

No, the PCL MEC is to blame for that. I share some of that blame for my time there.

Am I to blame for the failure of scope? Am I to blame for the outsourcing of flying?

Partly, yes. You are one half of the equation. The other half is the large group of mainline pilots that look down at regional pilots and refuse to fight for integration.

Am I to blame for you paying to sit in the right seat as an airline pilot?

No, but you are to blame for yourself paying to sit in the right seat as an airline pilot.

Am I to blame for you not knowing what your own CNC agreed to?

Of course not. But it does serve as a great example for future ALPA leaders as to how important it is for an MEC to maintain oversight of their own committees. You can bet that I'll never make that same mistake again. Your hero Ronnie had the right idea: "Trust but verify."

Am I the ONLY one around here who is part of the problem....If I was gone, would all these problems go away?

Of course not. You're only part of the problem, just as all of us are. The unfortunate difference with you is that you don't even endeavor to be part of the solution.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

PCL128,

You are sadly mistaken if you think Joe is part of the problem!

Take a look in the mirror!

701EV

Of course he is.... there is a difference between dissension and obstruction. Joey is an obstructionist... he is the McDonalds woman who sued because she spilled hot coffee on her crotch...

He is nothing more or less....

Joey has done nothing to promote the profession. He is a tool. His self esteem is so low, that he has to get attention from others by being a legal terrorist and suing others from what he couldn't obtain on his own....

At least the GIA guys as bad as that program is... paid for a service... Joey wanted a downright land grab... something for nothing because... he is a welfare case.... a loser who will drag other people down instead of trying to build himself up....

Name one thing Joey has done, I'll name three things that he does that trumps it...

Ignore the cancer that kills this profession...

 

[dondk]

Very smart.

Being an ALPA rep then committee VC for years, I've seen the good and the bad. Personally got bent over by my MEC who blamed it on ALPA national. (you already know I wasn't born yesterday!)

For me, I am not against ALPA, it has its place, and we all know some people need ALPA. I do agree with PCL, they offer a service that cannot be found anywhere else.

I wonder if PCL_128 remembers the AOL boards?

I have always believed in a statement from Mark Twain. [FONT=&quot]Age[/FONT][FONT=&quot] is an issue of mind over matter. If you don't mind, it doesn't matter.[/FONT]

 

[JoeMerchant]

You spend all of your time attacking and none of your time looking for solutions.

I spent time 10 years ago looking for solutions...ALPA and the mainline pilots didn't think it was a problem and didn't want a solution...I only attack things I don't agree with....Just so happens that ALPA and I don't agree on much....

No, the PCL MEC is to blame for that. I share some of that blame for my time there.

ALPA's policy of keeping the dirty laundry internal is also partly to blame...This situation happens at most MEC's....ALPA policy however is to disagree in private and agree in public...The average line pilot has no idea what goes on behind closed doors...I've seen...It ain't pretty...

Partly, yes. You are one half of the equation. The other half is the large group of mainline pilots that look down at regional pilots and refuse to fight for integration.

How am I to blame for the failures of scope and the outsourcing of flying?

Of course not. You're only part of the problem, just as all of us are. The unfortunate difference with you is that you don't even endeavor to be part of the solution.

That's not what you said above...You said the only here who is part of the problem is me...I endeavored to be part of the solution back when I was an ALPA cheerleader like you...Been there done that.

By the way, what is the "solution" that you want me to support....Is it the right solution for everyone?

 

[JoeMerchant]

Being an ALPA rep then committee VC for years, I've seen the good and the bad. Personally got bent over by my MEC who blamed it on ALPA national. (you already know I wasn't born yesterday!)

I've seen the same "bad"....and some "good"...I've seen more bad than good and have seen ALPA reps. go after me personally for simply disagreeing in public...That is a cardinal sin in this organization.

For me, I am not against ALPA, it has its place, and we all know some people need ALPA. I do agree with PCL, they offer a service that cannot be found anywhere else.

What "service" do they offer that can't be found anywhere else?

 

[PCL_128]

I spent time 10 years ago looking for solutions...

In other words, you're a quitter. Glad we cleared that up.

ALPA's policy of keeping the dirty laundry internal is also partly to blame...This situation happens at most MEC's....ALPA policy however is to disagree in private and agree in public...The average line pilot has no idea what goes on behind closed doors...I've seen...It ain't pretty...

Airing dirty laundry in public is not solution to any problem. Things should be handled internally. But they need to be handled.

How am I to blame for the failures of scope and the outsourcing of flying?

The seniority grab that you attempted has killed virtually any hope of bringing both parties together. The RJDC did more to destroy mainline/regional relations than anything else. And you were one of its founding "officers."

By the way, what is the "solution" that you want me to support....Is it the right solution for everyone?

The solution is being involved and working towards resolving problems rather than just attacking at every opportunity.

 

[dondk]

What "service" do they offer that can't be found anywhere else?

they are a one stop shop, historical, industry specific details that are readily available. I agree, you can find everything, just not in one place.

When they hold the contracts and all the dealings to get those contracts, they hold a card that does have value. At what price????

Oh.. I agree 100%, there are cardinal sin's. You are spot on with that.