pinnacle hiring

[searching]

actually flagshipper, most non-gulfstream Pinnacle guys i know, get along really well with many of the gulfstreamers.


you have no clue do you?
you've been there, what, a month.

also genius, you do know that Pinnacle WAS a PFT airline, so many of those senior captain YOU fly with, are former PFTers. Much like Comair.

 

[SaturnPilot]

If you want an interview and dont mind be hated by the majority go to gulfstream. Daddy will pay for it

I would be careful trashing a group of people that composes 1/4 of your pilot group, especially since you are brand new. As for being hated by the majority, I have been at 9E over a year and seem to get along well with almost everybody. Most of the captains that I fly with have good things to say about gulfstream pilots, without even knowing where I came from...it's the brand new guys they complain about. If you have anything else to say about your fellow pilots, I suggest you grow some balls and post it on our company message board.

 

[alrightythen23]

Let the games begin!!!



Pinnacle calls off talks with pilots

Liz Fedor, Star Tribune August 21, 2004 PINN0821

Management at Pinnacle Airlines has halted contract talks with the pilots union only a few weeks after negotiations began.

Memphis-based Pinnacle flies regional routes for Northwest Airlines, and it has surpassed Eagan-based Mesaba Airlines in the number of flights flown out of Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport.

"We were informed at the table that the process was going slower than they anticipated," Wakefield Gordon, chairman of the Pinnacle pilots union, said Friday. "They thought it was wise to simply break the negotiations off at this time."

The contract for about 930 Pinnacle pilots is amendable April 30, 2005, and about one-third of those pilots fly out of the Twin Cities. The rapidly growing Pinnacle is flying 44- and 50-seat Canadair Regional Jets for Northwest. Pinnacle operates a fleet of 103 CRJs and will have 129 planes by next year. Northwest holds options to acquire 175 more CRJs and Pinnacle wants to fly additional jets if the big carrier makes a CRJ purchase.

"We are one of the most, if not the most, productive pilot groups in the country," said Gordon, who leads the Pinnacle unit of the Air Line Pilots Association (ALPA). He said that it is "almost un-American" that Pinnacle pilots are paid at rates below their industry peers. A second-year co-pilot at Pinnacle would need a 50 percent raise to be on par with a co-pilot at Comair, which flies regional routes for Delta Air Lines and is at the top of the regional industry pay scales, he said.

On July 29, Pinnacle CEO Phil Trenary told Wall Street analysts that management and the pilots union had agreed to open negotiations early.

Eight to 10 bargaining sessions were held in July and August before management chose to abandon the talks this week, Gordon said. "They decided it was in their best interest to step back and go about it a different way," he said.

Only one contract topic had been discussed: training.

"While these early talks have stopped, their tone was professional," Phil Reed, Pinnacle vice president of marketing, said Friday.

He declined to elaborate on why management halted the negotiations.

"We remain optimistic about successfully completing these negotiations and will return to mutually beneficial talks at any time," Reed said.

In a message to pilots, Gordon said he doesn't expect talks to resume until December. The union is willing to restart negotiations earlier.

"We are disappointed and undeterred," he said. Pinnacle pilots will seek higher pay, better scheduling rules and a solid retirement plan.

"Pinnacle pilots are unwilling to forgo necessary contractual improvements for the promise of future growth," Gordon said in his memo to pilots.

Pinnacle's operating revenue reached $152 million in the second quarter, an increase of 39 percent.

Eagan-based Northwest is in contract talks with its pilots, and CEO Richard Anderson said Wednesday that the two sides hope to reach a deal by this fall. Northwest wants to cut pilot labor costs by $300 million a year, while the union has offered $200 million in cutbacks.

 

[blade230]

[Disclaimer] This is not a post in support of PFT. One usually does not insult ones "own" pilot group.

I agree with Saturn,
Flagshipper, if you have a problem with a very large portion of your pilot group, ie. Gulfstreamers and all the other SENIOR pilots who paid for training at THIS company, why don't you head over to our company message board and voice your concerns with your true identity.
Signed another person who has been here + 1 year. And is NOT 4-5 years away from upgrade. Much less. One more point, while your at it, lets trash all the Senior COMAIR PFT'rs who are the ones who helped negotiate one of the industry's leading regional contracts. Those PFT'rs sure gave in didn't they.

 

[T-Gates]

If you want an interview and dont mind be hated by the majority go to gulfstream. Daddy will pay for it

Now thats rich.... I agree with the above, go ahead and post your sentiments on the pilot message board and see whats comes of it. The whole time I flew at Pinnacle, I didn't hear a disparaging word about Gulfstream. except but from one Captain. That guy PFT'ed himself, so I discounted what he said since he was a raging hypocrite. Now there are ex-GIA guys in the left seat at Pinnacle, so make sure you voice your opinions when they are filling out your probationary evaluation.

Best of Luck

 

[xrayojilp1]

Guys,

I've been at Pinnacle for too long now and I've flown with plenty of Gulfstream pilots. I haven't had any problems, most people welcome them as people and pilots. There are issues that come up because of extreme low time, but overall the program seems to work OK for us. Why do we have to hire so many low time guys though? There is some sort of agreement obviously and kickbacks notwithstanding, Pinnacle is simply the worst regional airline to work for.

Sure Mesa makes less and Mesaba and others don't have the growth, but if you look at the way we are treated by managment and overall quality of life at PCL, we are the worst. Most guys who have other airline experience or who are still early in their career do not stay long at PCL. They do not tolerate it at all. They don't want to have to worry about being fired for getting sick and worse.

In fact Pinnacle is hiring at this time, but you will certainly not be upgrading any time soon, and if you did get one of these proposed new hire captain slots you would have to realize that its not because things are moving fast. Its because we have HUNDREDs of First Officers who have the seniority but not the time to upgrade (3000 hours with 500 in type at the company or 3500)you would not get off reserve for at least five years. Pinnacle already has over 100 jets and we are only getting 129. Yes there are options but if you know what just happened with negotiations and you realize that we are six months from officially starting our 'bargaining process' you will realize that those options are simply carrots for them to hold in front of us. Our pilot group is unified and furious at management for the way we are treated and we will get an industry leading contract after our strike (which is probably 3 and a half years away) Until then you have to realize that managment will attack and abuse its pilot group as has never been attempted before in this industry.

Expect ten days off for the next five years and reserve, you will fly every day but not get many hours. Also expect very soon that managment will start to build schedules that stagger days off so you never have more than 2 days off in a row. Don't get me wrong, it has always been like this to some extent but they will start to do this intentionally, as they have at times in the past.

Do you have an interview here? Sure show up and get the experience, but for god sakes unless you are really in dire straits you would be doing yourself and your family a hugh favor by turning the job down. If you do take the job expect the worst training and the highest failure rate in the industry (some of this is due to low time). You are risking throwing away your entire career for one crappy job. Also realize this isn't just the ramblings of one disgruntled guy, I'm also speaking for many furloughed pilots, experienced guys who have come to Pinnacle after years of experience with other regionals and/or majors. I have never talked to anyone who did not agree that we are the worst regional in this industry.

Sure that CRJ is a shiny cool jet, but I hope that is enough for you. Whatever you are looking for, Pinnacle ain't it.

_________________________________________________________________

P.S. If you guys are interested in a contract update: Our managment approached our MEC about 3 months ago and asked us to start negotiations early. They said they were interested in completing the negotiations process at the earliest possible opportunity (for the sake of furthur growth). As you may have heard managment broke off negotiations a few days ago. I have several friends who are in the LEC's and one who was actually there. Apparently they started on the training section, needless to say they made absolutely no progress and after about 5 sessions on this section managment said basically, either agree to everything we propose by 1800 or the talks are over. What did they propose you may ask? Was it somewhere in between the cheapest alternative proposed by managment and the improvements over the current contract? No!, with arms folded, managment demanded that we roll back every protection offered by our current contract(believe me there aren't many) and basically bend over. Our guys claim publicly to be bewildered by this episode, but its understandable based on our current management.

They wanted to waste three months of our time, get the attention of our negotiators and union officers, get them in a conference room with suits and ties, lean across the table, and say F U! We hear the message loud and clear and you will never find a more unified and a more militant pilot group.

Airline negotiations at their worst! Yep, expect a long dirty three years and a long strike!! Industry leading contract or shut the doors!!!

 

[Lequip]

Guys,

I've been at Pinnacle for too long now and I've flown with plenty of Gulfstream pilots. I haven't had any problems, most people welcome them as people and pilots. There are issues that come up because of extreme low time, but overall the program seems to work OK for us. Why do we have to hire so many low time guys though? There is some sort of agreement obviously and kickbacks notwithstanding, Pinnacle is simply the worst regional airline to work for.

Sure Mesa makes less and Mesaba and others don't have the growth, but if you look at the way we are treated by managment and overall quality of life at PCL, we are the worst. Most guys who have other airline experience or who are still early in their career do not stay long at PCL. They do not tolerate it at all. They don't want to have to worry about being fired for getting sick and worse.

In fact Pinnacle is hiring at this time, but you will certainly not be upgrading any time soon, and if you did get one of these proposed new hire captain slots you would have to realize that its not because things are moving fast. Its because we have HUNDREDs of First Officers who have the seniority but not the time to upgrade (3000 hours with 500 in type at the company or 3500)you would not get off reserve for at least five years. Pinnacle already has over 100 jets and we are only getting 129. Yes there are options but if you know what just happened with negotiations and you realize that we are six months from officially starting our 'bargaining process' you will realize that those options are simply carrots for them to hold in front of us. Our pilot group is unified and furious at management for the way we are treated and we will get an industry leading contract after our strike (which is probably 3 and a half years away) Until then you have to realize that managment will attack and abuse its pilot group as has never been attempted before in this industry.

Expect ten days off for the next five years and reserve, you will fly every day but not get many hours. Also expect very soon that managment will start to build schedules that stagger days off so you never have more than 2 days off in a row. Don't get me wrong, it has always been like this to some extent but they will start to do this intentionally, as they have at times in the past.

Do you have an interview here? Sure show up and get the experience, but for god sakes unless you are really in dire straits you would be doing yourself and your family a hugh favor by turning the job down. If you do take the job expect the worst training and the highest failure rate in the industry (some of this is due to low time). You are risking throwing away your entire career for one crappy job. Also realize this isn't just the ramblings of one disgruntled guy, I'm also speaking for many furloughed pilots, experienced guys who have come to Pinnacle after years of experience with other regionals and/or majors. I have never talked to anyone who did not agree that we are the worst regional in this industry.

Sure that CRJ is a shiny cool jet, but I hope that is enough for you. Whatever you are looking for, Pinnacle ain't it.

_________________________________________________________________

P.S. If you guys are interested in a contract update: Our managment approached our MEC about 3 months ago and asked us to start negotiations early. They said they were interested in completing the negotiations process at the earliest possible opportunity (for the sake of furthur growth). As you may have heard managment broke off negotiations a few days ago. I have several friends who are in the LEC's and one who was actually there. Apparently they started on the training section, needless to say they made absolutely no progress and after about 5 sessions on this section managment said basically, either agree to everything we propose by 1800 or the talks are over. What did they propose you may ask? Was it somewhere in between the cheapest alternative proposed by managment and the improvements over the current contract? No!, with arms folded, managment demanded that we roll back every protection offered by our current contract(believe me there aren't many) and basically bend over. Our guys claim publicly to be bewildered by this episode, but its understandable based on our current management.

They wanted to waste three months of our time, get the attention of our negotiators and union officers, get them in a conference room with suits and ties, lean across the table, and say F U! We hear the message loud and clear and you will never find a more unified and a more militant pilot group.

Airline negotiations at their worst! Yep, expect a long dirty three years and a long strike!! Industry leading contract or shut the doors!!!

Now there is a good one! The vast majority of pilots at Pinnacle are gulfstream pukes or former PFTers. Close the door my a$$, you guys will sell out in a heartbeat. PA-LEEZ!!!

 

[Justino]

Man will SOME of you people just grow up, you are acting like a bunch of immature complainers who are pissed that people did not follow in "your allmighty" footsteps. NEWS flash to complainers----PFT, GULFSTREAM ETC... PEOPLE MAKE CHOICES AND JUST BECAUSE THEY DID NOT EARN THEIR FLIGHT TIME THE WAY YOU DID DOES NOT MEAN THEY are BAD. If anything those that critize others are they themselves ignorant and self serving.

complainers out their reagrding PFT, Riddle and ALL the other schools ,,,blah blah blah.....big deal, get over it and be greatful for what you have, not how others got what they have. A major turnoff to aviation is listening to guys and gals cry about PFT and flying college and waa waa waaa....


Sell out this and that... and your not good enough... and you make more money then me... and I work harder then you. For F sakes man Half the posts on this site are people just crying about $ and other airlines. YOU DONT LIKE YOUR $$$ OR YOUR JOB GO WORK SOMEWHERE ELSE... TO GOOD FOR THAT.... GO COLLECT UNEMPLOYMENT.... Or STILL TO GOOD PAL? DEAL WITH IT....

YOUR JOB IS TO FLY AND IF YOU DONT LIKE TO FLY WITH OTHER PEOPLE CAUSE THEY DID NOT COLLECT 5 INCHES OF ICE AT 3AM OR THEY PFT TO GET EXPERIENCE OR THEY WENT TO A GREAT COLLEGE FOR FLYING AND YOU DID NOT DUE TO CHANCE OR $ OR CHOICE THAT DOES NOT GIVE ANYONE THE RIGHT TO DEMOTE OTHER PEOPLE FOR THEIR CHOICES. IF YOU THINK YOU SHOULD OR THAT YOU ARE RIGHT I FEEL SORRY FOR YOU CAUSE GUESS WHAT, YOUR A VERY VERY SMALL MAJORITY AND YES THATS ENOUGH TO TARNISH THE REST OF US PILOTS WHO LOVE OUR JOBS AND DONT MIND FLYING WITH DIFFERENT PEOPLE FROM DIFFERENT FLYING BACKGROUNDS.

with that all said I am sure some of you will reply and complain and say I dont know what I talking about since I dont have as much time as you or that I suck and on and on and on. It will be no surprise as such replys only come from a minority and could never attempt to change my understanding of flying and the people who love doing it.

Fly safe,
Justino.

 

[MarineGrunt]

Does Pinnacle happen to have a domicile in SLC?

 

[Justino]

Thanks

Good luck at SUP !!!! Thanks for the service

 

[dondk]

This is a pitiful thread...

Pinnacle is a regioinal, just like the other dozen or more out there. Once people realize we are a regional then the whole QOL, pay, and schedules are understandable.

PFT.. this is BS too.. Name the top regionals or better yet the largest regionals and they were ALL PFT at one time or another. Most of them changed thier ways in the late 90's. Many of the top or larger regionals have taken pilot's from programs akin to GIA, but they were called "bridge programs" or something else. Some other regionals still "pref" hire from some college's, but that is okay for some.

Being at PCL for better than 3 years now.. most and I mean 98% of the GIA pilot's are good pilots. The 2% are the problem children ALL airlines have regardless if they PFT'd or flight instructed to a job. 98% of the Captains have no problems with GIA folks either, the 2% falls into the same problem Captain category.

As for a GIA dude in the left seat.. close.. I don't think he passed just yet, but he is the first of a handful. The majority of the first wave of GIA people will going to the left seat in the next few months...

We will still grow beyond 129? My money is yes.. remember they (our management) have the carrot's and to keep the lower 1/2 of the seniority list happy I'd guess more jet's. Heck we are making too much money, does anyone think that PCL management wants to give that up anytime soon?

If they can keep us at our lousy contract longer and build our fleet they just keep making more money, why not do that?

As for failure rates.. those who have been here long enough have seen the failure rates for FO's go from 75% down to 15%. Captains were 10% and now lingers in the 40% range. When the failure rates go up the FSDO makes daily "raids" in MEM. Ask how many FAA dudes are crawling around MEM these days? This is beacuse we are growing and the mom and pop operation in MEM still stays the same. Management thinks they still have a 250 pilot operation and everyone should be happy they are employed.


As for working here.. remember my opening statement's.. we are a regional, if that is what or who you want to work for.. then you could do better and you could do worse than Pinncale. Those hired today will hold 14 or better off as a FO. Those looking for Captain (new hire OR quick upgrade) will see no more than 10 days off and reserve for the next 5 years. REGARDLESS if we get more jet's or not..

 

[another cfii]

It always come down to this. Every regional airlines have their good and bad sides, some has more good than bad sides, and every regional airlines have their dark history, including PCL.

I was fortunate enough to join PCL while in the beginning of the current bloom, and although it's my first 121 job, i don't take things for granted. I know there're lots of qualified pilots out there that would do my job for less money. With that said, I am proud to support our MEC in the ongoing negotiation. Most newbie like me are not familiar with contract negotiation, and our MEC does spend the time trying to communicate with all pilots with emails, personal contacts, phone calls.

Just a few days ago, our pilot group received news that prelim negotiation broke off, and with a logistical move by our CEO, most of us are pretty pissed and our group has shown what it takes to be unified. Now, we need to support more than each other. I am asking all regional pilots, pilot to pilot, it is now time to help support us with our fight. We need this in order to fight for a better future for all of us.

 

[xrayojilp1]

I would bet serious money that we won't get more jets, in fact I'm sure that we will lose some. The games have indeed begun. You can look forward to being whipsawed for the next 3-4 years. Northwest would have to be completely out of their minds to give us more airplanes. There is just too much uncertainty. The last of the 129 will come right at the beginning of official contract negotiations, this is not coincidence. Of course our managment will act like any other regional and will not be trying to bargain in good faith, but . . I'm sure what Northwest is planning is to start giving crj's to other operators that already have them (ie not Mesaba), can you think of a better way to harm unity and morale during negotiations? They will say, see those pretty crj's over there in Northwest paint, those are being flown by Mesa. We didn't get them because you guys won't sell out. Hell our own CEO even admitted in the past he does not think we will grow any furthur. Its just too much of a risk to have one hugh regional when you can have 3 or more and whipsaw them against each other. I would even expect managment to take away a significant number of 'our' 129. After all we don't own them, they belong to Northwest. I figure an optimal size airline that Northwest would go for is around 100 airplanes, this is in line with what we were always told by our evil managment. I for one believe this for a change. All the planes we are getting now past 100 are just a bargaining tool and they WILL be taken away. People that we are hiring now are furlough fodder, BELIEVE IT. They are not hiring you as a pilot they are hiring you so that they can furlough you and say, see look at this poor guy on furlough, he's there because you won't sell out.

I certainly hope that we do not cave in, yes there are some PFT'er and GIA guys here, and I don't see what that has to do with voting on a contract, but whatever dude. As for you dondk, you say PCL is like any other regional? Dude what are you smoking and how can I get some? Be seeing U.

 

[fly4ever]

quote from dondk:


"We will still grow beyond 129? My money is yes.. remember they (our management) have the carrot's and to keep the lower 1/2 of the seniority list happy I'd guess more jet's. Heck we are making too much money, does anyone think that PCL management wants to give that up anytime soon?"

DREAM ON! Your management has NO carrots. Only NWA has the carrots and tells their regional feeders how and when to dangle them. The NWA process of negotiations is so cut and dry you can predict every move that management makes with near 100% accuracy. At least PinchNickel is up to speed. It's going to be a long haul for your group just like it was for XJ and you can bet your management has been saving up that "revenue" for the more lean years ahead. Your fight hasn't even started yet.

Best of luck

 

[norskman2]

Does Pinnacle happen to have a domicile in SLC?

Are you thinking Skywest maybe? PCL bases are MSP, DTW, MEM.