Our "Team" leader out to lunch

[GerryG]

Carma

So this clown boy, B19 wants us to believe management has it all planned out? I wonder, considering MS is advised by a team of lawyers and advisers, if he wanted to draw the union into a unfavorable position, why would they send the main man down for a humiliating rebuke from the pilot group? Why wouldn't they send one of his lackeys instead, if what B19 suggests is true?

I think the answer stems from MS's personal arrogance. He thought he was going to show the union and he probably ignored the advice of his advisors. It didn't work out for him and he ended up with egg on his face.

Hubris is not that complicated, as it is always stems from arrogance. Carma rules here at Flight Options.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

I think the answer stems from MS's personal arrogance. He thought he was going to show the union and he probably ignored the advice of his advisors. It didn't work out for him and he ended up with egg on his face.

Hubris is not that complicated, as it is always stems from arrogance. Carma rules here at Flight Options.

B-19 and his F & Harrison counterparts have only the worst karma has to offer.

Those of us determined to stay until the end and love our jobs again will have the last laugh when the real execs in charge (HIG) see what the egos of the past regime have cost this company in lost revenue, employee morale, and "owners" who can't get out fast enough.

F&H are even going after the majors and have people stationed all over, so we will be ending up with more of the same if we go elsewhere. We need to bring this company back to the morale of the early days, but adding the pay and contract that was lacking.

It is a lot cheaper for HIG to mirror the setup at netjets than let the company totally fold and keep paying morons to lead it there.

 

[B19 Flyer]

B-19 and his F & Harrison counterparts have only the worst karma has to offer.

Those of us determined to stay until the end and love our jobs again will have the last laugh (Just like all the Eastern guys did)when the real execs in charge (HIG) see what the egos of the past regime have cost this company in lost revenue, employee morale, and "owners" who can't get out fast enough.

When owners begin to bail, the difference will be union intervention. They can get the same or better service by one of the other non-union fractionals without the fear of union involvement.

F&H are even going after the majors and have people stationed all over, so we will be ending up with more of the same if we go elsewhere. We need to bring this company back to the morale of the early days,

Get rid of the union and the morale will return almost overnight. The poor morale is being created by the union mob, not the non-union rank and file employees.

but adding the pay and contract that was lacking.

It is a lot cheaper for HIG to mirror the setup at netjets than let the company totally fold and keep paying morons to lead it there.

You mean paying unions to lead it there?

http://airlinesafety.com/Unions/UnionVictoryAtEastern.htm

To quote the cartoon, "We sure stuck it to Lorenzo, huh?" As they are standing in the unemployment line.

 

[B19 Flyer]

So this clown boy, B19 wants us to believe management has it all planned out? I wonder, considering MS is advised by a team of lawyers and advisers, if he wanted to draw the union into a unfavorable position, why would they send the main man down for a humiliating rebuke from the pilot group? Why wouldn't they send one of his lackeys instead, if what B19 suggests is true?

I think the answer stems from MS's personal arrogance. He thought he was going to show the union and he probably ignored the advice of his advisors. It didn't work out for him and he ended up with egg on his face.

Hubris is not that complicated, as it is always stems from arrogance. Carma rules here at Flight Options.

You really don't understand the road shows, do you? Road shows are part of negotiations and posturing. There are NO managers that ever expect pilots to show up and listen. It's a necessary evil.

An empty room is not a stand of defiance. An unexpected stand of defiance is when the room is full and real questions are asked. I've never seen it, because union leadership supports the boycott. For one, they support the boycott because it artificially "rally's the troops". But, on the other hand, if management tells the truth about what is happening with negotiations, it makes the union look stupid.

You really don't know what happens in negotiations, do you? You don't understand about the "15 minute" union caucus that lasts for 5 hours about 3 words in a paragraph. Company negotiators don't use that tactic. The union does. Just another of the unknown items the rank and file union members never hear about.

 

[nomore]

I didn't delete enough

Should we expect more obscure bullsh1t commentary?

I forgot to delete one part of your question Whoosh so let me restate.

Whoosh let me answer for "Not Bob" B-19.

YES!



N

 

[realityman]

Folks, no worries, you ARE doing the right thing. SILENCE will be the only thing they understand.

When you ask questions, you're giving management the go-ahead to speak to you basically one-on-one. This effectively undermines the position of your negotiators, who are the people management SHOULD be speaking to about any issues. The only people that NEED to know management's position on any issue are your negotiators.

Also, by asking questions, you may be inadvertently giving the company information about what you'll accept. That won't put your negotiators in a very good position either. At this point, your negotiators should already know what the pilot group, as a whole, will accept. Let THEM work it out with management.

And finally, much information that is presented by management at these roadshows are either flat out lies, or the truth twisted into a pretzel to suit their needs to manipulate you. Anyone remember the info Netjets' management tried getting us to swallow at our company's roadshows? Rmemeber the comments like "there's simply no more money" and "if you get what you're asking for you'll bankrupt the company"? I wonder how much truth they were presenting to us when almost literally overnight, after the 2005 contract was signed, we were in record profit territory. How could we have gone from "company going bankrupt with this contract" to record profits in a mere matter of several months? And less than two years later the company comes back and is offering MORE money to us. So you decide, were they being honest with us during the road shows?

Roadshows and question-and-answer sessions are nothing more than management fishing expeditions to try and get info from the pilot group that you shouldn't be giving away. You voted in the union. You elected leaders. You have a negotiating team. Those are the ONLY folks FLOPS management should be, or need to be, talking to at this point.

Good luck all of you!!

 

[dash_trash]

You really don't know what happens in negotiations, do you? You don't understand about the "15 minute" union caucus that lasts for 5 hours about 3 words in a paragraph. Company negotiators don't use that tactic. The union does. Just another of the unknown items the rank and file union members never hear about.

That sounds exactly like the tactics mgmt has been using since day one of negotiations. The 1108 has been very diligent in turning around their counters, and the company is the one who will return 3 or 4 lines in response to a multi-page proposal after taking several hours to "craft the language." Check your facts ... it is DEFINATELY mgmt that is dragging along the process.

 

[400pilot]

Not to mention, there is zero fruit in the union prolonging negotiations. If you want to talk dollars, it benefits "the union" to get a contract as fast as possible.

 

[imacdog]

Whatever they're paying B19, it's way too much.

 

[WabiSabi]

Get rid of the union and the morale will return almost overnight. The poor morale is being created by the union mob, not the non-union rank and file employees.

This is abject nonsense. 67% of the pilots voted in the union because morale was at an all time low. It was management's lies and systematic intimidation that lowered morale. The union is the pilot group's only hope to get pay, bennies, QOL, SAFETY, etc. to industry standards as well as a contract that holds an inept management accountable. Only this will raise morale. Again, you know nothing of what is going on @ FLOPS. You simply talk out of your ass and whenever you're asked to address a point regarding your claims about FLOPS, you tuck your tail between your legs and post inapplicable inks.

When owners begin to bail, the difference will be union intervention. They can get the same or better service by one of the other non-union fractionals without the fear of union involvement.

http://airlinesafety.com/Unions/UnionVictoryAtEastern.htm

To quote the cartoon, "We sure stuck it to Lorenzo, huh?" As they are standing in the unemployment line.

With every post of yours, you dig yourself deeper in your cesspool of formulaic anti union drivel. You don't know squat about Fracs not to mention FLOPS, jackass.