NWA wants DOH

[MJ42]

Keep playing that tune! You may even begin to believe it. I am sure the arbitrators would bring you back to reality next month.

Proves my point!!!

 

[Speedbird34]

All I hear from you is "me, me, me, me, me and more ME!!! It's all about ME!" Well, let me inform you, IT'S NOT ALL ABOUT YOU!!!

As long as I can maintain my lifestyle and career expectations with limits I am happy.
What I would hate to see is Northwest guys swooping in and taking positions from us and pushing us into reserve lines etc.
Right now I have enough ER guys junior to me to inform you I will never see a reserve line till I am a Captain or you guys win a seniority grab.

 

[Speedbird34]

Proves my point!!!

And your point is?

 

[MJ42]

As long as I can maintain my lifestyle and career expectations with limits I am happy.
What I would hate to see is Northwest guys swooping in and taking positions from us and pushing us into reserve lines etc.
Right now I have enough ER guys junior to me to inform you I will never see a reserve line till I am a Captain or you guys win a seniority grab.

So said the DAL/NWA pilot pre 9/11.

 

[MJ42]

And your point is?

It's all about you! Your QOL, your position, your aircraft, your career expectations and your EGO! Get over yourself!

 

[propdog]

As long as I can maintain my lifestyle and career expectations with limits I am happy.
What I would hate to see is Northwest guys swooping in and taking positions from us and pushing us into reserve lines etc.
Right now I have enough ER guys junior to me to inform you I will never see a reserve line till I am a Captain or you guys win a seniority grab.

I just can't wait to see you back on reserve..hahaha!!

 

[Speedbird34]

So said the DAL/NWA pilot pre 9/11.

I know you expect us to just rollover and get run over because we are a bunch of dumb Deltoids. It is not going to happen. We have always reached for the middle ground.

You are going to enjoy working for Delta. I already know that we are the nicer company and we are not fanatics about any seat. I do not want a B777 slot, does not suit my lifestyle. That does not mean it is not a highly desired position. Just not my thing.

Most of you are going to be thrilled at your new lifestyle and prospects after this merger even the 10 yr Northwest guy who gets put behind some Delta guy who was employed later than him. DOH means nothing it is all about the lifestyle and career expectations.

 

[MJ42]

I know you expect us to just rollover and get run over because we are a bunch of dumb Deltoids. It is not going to happen. We have always reached for the middle ground.

You are going to enjoy working for Delta. I already know that we are the nicer company and we are not fanatics about any seat. I do not want a B777 slot, does not suit my lifestyle. That does not mean it is not a highly desired position. Just not my thing.

Most of you are going to be thrilled at your new lifestyle and prospects after this merger even the 10 yr Northwest guy who gets put behind some Delta guy who was employed later than him. DOH means nothing it is all about the lifestyle and career expectations.

I'm looking forward to working at the new DAL as are a majority of NWA pilots. But, don't put words into my mouth, I never said anything about DAL pilots rolling over. I WANT FAIR FOR BOTH SIDES! Not what's fair for Speedbird just so he can be happy. You still don't get it, IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU, IT'S ABOUT ALL OF US!

 

[Speedbird34]

I just can't wait to see you back on reserve..hahaha!!

It is unlikely to happen! But reserve here is not that bad. Lots of senior guys bid reserve lines. It can be quite profitable.

Gentlemen and Ladies welcome to the party! let us all work togather to make it better and regain some of our lifestyle setbacks. I do not envy you your pay raises. I just feel we should have gotten some also which would have made yours even bigger. Maybe in the future.

I look forward to the smoke clearing on the 2oth Nov and I would love to see that we at least have a fair list.

 

[Speedbird34]

I'm looking forward to working at the new DAL as are a majority of NWA pilots. But, don't put words into my mouth, I never said anything about DAL pilots rolling over. I WANT FAIR FOR BOTH SIDES! Not what's fair for Speedbird just so he can be happy. You still don't get it, IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU, IT'S ABOUT ALL OF US!

I do get it. I am just letting you know how we see it from the Delta rank and file.

We are slightly disappointed that you guys are pushing the DOH angle. It is not cool but soon it will be all Delta pilots and we just approach things a little bit differently.

But good thing it is out of our hands. I am just about to go suck on a beer at some faraway destination. As I check out the babes at the pool I promise you I will not be thinking about you.

It is not the Delta way. I am really looking forward to the joy on your face when it dawns on you that this merger was a great deal for you guys.
That is going to be my only satisfaction your happiness. So I care about the group! We at Delta care about the group. My pay check and lifestyle presently are endangered. You lucky you are about to get a really noticeable pay bump.

 

[MJ42]

I do get it. I am just letting you know how we see it from the Delta rank and file.

We are slightly disappointed that you guys are pushing the DOH angle. It is not cool but soon it will be all Delta pilots and we just approach things a little bit differently.As are we, in your position. A mid position between both proposals would be acceptable.

But good thing it is out of our hands. I am just about to go suck on a beer at some faraway destination. As I check out the babes at the pool I promise you I will not be thinking about you.I'm happy to hear your focused on other things.

It is not the Delta way. I am really looking forward to the joy on your face when it dawns on you that this merger was a great deal for you guys.
That is going to be my only satisfaction your happiness. So I care about the group! We at Delta care about the group. My pay check and lifestyle presently are endangered. You lucky you are about to get a really noticeable pay bump.After health insurance premiums and 70hr/month guarantee it's not that noticeable, but who's complaining???

Thanks for saving us, you have my deepest gratitude... . The last few sentences should read: "ME, ME, ME AND MORE ME. THE EARTH REVOLVES AROUND ME, I LOVE MYSELF!"

Like I said, most of us realize the strength of this combination and are looking forward to being the dominant global airline.

 

[Speedbird34]

Thanks for saving us, you have my deepest gratitude... . The last few sentences should read: "ME, ME, ME AND MORE ME. THE EARTH REVOLVES AROUND ME, I LOVE MYSELF!"

Like I said, most of us realize the strength of this combination and are looking forward to being the dominant global airline.

You are welcome!! And if you really believe all that mumbo jumbo about 70 hrs and medical eliminating your pay increase then you are in for a pleasant surprise.
I believe you know better and all that talk is just more of the same old Northwest seniority grab spin.
Imagine putting pilots from Mesaba on your list. You guys put the R to the word ruthless.

 

[kwick]

DOH means everything.

To think that your time invested is more valuable than your fellow pilot's, working for the same company, is pure arrogance.

Don't take down a good company because of greed. We've seen this happen and it's not pretty.

 

[Speedbird34]

DOH means everything.

To think that your time invested is more valuable than your fellow pilot's, working for the same company, is pure arrogance.

Don't take down a good company because of greed. We've seen this happen and it's not pretty.

DOH withen the same airline. I will never be senior to a Delta pilot hired before me.
During a merger it is a whole different story!

 

[slapstick]

Do all NWA pilots act like the pay raise doesn't mean anything to them?

(enjoying my 99 hour paycheck)...

 

[Superpilot92]

Do all NWA pilots act like the pay raise doesn't mean anything to them?

(enjoying my 99 hour paycheck)...

First off, you didnt give us a pay raise, we as a group signed off on the JCBA thus we gave ourselves a payraise, ALL of us. This Merger between OUR companies are why those increases happened right now. Does the pay raise mean anything to you? What was the point of the comment again?

(note: this is just me giving you a hard time)Congrats on the 99 hour line, thats quite an achievement :beer:

Also the payraise was offset by increased medical costs and lower monthly guarantee. Dont get me wrong there are improvements for ALL of us, DAL included, but do all DAL pilots think pay rates are the end all of a conversation?
All in good discussion right? Cheers :beer:

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Nope you fought hard for it.
Really who cares. None of us are going to get awards for any of it anyway.

 

[slapstick]

First off, you didnt give us a pay raise, we as a group signed off on the JCBA thus we gave ourselves a payraise, ALL of us. This Merger between OUR companies are why those increases happened right now. Does the pay raise mean anything to you? What was the point of the comment again?

(note: this is just me giving you a hard time)Congrats on the 99 hour line, thats quite an achievement :beer:

Also the payraise was offset by increased medical costs and lower monthly guarantee. Dont get me wrong there are improvements for ALL of us, DAL included, but do all DAL pilots think pay rates are the end all of a conversation?
All in good discussion right? Cheers :beer:

No, but it means SOMETHING! Just frustrated by how so many people reckon it down to nothing by bringing up premiums and 70-hr guarantee.

I'm excited about it. As I am the many things you bring to the table.

 

[MJ42]

No, but it means SOMETHING! Just frustrated by how so many people reckon it down to nothing by bringing up premiums and 70-hr guarantee.

I'm excited about it. As I am the many things you bring to the table.

As I stated in my original post, I'm not complaining. But it's not as significant as Speedbird would like to believe. He just uses it as spin for another reason to justify why his quality of life is more important than a NWA pilot.

Speedbird, using your philosophy, I guess you don't agree with DALPA's SLI proposal, huh? Reason being...NWA will have BLOCK HOLDERS in the 319/320 and DC-9 junior to DALs most junior 88 and 737 reserve. Isn't that a "seniority grab" as you stated in earlier posts? Can't wait for your spin on this...

 

[jetflier]

I know you expect us to just rollover and get run over because we are a bunch of dumb Deltoids. It is not going to happen. We have always reached for the middle ground.

You are going to enjoy working for Delta. I already know that we are the nicer company and we are not fanatics about any seat. I do not want a B777 slot, does not suit my lifestyle. That does not mean it is not a highly desired position. Just not my thing.

Most of you are going to be thrilled at your new lifestyle and prospects after this merger even the 10 yr Northwest guy who gets put behind some Delta guy who was employed later than him. DOH means nothing it is all about the lifestyle and career expectations.

Speed,

I am sure that Delta is a great place to work with fantastic opportunities.
Personally, I have always said felt that there was not another airline that I would want to fly for.
Northwest has always provided the best range of flying of any airline, including the freight operation. With lots of seniority movement coming in the near future, I was planning within the next ten years to be left seat on the 747-400.

Most NWA pilots are "very thrilled" with their lifestyle too, like you are and don't want that to change.

 

[hockeypilot44]

The pay raise will be nice, but we lost some good things that were in our contract. No one is really sure how much of a raise it will really equate to. We will see.

 

[Speedbird34]

Speed,

I am sure that Delta is a great place to work with fantastic opportunities.
Personally, I have always said felt that there was not another airline that I would want to fly for.
Northwest has always provided the best range of flying of any airline, including the freight operation. With lots of seniority movement coming in the near future, I was planning within the next ten years to be left seat on the 747-400.

Most NWA pilots are "very thrilled" with their lifestyle too, like you are and don't want that to change.

Hey Northwest pilots are an excellent group and deserve every dime of their lost pay they get back.
Hoping we make this merger work and also hoping the arbitrators do not sell us poor Delta under rewarded and loyal company pilots down the river.
Hoping to see an improvement to my lifestyle from the merger that I can put a finger on. I am not interested in "the merger is why you still have your job" That is too abstract and I do not believe that the merger preserves my job. I strongly believe it threatens my job.
So maybe the flying will get better or the schedule or my benefits. It feels like everything stayed the same and we gave up our right to get a worthwhile payraise based on the high price of crude. Well now crude is going for less than $70 a barrel.
Cheers guys you are an excellent group. We shall all be best of freinds soon.

REALLY GUYS I WISH US ALL NORTHWEST AND DELTA THE VERY BEST!!!!!!!!

 

[Griswold]

The pay raise will be nice, but we lost some good things that were in our contract. No one is really sure how much of a raise it will really equate to. We will see.

You will be so giddy and happy, and trust me you got better contract and work rules too. Just wait until it all kicks in, you will see.

But hey, we will see.

We will see us DAL pilots take a pay cut to fund a frozen pension.

 

[MJ42]

Hey Northwest pilots are an excellent group and deserve every dime of their lost pay they get back.
Hoping we make this merger work and also hoping the arbitrators do not sell us poor Delta under rewarded and loyal company pilots down the river.
Hoping to see an improvement to my lifestyle from the merger that I can put a finger on. I am not interested in "the merger is why you still have your job" That is too abstract and I do not believe that the merger preserves my job. I strongly believe it threatens my job.
So maybe the flying will get better or the schedule or my benefits. It feels like everything stayed the same and we gave up our right to get a worthwhile payraise based on the high price of crude. Well now crude is going for less than $70 a barrel.
Cheers guys you are an excellent group. We shall all be best of freinds soon.

I'm positive we will all be friends, but I'm trying to figure out why all your posts are so selfish. It's not about you or your lifestyle, it's about a group as a whole.

There are so many "what if" possibilities, but...what if a lot of your precious 767 fly gets move to MSP or DTW which causes you to go back on reserve in NYC? Who will you be mad at then? NWA pilots? DAL management? After all, you're entitled to a certain QOL as well as to be a line holder until you upgrade, right?

I'm done with my rant now, I really am looking forward to everything WE have to offer as well as the improvements WE have all gained.

 

[jetflier]

Hey Northwest pilots are an excellent group and deserve every dime of their lost pay they get back.
Hoping we make this merger work and also hoping the arbitrators do not sell us poor Delta under rewarded and loyal company pilots down the river.
Hoping to see an improvement to my lifestyle from the merger that I can put a finger on. I am not interested in "the merger is why you still have your job" That is too abstract and I do not believe that the merger preserves my job. I strongly believe it threatens my job.
So maybe the flying will get better or the schedule or my benefits. It feels like everything stayed the same and we gave up our right to get a worthwhile payraise based on the high price of crude. Well now crude is going for less than $70 a barrel.
Cheers guys you are an excellent group. We shall all be best of freinds soon.

REALLY GUYS I WISH US ALL NORTHWEST AND DELTA THE VERY BEST!!!!!!!!

Speed,

Nobody has said it any better, CHEERS!!

 

[General Lee]

As I stated in my original post, I'm not complaining. But it's not as significant as Speedbird would like to believe. He just uses it as spin for another reason to justify why his quality of life is more important than a NWA pilot.

Speedbird, using your philosophy, I guess you don't agree with DALPA's SLI proposal, huh? Reason being...NWA will have BLOCK HOLDERS in the 319/320 and DC-9 junior to DALs most junior 88 and 737 reserve. Isn't that a "seniority grab" as you stated in earlier posts? Can't wait for your spin on this...

We have line holders in some bases that are more junior, with senior people doing reserve--like in SLC. SLC is a fairly senior base because people like living in Park City. They are willing to stay there on reserve rather than move to ATL and get a line. We also have more widebodies, which allows more people to fly them, even junior people. The key here is that some of your planes are going away, and our pilots shouldn't have to take a hit for that. It is KNOWN that some of your planes are going away. Richard Anderson is in DC today, and I wonder if he will be testifying to some of those future plans? Is it a seniority grab when you aren't bringing as many planes to the table or will lose some just after the DCC? I don't think so. It is giving career expectations early. Also, as some people have already stated on this board already, maybe the bottom 400 on the proposed list from Dalpa can't hold a widebody and it's associated pay increase, and that keeps them from that "windfall?"


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Also do not forget that a 73N pilot that does the L.A. or Caribbean flts makes about as much as a 7ER pilot. The override is the same either way. Now why would you fly an ER when you can fly on your body clock in a smaller airplane.

 

[RedRum]

What about the scope we lost

We have line holders in some bases that are more junior, with senior people doing reserve--like in SLC. SLC is a fairly senior base because people like living in Park City. They are willing to stay there on reserve rather than move to ATL and get a line. We also have more widebodies, which allows more people to fly them, even junior people. The key here is that some of your planes are going away, and our pilots shouldn't have to take a hit for that. It is KNOWN that some of your planes are going away. Richard Anderson is in DC today, and I wonder if he will be testifying to some of those future plans? Is it a seniority grab when you aren't bringing as many planes to the table or will lose some just after the DCC? I don't think so. It is giving career expectations early. Also, as some people have already stated on this board already, maybe the bottom 400 on the proposed list from Dalpa can't hold a widebody and it's associated pay increase, and that keeps them from that "windfall?"


Bye Bye---General Lee

General,

I can understand the "but NWA planes are going away argument" if you are a Delta pilot. But here are the facts.

We lost a considerable amount of scope during the beating we took during the 1113 Bankruptcy Process. NWA ALPA proposed "NewCo" and you see how far that went. Your arbitration team clearly outlines the whole process throughout their opening brief to the arbitrators in LA.

We have seen a 8.5 to 9-5% pulldown in mainline flying with a 50 to 55% uptick in DCI Regional flying. So can you really blame NWA pilots for the DC9 going away? I just don't think this is a valid argument. We were victim to the 1113 process. If we hadn't tried to freeze the DB plan (of which I an countless others got nothing, maybe the company would have responded to the NewCo proposal put forth by NWA ALPA.) But the pension issue was a non-starter and a lot of the junior guys (that didn't get a vote mind you) are the ones who will pay for this "but NWA is getting rid of DC9s" argument. Does that seem fair to you?

Hey, I am first to admit that life isn't fair sometimes. Sometimes your the windshield sometimes your the bug, right? I just think it would be better off if we lessen the impact to the junior NWA guys that have taken a bigger bite out of that mud sandwich than the junior Delta pilots. Does this make sense?

Regardless, I am looking forward to working with the new Delta. Can't wait for RA to be in charge. Just that fact alone will improve morale.

Cheers

 

[General Lee]

As I stated in my original post, I'm not complaining. But it's not as significant as Speedbird would like to believe. He just uses it as spin for another reason to justify why his quality of life is more important than a NWA pilot.

Speedbird, using your philosophy, I guess you don't agree with DALPA's SLI proposal, huh? Reason being...NWA will have BLOCK HOLDERS in the 319/320 and DC-9 junior to DALs most junior 88 and 737 reserve. Isn't that a "seniority grab" as you stated in earlier posts? Can't wait for your spin on this...

Also, in your above quote, you said NWA will have block holders JUNIOR to some DL reserves. Well, isn't that a good thing pay wise? You guys seem upset about the drop in hours for reserve guarantee---from 75 hours to 70 hours at Delta. Well, sounds like some junior NWA people won't have to take that "pay cut" down to 70 hours a month, and instead ENJOY the pay raise per hour while flying more than 70 hours.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

General,

I can understand the "but NWA planes are going away argument" if you are a Delta pilot. But here are the facts.

We lost a considerable amount of scope during the beating we took during the 1113 Bankruptcy Process. NWA ALPA proposed "NewCo" and you see how far that went. Your arbitration team clearly outlines the whole process throughout their opening brief to the arbitrators in LA.

We have seen a 8.5 to 9-5% pulldown in mainline flying with a 50 to 55% uptick in DCI Regional flying. So can you really blame NWA pilots for the DC9 going away? I just don't think this is a valid argument. We were victim to the 1113 process. If we hadn't tried to freeze the DB plan (of which I an countless others got nothing, maybe the company would have responded to the NewCo proposal put forth by NWA ALPA.) But the pension issue was a non-starter and a lot of the junior guys (that didn't get a vote mind you) are the ones who will pay for this "but NWA is getting rid of DC9s" argument. Does that seem fair to you?

Hey, I am first to admit that life isn't fair sometimes. Sometimes your the windshield sometimes your the bug, right? I just think it would be better off if we lessen the impact to the junior NWA guys that have taken a bigger bite out of that mud sandwich than the junior Delta pilots. Does this make sense?

Regardless, I am looking forward to working with the new Delta. Can't wait for RA to be in charge. Just that fact alone will improve morale.

Cheers

I am looking forward to the "end result" too. It will be nice to have this all behind us. Remember when we lost 2000 Captains to retirement? We also lost a huge amount of planes too, and that was AFTER the 9-11 parkings of 727s, L1011, etc. Right after BK we lost MD11s, 767-200s, and a lot of 737s (-200s and -300s). We have shrunk in size too, and those retirements didn't really help any of us out (except keep some from furlough) thanks to the mainline planes going away. I know you lost Dc10s too recently, but we lost A LOT of our mainline narrowbodies (those 737s were a large domestic category)---and you still have your DC9s---and they will be leaving now AFTER we get together. We already trimmed our narrowbody fleet, and you are starting in earnest NOW. Add to that the 747-200 cargo planes that are leaving sooner than later, and the 10 757s you just lost to go to Fedex. The END RESULT should be reflected in the SLI.

Bye Bye--General Lee