NW scabs

[KigAir]

On AMFA's strike update site:

http://www.amfa5.org/strikeupdates.shtml

There's a link for unemployment benefits. These folks can get unemployment checks for going on strike?

 

[Deli Guy]

I just finished day number 2 with the scabs. The Captain I am with is a 9 year EAL guy. We pretty much give them the cold shoulder. One guy was trying to sprinkle a little personality around so I farted on him. Just kidding--we blew him off and so did the FA's. Hey all, again I apologize for the rude post I had earlier. There were a couple posts asking about what would happen if the scabs were not there to do the maintenace and what if the guy I beefed on did not make the airplanes work and would I get a paycheck?blah blah blah. My feeling is that if these scabs did not work the airplanes, then AMFA would prevail and that would make me very happy. I would like their plan to work. I would like very much for the flying to slow to a point that management comes back to AMFA with an offer. No I would not get a paycheck and that would be fine with me because it would mean that at least AMFA'S plan had some teeth in it. I just do not think it will happen.

Hey Redmeat, my take on the PFAA situation is that management is bluffing by training replacement FA's. The sheer numbers are overwhelming and I do not think the PFAA is fooled. They are scared, but not fooled.

Hey PW 4000,
I did not get the whole post, but I do support my union. I have gone to bat for ALPA here pretty exhaustively. I agree that given the right conditions, we are replaceable. That has been proved by Pinnacle and Mesaba. I do not say that bitterly. It is just a fact.

 

[suen1843]

Looks like a bunch of old fat bald Walmart oil-change rejects to me.

I really see no difference in the looks of this group from the looks of the previous group now walking in circles.

 

[DHPFLYN]

Time to dump ALPA


GO TEAMSTERS alteast they stick together and have some balls .

I wish you all the best NWA Mechanics !!!!!

 

[pilotyip]

yea Teamsters, that will solve all the problems in the world. How many organizations have decertified the Teamsters? Do a search on Teamsters.

 

[psycho]

So YOU would allow the union to sign an agreement that furloughs half its dues-paying employees and cuts pay for the rest to less than it costs to support their families? That's not a union screwing up, it's a union sticking to the basic needs of its dues-paying members.


But that's EXACTLY what NWA has done... picked off a well-organized, well-run union with to-the-last-day commitment of its members. NWA has done this in the first environment in history that it was possible with waning union support in the nation, outsourcing at its highest level in history, and fear causing the other unions to retract into their self-deluding shells and ignore the BLATANT FACT that THEIR UNION IS NEXT.

Should cleaners make $40,000 a year? Probably not. Should mechanics make $60,000 a year? Absolutely. True, AMFA's original proposal was a pay raise, but the last-ditch effort from AMFA WAS A CONCESSIONARY AGREEMENT! But Northwest made unreasonable demands, knowing the union wouldn't sign, and therefore walked AMFA right into a carefully-orchestrated path towards union breakup, bankruptcy, and pension cutting... for ALL its employees... but I've been saying NWA was going to do this for about 2 years now.

Lear,

Even though I called you names and then you called me names, gotta agree 98% with this one. Still think that 40k is a barely liveable wage in today's economy though.

 

[KigAir]

Lear,

Even though I called you names and then you called me names, gotta agree 98% with this one. Still think that 40k is a barely liveable wage in today's economy though.

Are the cleaners complaining about making 40k? SWA Aircraft Appearance Technicians are making $10.29/hr:

http://www.southwest.com/careers/mxairclean.html

 

[canyonblue]

SWA Aircraft Appearance Technicians are making $10.29/hr:

That would be first year pay at SWA, and I don't think there are any NWA cleaners on 1st year pay. After 5 years at SWA the pay is currently $16.13/hr, and at 40 hours a week that would be $33,550 with no other over rides. So 40k could be in the ballpark, but like NWA they are covered by AMFA.

 

[pw4000]

Some people are consumed what a cleaner's makes then be a cleaner. quit crying about it. Sure is a lot of cry babies here

 

[HoursHore]

Having operated in and out of a NWA Hub, This strike is transparent to the operations of the Airline. Looking at the monitors today, NO canceled flights. Either the Union grossly overestimated thier position, or The Company played thier hand very well. The ease of which Scabs were trained and the even easier path they are allowed to work speaks loudly. This is a different playing field, and with a depressed Airline Economy with the Stigma of scabbing seemingly removed, its going to be hard for traditional means to get the job done.

However, I think Unions, like any other Business, must adapt. A unified voice for an employee group is not out moded, it must become that much more shrewd. Maybe the strike, where you basically give the company the reins, is not as effective in every case. Maybe keeping a hold of the reins, but engaging and demonstrating the influence of the employee group over Day to Day operations would be more effective. Whether it be a day of Normal ops, than a day of Fly the Contract type thing, or refusing to fly extra, pick up overtime, live with that gripe one more leg type thing, etc.

fines or no pay during a Strike? Seems a wash at this point.

Just some sleep deprived ramblings. Worth what you paid for it.

 

[Redmeat]

Maybe keeping a hold of the reins, but engaging and demonstrating the influence of the employee group over Day to Day operations would be more effective. Whether it be a day of Normal ops, than a day of Fly the Contract type thing, or refusing to fly extra, pick up overtime, live with that gripe one more leg type thing, etc.

HoursHore, come on! Flying your contract will show Steenland alright. If I'm not mistaken he already showed you what he thinks of your contract with the Champion flight. What are they giving you guys in the Diet Cokes over there! Why is that everyone else on this board realizes that you guys are the real targets in the end except for you guys?

Sorry just realized that you are Fedex, but I think the NW guys need to get a little more motivated than flying their contract. The sad thing is that it is obvious why the NW guys are trying so hard to appease management.

 

[HoursHore]

HoursHore, come on! Flying your contract will show Steenland alright. If I'm not mistaken he already showed you what he thinks of your contract with the Champion flight. What are they giving you guys in the Diet Cokes over there! Why is that everyone else on this board realizes that you guys are the real targets in the end except for you guys?

I Don't fly for NWA.

By flying the contract I mean Groups Fly the Contract and no more. again I was just Brainstorming. I just happen to fly NWA alot and have seen what little impact this strike has had on Ops.

 

[KigAir]

Some people are consumed what a cleaner's makes then be a cleaner. quit crying about it. Sure is a lot of cry babies here

I am not in the aviation business and I am certainly not crying. I am trying to understand where the NW people rank with other airlines. One thing I have learned with the aviation business is that you can't take anything at face value. Example: There's a thread in another forum where pilots were complaining that they were only making $90K a year. One point they made was comparing their salary and responsibilities with other high profile professions such as doctors. I was understanding until I found that they only work 75 hours a month. To me that sounds like part time work when compared to doctors.

Looking at the pay scale for SWA MX, they make less than what the NW people were having theirs reduced to. Given the financial situation at NW, how can the NW people expect to make a wage at or above a level that people at SWA? An airline that is profitable.

 

[Redmeat]

Looking at the pay scale for SWA MX, they make less than what the NW people were having theirs reduced to. Given the financial situation at NW, how can the NW people expect to make a wage at or above a level that people at SWA? An airline that is profitable.

NW AMFA has been reduced from nearly 10,000 mechs to just 4600 since 9/11. Managements proposal called for another 53% reduction in force and the remaining 2600 or so taking a 26% pay cut. I believe AMFA basically thought that they had given their share and then some, and that giving into these demands would be a lost cause for their group.

 

[KigAir]

NW AMFA has been reduced from nearly 10,000 mechs to just 4600 since 9/11. Managements proposal called for another 53% reduction in force and the remaining 2600 or so taking a 26% pay cut. I believe AMFA basically thought that they had given their share and then some, and that giving into these demands would be a lost cause for their group.

So instead of taking a 53% reduction they will settle for a 100% reduction. Where's the logic? The rank and file don't understand that the cash cow days are over. Pay and job reductions are a way of life in Corporate America. I work for a large company, non-union, we are going through cost reductions. These include pay cuts and staff reductions. Do I advocate that every employee walk off the job so the company will go out of business? That's ridiculous.

 

[Redmeat]

So instead of taking a 53% reduction they will settle for a 100% reduction. Where's the logic? The rank and file don't understand that the cash cow days are over. Pay and job reductions are a way of life in Corporate America. I work for a large company, non-union, we are going through cost reductions. These include pay cuts and staff reductions. Do I advocate that every employee walk off the job so the company will go out of business? That's ridiculous.

I think to AMFA going from 10,000 to 2600 in 4 years was a 100% reduction. Or would be shortly thereafter.

 

[KigAir]

I think to AMFA going from 10,000 to 2600 in 4 years was a 100% reduction. Or would be shortly thereafter.

Shortly being the keyword. It can be a crappy world and a person has to be able to look after their own interests at all costs. IMO, having a union membership is too high a cost. Maybe they should talk to the ATC people that Reagan fired.

 

[Redmeat]

Shortly being the keyword. It can be a crappy world and a person has to be able to look after their own interests at all costs. IMO, having a union membership is too high a cost. Maybe they should talk to the ATC people that Reagan fired.

PATCO guys. Yes they too got screwed much the same way AMFA is getting screwed now. They too were replaced with scabs.

 

[KigAir]

www.usaviation.com

He writes as "Keep the odds" on the NWA forum.

He is an interesting fellow. Kinda makes you wonder if his sole purpose is to spread propaganda.

 

[canyonblue]

I am not in the aviation business .........................................

Looking at the pay scale for SWA MX, they make less than what the NW people were having theirs reduced to. Given the financial situation at NW, how can the NW people expect to make a wage at or above a level that people at SWA? An airline that is profitable.

Not in Aviation? Try another board that you may have some insight on. SWA MX is paid better than NWA and the rest of the industry, even BEFORE the strike. Get some facts straight before you post here.