Notes on Atkin's visit to ASA crew lounge...

[OCP]

I wasn't there because I was busy working making record profits for a company that wants me to take a pay cut. And I'd bet there were probably quite a few out there like me.

 

[HoserASA]

oops! did him get hims wittle feewings hurt? awww ,I'm sorry about that. Lighten up pinhead! can't take a joke? You opened the door. I just walked through it. I didn't realize you were such a well school and sophisticated guy. My bad.

No, not at all OhPlease. It takes a lot more than you could ever muster to accomplish that. Never claimed to be well schooled nor sophisticated either. But, I did stay at the Holiday Inn Express last night! I'm done...you can have it.

Hoser
My MEC Speaks For Me!

 

[boxjockey]

OHSKEEZ is the same person who was all too excited at the chance of us losing our flying. He's the type of person who only cares to further his own agenda, regardless of what damage it does to others. You need to go work in the corporate world, im sure you would fit right in with all of the backstabbers....

box

 

[ohplease!]

But, I did stay at the Holiday Inn Express last night! I'm done...you can have it.

Hoser
My MEC Speaks For Me!

now you're getting the hang of it.

 

[ohplease!]

OHSKEEZ is the same person who was all too excited at the chance of us losing our flying. He's the type of person who only cares to further his own agenda, regardless of what damage it does to others. You need to go work in the corporate world, im sure you would fit right in with all of the backstabbers....

box

not excited, realistic. go back and look. I said it wasn't a good thing and I'd hate to be in your shoes but, its whats going to happen. No matter what any of us thinks about it.

 

[Tomct]

:angryfireYeah....well Jerry has NEVER had a pilot group that is PISSED OFF and CAN do something about it! He has been rolling over the skwst pilots FAR to LONG. Hopefully they see through his BS and vote in the UNION!

Record profits and paycuts!!!! Rrrrrriiiiiiiight! Not going to happen JERRY!

 

[jehtplane]

First question was why we don't have a contract yet? He started that answer with "he fired Billable Bill Hires the company lawyer as of today." That he is still committed to getting the contract done as soon as possible and they are working to do things to do that.

Profit sharing was the next topic and why we still havn't gotten much info on how it relates to us. He said that he gave a presentation to Bob and Dave this morning and that it will be offered to the pilots just like every other group.

Biggest subject was the 70 seat paycut. He was upfront and said that it needs to come down to be competitive in bidding for flying with Mesa and CHQ. It doesn't have anything to do with any other carriers than the ones we compete against for flyingfor DAL. It was put out there that what if that is not acceptable to our pilot group what would happen? "ASA would shrink" was his answer.

Someone asked if the 5 70's that went to SKW was because of our cost and he said yes. He also said that he hears terms like whipsaw between ASA and SKW and that is not what he wants. He doesn't want the two pitted against each other and make things worse but those are the facts.

Someone asked about new bases or mini hubs for ASA like SKW has. He said not at this time for the forseeable future. SLC came up again and his answer changed from last and he said SLC base is at risk for ASA but still is dependent on if DAL grows or shrinks SLC.

Someone then asked what the contingency plan was if DAL goes under? He said we would repartner with whoever picks up ATL and do it quicker than you could believe. The 26 gates in ATL are a big plus in that situation. ATL is too big a hub and there will be others to partner with.

A couple guys said they would be happy with SKW contract. Jerry was very intrigued with this and put it back to them that we would tear up our contract and use the SKW contract? I said no, that there are work rules in their ontract that are nice but there are things we have they don't.

Big subject that came up was the pass benefits ordeal. Jerry said that it was done at the end of the deal with DAL for us and that they temporarily agreed that it would be status qou for three yrs or until they worked it out. He said DAL came back in negotiations and basically told him that they owned our seats and they would go to DAL employees first. I cant show you the middle finger he gave DAL but he said that was unacceptable and told them to F*ck off. So they are at a standstill and havn't talked in about 3 mnths.

Jerry was asked about merging the 2 pilot groups and he said he was not opposed to that if it was best for all involved including the company.

A lot was talked about with the lack of trust with managment. He said that needs to be fixed, is trying to do things to facilitate that and wants ASA to be a great place to work.

It was brought up that ASA has become a career airline and that managment has made it known that if you are here longer than 5 yrs you have been here to long. He said that is not what he wants and is no longer the attitude of ASA managment as far as he knows.

My overall impression is that he is good for ASA and he didn't just sit up there and tell us what we wanted to hear. Good or bad he answered all the questions and it is what it is. As for the contract, every time they got rid of Hires we have gotten a contract in a few months. He said the union and managment sent a message to the mediator to get more dates and get the contract done.

Take it for what its worth, if I know most on here you are too far gone with animosity for managment that it wont matter.

I for one am willing to put some trust in him and believe it when I see it.

The writing is on the wall

 

[homerjdispatch]

Did you really need to quote the whole original post for a one line comment?

 

[ASA_Aviator]

I, for one, was impressed with Jerry. He seemed sincere an honest. Sure, I don't much like what he had to say, but at least he was direct. I definately like him better than Brian LaBrecque. That guy just comes across as a slimy, tap dancing scumbag.

I was there for the whole thing, and I was glad to hear that our 50 seat pilots are sticking with the 70 seat pilots, even though the 8% isn't coming from them. The pilot group has to act together. I think ultimately the rate will be cut to some degree, but likely not all of the 8% they are asking for. I'm hopeful that the profit sharing does end up to be worthwhile, and that Jerry is right about it making up some of the difference.

That being said, I don't like the attitude I see on here about "only the MEC speaks for me." I am plenty intelligent, and independent minded enough to speak for myself. If I want to go to a meeting to hear what a CEO has to say, I will do so. If I have questions, I will ask them. The MEC may speak for me in negotiations, but I speak for myself when on the line or in a meeting. I don't, for the life of me, understand people who are willing to give up their voices and defer to someone they don't even know, just because that group was elected into power. Use your brains, and speak up if you have something to say!

 

[Blucher]

No kidding

that makes no sense at all to me.

I would say that's readily apparent to most of us. It seems you could easy walk around just chanting that all day, every day. After all, admission is the first step on the road to recovery. Good luck, Ohplease, we're all pullin' for ya'. And might I also suggest that in the future you work on your airplane models in a well ventilated area, those fumes can really do a number on your cognitive abilities.

-Blucher

 

[Blucher]

I, for one, was impressed with Jerry. He seemed sincere an honest. Sure, I don't much like what he had to say, but at least he was direct. I definately like him better than Brian LaBrecque. That guy just comes across as a slimy, tap dancing scumbag.

Well that's just super! You two will make a fine couple, I'm sure. My garbarge man dumps trash all over my lawn when he picks up the garbage, but he sure is a "straight shooter!" Please wake up people! Please!! This is the same show we've seen time and time again, only the actors have changed! Perhaps we really do need more female pilots, at least women NEVER forget anything!:blush:

I was there for the whole thing, and I was glad to hear that our 50 seat pilots are sticking with the 70 seat pilots, even though the 8% isn't coming from them. The pilot group has to act together. I think ultimately the rate will be cut to some degree, but likely not all of the 8% they are asking for. I'm hopeful that the profit sharing does end up to be worthwhile, and that Jerry is right about it making up some of the difference.

You're really glad our 50 guys are sticking with our 70 guys?!??! Are you serious? That's a bit like saying "I sure am glad that during the Gulf war the Navy didn't start throwing the Marines overboard. Golly, that sure was nice of them!" It's a F&^*ing TEAM sport here people!!!! And in case you're not clear on it the team is ALL pilots on property (hopefully someday to include ALL pilot on any Skywest Inc. property)!!!:beer:

That being said, I don't like the attitude I see on here about "only the MEC speaks for me." I am plenty intelligent, and independent minded enough to speak for myself. If I want to go to a meeting to hear what a CEO has to say, I will do so. If I have questions, I will ask them. The MEC may speak for me in negotiations, but I speak for myself when on the line or in a meeting. I don't, for the life of me, understand people who are willing to give up their voices and defer to someone they don't even know, just because that group was elected into power. Use your brains, and speak up if you have something to say!

I'm really excited that you feel so intelligent. However, you've already convinced yourself in your own mind that we're going to take cut based on.......Jerry being such a sweet and honest guy. WTFO??? You are actually a savy management's wet dream. JA could well be pleasuring himself in his 5 star hotel room right now thinking about your wide-eyed ignorance, and your child like inability to learn from past experience.
As for not knowing your MEC, that's your own darned fault! Go meet them. Send them an email. It's not all that hard. How about joining P2P? That might give you a bit of an edge on figuring out who our guys are. Please, for all our sakes, continue your education to include things that may actually help you in life. Perhaps without having to ingest all that extra protein!:laugh:

-Blucher

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I don't, for the life of me, understand people who are willing to give up their voices and defer to someone they don't even know, just because that group was elected into power. Use your brains, and speak up if you have something to say!

If you don't know or haven't met the members of the MEC, that is your fault. Go talk to them. They are YOUR voice. If you disagree with them, let them know.

I think you miss the point. No one is going to tell you not to go listen to the man speak, but we are more effective when we speak as one. If you think anything you say in one of these fireside chats changes his opinion on anything, you are being a bit naive.

Save your opinion for your reps, your p2ps, and the CNC. They are the ones at the table. Jerry is just there to manage your expectations, spread doom and gloom (ala our cost structure) and then appear to be the messiah when he throws a little bone your way.

They are a one trick pony.

Hold Fast!

 

[ASA_Aviator]

If you don't know or haven't met the members of the MEC, that is your fault. Go talk to them. They are YOUR voice. If you disagree with them, let them know.

I think you miss the point. No one is going to tell you not to go listen to the man speak, but we are more effective when we speak as one. If you think anything you say in one of these fireside chats changes his opinion on anything, you are being a bit naive.

Save your opinion for your reps, your p2ps, and the CNC. They are the ones at the table. Jerry is just there to manage your expectations, spread doom and gloom (ala our cost structure) and then appear to be the messiah when he throws a little bone your way.

They are a one trick pony.

Hold Fast!

I think both of you misunderstand me. I'm supporting the pilot group. I make it no secret that I am anti-union though, and no amount of peer pressure or snide remarks will change that. (On the contrary, it will reinforce it.) It is possible to support each other as a group, and still not buy into the union bull. After all, think about the pay increase we all could have across the board if we ditched the union just in regained union dues... Yes, I am bitter that I have to pay dues for a inherently corrupt and manipulative group. The only reason I joined is so I have a vote. (I'm not going to pay for something that I can't vote in.)

Anyway, time will tell whether this management team is worth trusting. When Jerry asked who he should fire, I wanted to scream Brian LaBrecque, but for some reason the pilots who responded seemed to think he deserves more time... How much time does it take to realize he is a scumbag?

 

[007]

What!!

He didn't dangle the Coex's 69 airplane carrot again!!

 

[D'Angelo]

MEC speaks for you? BS you pay dues you are all logical people you can speak for yourselves!! Perhaps maybe your all that retarded however and you need someone else to speak for you. If thats the case I feel sorry for you. We are all human beings here capable of making our own choices

 

[Bizjet]

I think both of you misunderstand me. I'm supporting the pilot group. I make it no secret that I am anti-union though, and no amount of peer pressure or snide remarks will change that. (On the contrary, it will reinforce it.) It is possible to support each other as a group, and still not buy into the union bull. After all, think about the pay increase we all could have across the board if we ditched the union just in regained union dues... Yes, I am bitter that I have to pay dues for a inherently corrupt and manipulative group. The only reason I joined is so I have a vote. (I'm not going to pay for something that I can't vote in.)

:angryfire So ASA Instigator care to name those that are inherently corrupt and manipulative in the union group. Or are you just a cheap myopic finger pointer who wants to blame those that are trying to get us a descent contract. That is what Agency Shop is for--whiners like you who don't want to pay their way!! You can go to work when the rest of us are walking the line if you are so financially strapped. Maybe they will agree to pay you double time to fly struck work pinhead. You and JoeMercant and his significant other can carpool together. Just think of the money you can save. Maybe you can even go to church for confession and then take a couple of Ten Spots out of the collection plate to help pay for your commute.

 

[D'Angelo]

:angryfire So ASA Instigator care to name those that are inherently corrupt and manipulative in the union group. Or are you just a cheap myopic finger pointer who wants to blame those that are trying to get us a descent contract. That is what Agency Shop is for--whiners like you who don't want to pay their way!! You can go to work when the rest of us are walking the line if you are so financially strapped. Maybe they will agree to pay you double time to fly struck work pinhead. You and JoeMercant and his significant other can carpool together. Just think of the money you can save. Maybe you can even go to church for confession and then take a couple of Ten Spots out of the collection plate to help pay for your commute.

Agency shop is for nazis! Only those who voted in the union should have to pay for it! If that were the case though Dr Phil err I mean Duane wouldnt make his big time salary. Yea the alpa koolaid is much worse than management koolaid! as always the truth lies in the middle

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I make it no secret that I am anti-union though, and no amount of peer pressure or snide remarks will change that. (On the contrary, it will reinforce it.) It is possible to support each other as a group, and still not buy into the union bull. After all, think about the pay increase we all could have across the board if we ditched the union just in regained union dues... Yes, I am bitter that I have to pay dues for a inherently corrupt and manipulative group. The only reason I joined is so I have a vote. (I'm not going to pay for something that I can't vote in.)

Too bad DFR will require that the inherently corrupt and manipulative grroup will have to go to bat for you when you have a medical issue, a family crisis, or a legal representation/certificate action.

Go fight the company, the FAA legal, and FAA medical certification on your own and see how you fare. I'm sure it'll be a hoot.

 

[atrdriver]

After all, think about the pay increase we all could have across the board if we ditched the union just in regained union dues... Yes, I am bitter that I have to pay dues for a inherently corrupt and manipulative group. The only reason I joined is so I have a vote. (I'm not going to pay for something that I can't vote in.)

Oh yeah, that 1.95% Pay increase. Just think of it!!!! After tax maybe 1%. WOW!!!! We'd all be RICH!!!! Maybe you don't believe in the union, maybe you think that they are corrupt. But I bet you'd be the first one running and crying to them if the company ever screwed you, or the FAA ever came after your certificate, or you lost your medical.

 

[atrdriver]

Agency shop is for nazis! Only those who voted in the union should have to pay for it! If that were the case though Dr Phil err I mean Duane wouldnt make his big time salary. Yea the alpa koolaid is much worse than management koolaid! as always the truth lies in the middle

Yeah, that'd work. Then you would sue when you needed medical assistance, or legal assistance, and it was denied to you because you never wanted to pay for yourself.

 

[Blucher]

Agency shop is for nazis! Only those who voted in the union should have to pay for it! If that were the case though Dr Phil err I mean Duane wouldnt make his big time salary. Yea the alpa koolaid is much worse than management koolaid! as always the truth lies in the middle

D'Angelo,

What are you talking about? Your MEC listened to you when you voted to bend over for FB. (By the way, was he gentle? Did he cuddle afterwards?) Why all the negativity? Besides, isn't your company one of the ones represented on DW's 'save the regionals' task force?

-Blucheruke:

 

["GO AROUND"]

Documentation of what ?????? Sober up.

I have heard plenty of mgmt promises over the years. I'll believe it when I see it. I will make one promise to you. If JA comes through and turns this place around I will be the first to admit I was wrong and you were right.

Until then, go have some more company kool aid.

Documentation of our costs for the 70 that they say is too high. I was in the middle of looking for it when I was called in for a nap. I would have liked to have gone in there and had the numbers to back up my question.

As for me being a Kool aid drinker, look at my past posts and you will see I am a bigger skeptic than most. I was just posting what he said, I never said I was right.

Like I said, you remind me of a two year old.

 

["GO AROUND"]

With regard to the first get together in SLC, I just noticed that the argument for the 70 seat paycut has shifted from ASA vs Skywest to ASA vs Mesa and CHQ.

I guess this guy changes his story whenever its convenient !

I know, I'm just throwing a tantrum.

No he didn't change his answer, it was the same as in SLC. It is SKW Inc. vs all the other DCI low cost bidders. It's just obvious to everyone else that SKW was a given cause they are cheaper on the 70 than us. That is the position he put us in when he accepted the DAL agreement we now live under.

Do you need your binky?

 

[Blucher]

Documentation of our costs for the 70 that they say is too high. I was in the middle of looking for it when I was called in for a nap. I would have liked to have gone in there and had the numbers to back up my question.

As for me being a Kool aid drinker, look at my past posts and you will see I am a bigger skeptic than most. I was just posting what he said, I never said I was right.

Like I said, you remind me of a two year old.

Go Around,

The problem is that those numbers are inaccurate. It's a little like trying to figure out who's going to win an election prior to the actual results. Fox will say one thing (beyond the shadow of a doubt) and CNN will say something completely different (again, beyond the shadow of a doubt). Don't forget that the largest part of the 70-seat expense is from IP's that are all getting 90+ hours every month at 70 rate. I'm not saying they don't deserve it, I think they do. I just don't think those numbers should be included, as they are more management than line-pilots. Keep in mind also that JA still owes the Skywest pilots a pay raise that he promised them LONG AGO on the 70. Please, if anyone is going in today to the dog/pony show, please ask him what's going on with the Skywest 70 seat rates!

-Blucher

 

["GO AROUND"]

What!!

He didn't dangle the Coex's 69 airplane carrot again!!

No he dangled it and said that SKW inc. has bids in for both CAL and NWA flying. But our 50 seat rates are competitive with the other bidders and that is what the CAL flying is for. The 70 seat flying for DAL or UAL is what they say we are not cost competitive for, but that is up for debate and negotiations.

 

["GO AROUND"]

Blucher, you guys are preaching to the choir. I agree with all you guys are saying. I will believe it when I see at ASA. I will give Jerry credit for coming in and answering all the questions asked and not dodging or sugar coating anything.

We will see what gets negotiated. In my experience if you want a $10 pay raise you don't ask for $10, you ask for $20 and hopefully you negotiate atleast 10 or more. My hope is if their proposal is 8% they understand the negotiations process and the truth is they need less that might be offset by performance +. But that is another horse.

 

[rjcap]

Documentation of our costs for the 70 that they say is too high. I was in the middle of looking for it when I was called in for a nap. I would have liked to have gone in there and had the numbers to back up my question.

As for me being a Kool aid drinker, look at my past posts and you will see I am a bigger skeptic than most. I was just posting what he said, I never said I was right.

Like I said, you remind me of a two year old.

Since you were called in on a NAP your pretty junior around here. I always love it how you junior guys are such experts on negotiations. You will be the first ones to sell us out.

Regarding the 70 seater, Bulcher responded accurately to that.

 

[79%N1]

Since you keep referencing your 2 year old son. How is the little bstrd. Have you figured out who the father is yet ??

Dude, that was pretty low, and despicable. Not funny at all. If I were him, I'd find you and kick the crap out of you for that statement.

 

[rjcap]

Dude, that was pretty low, and despicable. Not funny at all. If I were him, I'd find you and kick the crap out of you for that statement.

I thought it was pretty funny. But in all fairness I will withdraw it.

 

[Blucher]

Since you keep referencing your 2 year old son. How is the little bstrd. Have you figured out who the father is yet ??

Rjcap,

Glad I was done with my coffee before I read that! Perhaps a bit harsh, but I can certainly appreciate that. You must be a Yankee, our Southern brethren always get upset with our rather cold sense of humor up north. Although if, purely by chance, you are correct, I'm pretty sure he does have the right to alter your anatomy.

79%N1,

I'm fairly certain he was just teasing him. It's really a form of endearment some places. In the northeast if people aren't teasing you, it means they don't like you. Like my father always told me, "only tease people you like otherwise things can get pretty ugly, pretty fast." *Disclaimer* See last sentence written to Rjcap above*

-Blucher:laugh: