NJI and NJA Merger Official

[NJApilot]

I'm sure that our senior guys lament the days when they could call the schedulers and chat, it's a growth and numbers game.

I agree that because of our growth it eventualy became impractical to call our schedulers and inquire about x, y or z. But by limiting pilot contact with the schedulers, it also cut out the A-Team factor that was fairly prevalent 5+ years ago. There were even rumors, at that time, of schedulers being "compensated" for extended days, etc. I'm not sure if any of this was true, but it seemed that way sometimes. And trust me, I'm not saying that the A-Team has disappeared either -- but they have definitely had their legs chopped off at the knees.

A smaller organization like NJI, obviously, has some advantages. I'm not convinced that we could now implement such a thing at NJA, though, given our size. A "culture improvement" is very much needed, however.

 

[Cavpilot]

RTS has a goal to get NJA to fly the Gulfstreams cheaper. Don’t ever believe RTS isn’t doing this for gain. Large corporations lie to their stockholders, employees, management and customers. Don’t ever believe that this is a gift or that you or your union earned it. There is any underlying reason. This is a good deal for RTS, with a deal in-place that will lock everyone up for the next 8 years means that a stable labor force is very attractive to any prospective buyers.

EXACTLY!!! I wish more of my NJA brethren saw it this way. It is amazing to me how in two short years RTS has gone from being the face of pure evil to our drinking buddy. The fact is, he is neither. RTS is a world class businessman. Don't forget it.

 

[RNObased]

We have schedulers with MA's in Aviation Management (of course they are working their way up the ladder)! Our daily contact with the company is completely different than that of the A side operation. No airport standby, no hanging out at the FBO's, no middle man, etc etc.

Beg, to differ with you there Wolfpack, I have seen you guys hanging out in FBOs sitting standby, as much as we do, NO. But it happens.

Hell dude, the CMH schedulers have MA's in BS, does that count?? Looking for those pay scales for you.

I agree with Diesel, that five year equipement locks will keep some people away.

 

[NJApilot]

I can't imagine that a handful of workers could stop the plans of a majority. That doesn't seem fair, but I wouldn't be surprised if a two-thirds majority was required. I'm sure those interested will do the research and follow all of the rules if de-certification of the Teamsters is supported by the NJA pilots. A long period free of labor strife would be good timing for the establishment of an in-house union.

NJW:

I agree with your assessment and sentiment. The IBT would be hard pressed to subvert the will of the majority in this case. The general impression I receive from almost all of the crewmembers on the road (and my own impression) is, "What value-added benefit do we really receive from the IBT anyway?" Other than IBT's (potential) financial resources in the event of a major labor dispute/strike, I can think of no other benefit (ok, we get a magazine too...lol). At least ALPA (no friend of mine, mind you) lobbies on behalf of the pilot profession and spends some of its dues receivable on aviation safety initiatives. IBT does none of this.

Two-thrids majority sounds about right. I do not believe a threshold of 100% would have to met.

Keep in mind, we pay IBT roughly $90,000 per month in dues. That figure left in my mouth (and leaves to this day) a very bad taste....and I can only assume that many others (at least, those "in the know") feel the same.

I believe, on this issue, that the writing is on the wall unless the IBT miraculously steps up and wins us over, with something along the lines of a retirement benefit package or other ($$) incentive.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Can someone please post the pay scales for NJA cross overs in G aircraft after this LOA goes into effect? (if you tell me to hit the search button FlyLow I'm kicking your *ss)

Only because you asked nicely...

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=103916&page=2

Post 18, 19 ad 21.

Since that post, there has been an additional agreement for pay up through year 18 with 4% bumps every year.

Please keep in mind that these are BASE PAY rates that do not reflect OT, EXT DAYS, HOLIDAY PAY, etc.

 

[wolfpackpilot]

Only because you asked nicely...

Thanks Dude!

 

[Diesel]

I can feel the love from here.

 

[Mountain Troll]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mountain Troll
First year Capt. At NJI which is about year number 3 or 4 in service is 110K. NJA year 3 pay for over 40,000lb is 93,732.
The figure you provide for Year 3/CAPT at NJA is correct. As was somewhat alluded to in a subsequent post, assuming that a merger takes place, YR3 Captain on a Gulfstream is not likely. It would take a period of several years for everything to "shake out" in terms of equipment/seat position, relative to overall seniority. After the initial shake out, the Gulfstream awards will go much senior (stating the obvious I know).

Granted, I do not know what the NJI payscales look like....but my guess is that the NJA wages are less than NJI in the earlier years (say YR 1 to YR 5) then cross in later years (say, YR 10+) -- meaning the NJA pay might be higher than NJI in the later years (when, again, most captains will see a Gulfstream award). Just a wild-*ss guess on my part.

Also worth mentioning, the 18-day fixed schedule at NJA pays $114,025 at YR 3 CAPT (for a/c greater than 40,000 LBS). I'm not sure how (or if) this figure compares to a similar reserve schedule at NJI. YEAR 10 CAPT (18-D) pays $145,072. YEAR 17 CAPT (18-D) pays $187,260.


Now all that bieng said, which I agree with, NJApilot, but, NJI flys 7 n 7 only. Sure an extended tour now and then, but it's time and a half for that. Now, there isn't a posted payscale there, but, if you take that 110K to start as a Capt. and add 4% each year, year 8 number would be about $150,543! my point being that when the class 4 evaporated and became >40k lbs NJA is going to be paid less to do the same job. I don't care what side of the fence, it aint right. The next contract needs to be addressed with this subject in my pi$$ed off opinion. Every NJA and NJI pilot need to get closer to a corporate/charter salary level in the G. SO, get in the door, wait a little bit, quietly get the majority numbers up, play nice and then put our foot DOWN and get the numbers up again!

 

[RNObased]

SO, get in the door, wait a little bit, quietly get the majority numbers up, play nice and then put our foot DOWN and get the numbers up again!

Ding, Ding, ding, we have a winner. The those of us that are young enough and high enough up the senority list, this is the answer.

It is a marathon not a sprint.

 

[gutshotdraw]

I can feel the love from here.

I'm feeling the love in Boston amigo. Gotta love Tito. 8-0 in World Series games. The fact that he played ball (and won the College World Series) at my alma mater has nothing to do with it of course:beer:

 

[Diesel]

No of course not.

123.45 was lit up the other night with all the airline dispatchers giving the play by play.

it wasn't needed though because you knew boston was going to win regardless.

But such a slamming? It must hurt.

 

[Some guy]

I agree that because of our growth it eventualy became impractical to call our schedulers and inquire about x, y or z. But by limiting pilot contact with the schedulers, it also cut out the A-Team factor that was fairly prevalent 5+ years ago. There were even rumors, at that time, of schedulers being "compensated" for extended days, etc. I'm not sure if any of this was true, but it seemed that way sometimes. And trust me, I'm not saying that the A-Team has disappeared either -- but they have definitely had their legs chopped off at the knees.

A smaller organization like NJI, obviously, has some advantages. I'm not convinced that we could now implement such a thing at NJA, though, given our size. A "culture improvement" is very much needed, however.

Most of the Schedulers in Okatie came from CMH. Same people, different environment. It's easier to be a little more personal when you are talking to the same people (NJI) every time. When NJA had the super growth spurt a couple of years ago, there was a long transition time when plans and processes changed. Add to that the extra effort it took for them during the pilot contract negotiations...It wasn't easy for anyone. It was tough for most of us; however, things are much different (mostly for the better) than they were during those times.

I am not a scheduler, but have worked closely with them for 7+ years. As far as compensation for the "A-Team", different things were investigated by an outside entity and was found to be untrue.

I really hope that the problems all of you experienced in the past are a things of the past. NJ is still growing and still working the bugs out of our processes. Being that NJ was the first in the business, we had to write the books, rules, etc. There was nobody else we could model ourselves after.

SG

 

[ghostrider64]

Wow I've been gone a very long time but nothing really ever changes does it?

We "all" have letters from management. And we "ALL" read into them as we wish to.

The reality is....someone is being lied to.

Any takers on who that is this time?

 

[NJApilot]

Every NJA and NJI pilot need to get closer to a corporate/charter salary level in the G. SO, get in the door, wait a little bit, quietly get the majority numbers up, play nice and then put our foot DOWN and get the numbers up again!

Agree with you fully. Well said!

 

[208starcheck]

Wow I've been gone a very long time but nothing really ever changes does it?

We "all" have letters from management. And we "ALL" read into them as we wish to.

The reality is....someone is being lied to.

Any takers on who that is this time?

???? What exactly are you talking about? Is this in reference to the NJA/NJI merger? If so, you might want to do a little reading.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Thanks Dude!

You called me "dude". Sweet!

 

[ce750drvr]

As far as compensation for the "A-Team", different things were investigated by an outside entity and was found to be untrue.
SG

I have to call BS on this one.

That entity had ties to people in the company. Ask Chip what happened to his pay pal account on his "website" when the investigation started. I know for a FACT that Chip accepted money in his pay pal account for "favors". Have a friend that did it on several occasions which started the unfolding of our friendship. Ask Chip how can he look himself in the mirror in the morning, when after punching a hole in the wall at work, he brought the NAACP to his "termination" meeting and used the word "racist" to keep his job. We have some great people upstairs, but they are outnumbered by the idiots.

 

[Some guy]

I have to call BS on this one.

That entity had ties to people in the company. Ask Chip what happened to his pay pal account on his "website" when the investigation started. I know for a FACT that Chip accepted money in his pay pal account for "favors". Have a friend that did it on several occasions which started the unfolding of our friendship. Ask Chip how can he look himself in the mirror in the morning, when after punching a hole in the wall at work, he brought the NAACP to his "termination" meeting and used the word "racist" to keep his job. We have some great people upstairs, but they are outnumbered by the idiots.

Maybe you know some things I don't...Fine, so be it. Initials (CW) instead of actual names work just as well.

There are alot of good people upstairs. To make a statement (idiots) like this is uncalled for. If the system has a problem, don't blame the people. We're all in this together.

SG

 

[ce750drvr]

Maybe you know some things I don't...Fine, so be it. Initials (CW) instead of actual names work just as well.

There are alot of good people upstairs. To make a statement (idiots) like this is uncalled for. If the system has a problem, don't blame the people. We're all in this together.

SG

Ok, Calvin Hermius Inglacious Percival did it. Who cares. Maybe you and others do, but honestly he is an idiot IMO. Also, there are some idiots upstairs. I didn't say all of them were. The system has a problem due in part because of said idiots. BTW, I have SEVERAL friends upstairs who are top notch and they tend to agree. Besides, I like the word idiot. Isn't that a word for generous in another language?

 

[Fozzy]

Also, there are some idiots upstairs. I didn't say all of them were.

There are also some idiots on the line. :0