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NJ Recalls

  • Thread starter Thread starter pilotyip
  • Start date Start date
  • Watchers Watchers 95

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G4dude said:
I am ALWAYS in favor of a raise, unless it makes my employer less competitive and endangers our jobs.
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Nice touch on reality on FI. This is not a normal union response tying wages to productivity. It must be understood with the increased cost on companies coming out of DC, raises will be harder to fund
 
gutshotdraw said:
You don't read the union board much, do you?
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Never. My own experience at NJA continues to be very good, so I was wondering what is the problem. The people I am flying with, and I have not flown with you in several years, seem to be happy too, so I am guessing you have had something happen, or are in possession of info not available to many of us. Because you are a smart, rational honest guy, I would like to know what, in your opinion, is going on that should concern me. Your opinion matters to me, where the Union hard core's maunderings don't. Hit me on the BB or private message if you want to stay under the radar, and Happy New Year!
 
pilotyip said:
This is not a normal union response tying wages to productivity. It must be understood with the increased cost on companies coming out of DC, raises will be harder to fund
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...and the continues sluggishness of the world economy, due to over spending, over taxation and over regulation. You are exactly correct, yip.
 
BuckMurdock1 said:
Don't you mean deaths? Last I heard (including on this thread), these old b*stards are staying put...still. Least productive/most expensive labor who will not leave voluntarily.

Kinda curious- is FSI still just letting these old-timers slide through training?..or are they at least holding them to the standard they should be? The guy they paired me with (who was a PIC who'd been at NJA for like 20yrs) for my 6mo recurrent after hire (which was a PIC pc--for whatever reason they do that) was SO bad; he was making callouts that either were never NJA SOP or had been changed 5 yrs prior..the examiner had to correct him each time he said the wrong thing--was very annoying. I gave him the controls to brief the approach and within like 10 seconds he had busted altitude and almost stalled the airplane. Then we got to his checkride...
It was so bad, I was SURE he'd be a bust. Nope--"good job guys..see you next time". WTF!!?!?!
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Of course, you mentioned this to pro-standards or the fitness for duty committee right? Did you raise your concerns with the pilot? Or did you just come on FI.com and throw ALL the "seasoned" pilots under the bus because ONE GUY didn't perform well?

I'm tired of bashing the older guys. This is, and should be, handled on a case by case basis.

I'm 36 years old, had a 67 year old sim-partner who didn't perform well in my last recurrent, and handled it through the proper channels which began with a heart to heart with him.

Hopefully, we'll all be 67 someday, and who knows what our situation will be by then. By that time, I will have had 41 years with my company (God willing) and will NEVER judge why a pilot decides to work or retire.

In short, did you ever consider that YOU may NEED to work when you're 70? Something to think about.
 
fischman said:
Of course, you mentioned this to pro-standards or the fitness for duty committee right? Did you raise your concerns with the pilot? Or did you just come on FI.com and throw ALL the "seasoned" pilots under the bus because ONE GUY didn't perform well?

I'm tired of bashing the older guys. This is, and should be, handled on a case by case basis.

I'm 36 years old, had a 67 year old sim-partner who didn't perform well in my last recurrent, and handled it through the proper channels which began with a heart to heart with him.

Hopefully, we'll all be 67 someday, and who knows what our situation will be by then. By that time, I will have had 41 years with my company (God willing) and will NEVER judge why a pilot decides to work or retire.

In short, did you ever consider that YOU may NEED to work when you're 70? Something to think about.
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This is all easy to say when you are already a PIC at NJ...your opinion is biased. My opinion may be biased as well, but mine is the safer of the two. The fact is most people approaching 70 can barely drive a car safely, let alone be in command of a jet. If you need to work when you are 70, go apply to Walmart. People's lives are more important than some geriatric's personal wants and needs.
On a separate note, I congratulate you on your timing with NetJets...
 
I don't have the time or inclination to do the research, but I'll bet that 65-70 have a better driving record than many younger age groups. CFI, you need to go sit on a beach or something. You are wound much too tight. Stay that way and you won't need to worry about what you are doing at 65. You won't live that long.
Helm
 
This is all easy to say when you are already a PIC at NJ...your opinion is biased. My opinion may be biased as well, but mine is the safer of the two. The fact is most people approaching 70 can barely drive a car safely, let alone be in command of a jet. If you need to work when you are 70, go apply to Walmart. People's lives are more important than some geriatric's personal wants and needs.
On a separate note, I congratulate you on your timing with NetJets...
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I was going to formulate a rebuttal to Fischman, then I read this post and it kinda says it all.
And no; I didn't go to pro-standards (the guy insisted on buying me a steak dinner after because he felt so bad putting all the undue stress on us). Another aspect is that he didn't want to study together at my request. And Fisch, is it really primarily my job to go 'turn him in'? Isn't it the examiners job to 'examine'? I definitely got the impression from FSI the few months I was there before furlough that there are two standards: one for the younger guys (like you and me), and one for the old-timers (like the sim partners both you and I referenced). Was the examiner even close to busting him in your case? Probably not.
Don't get me wrong; I'm not "bashing". Some of the people I most admire are in their 70s..and part of the reason I admire them is that they can recognize their limitations and limitations which father time brings to the table (which, IMHO, are inescapable).

You still want to fly at that age? Go do it!!-- in your own airplane. You still want to work at that age (I pray I don't have to)? Go do it!!-- in a job that doesn't involve you commanding a jet hurdling through the air at 500mph.
 
BuckMurdock1 said:
I was going to formulate a rebuttal to Fischman, then I read this post and it kinda says it all.
And no; I didn't go to pro-standards (the guy insisted on buying me a steak dinner after because he felt so bad putting all the undue stress on us). Another aspect is that he didn't want to study together at my request. And Fisch, is it really primarily my job to go 'turn him in'? Isn't it the examiners job to 'examine'? I definitely got the impression from FSI the few months I was there before furlough that there are two standards: one for the younger guys (like you and me), and one for the old-timers (like the sim partners both you and I referenced). Was the examiner even close to busting him in your case? Probably not.
Don't get me wrong; I'm not "bashing". Some of the people I most admire are in their 70s..and part of the reason I admire them is that they can recognize their limitations and limitations which father time brings to the table (which, IMHO, are inescapable).

You still want to fly at that age? Go do it!!-- in your own airplane. You still want to work at that age (I pray I don't have to)? Go do it!!-- in a job that doesn't involve you commanding a jet hurdling through the air at 500mph.
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I got a steak dinner too.
 
I think its all about getting the Left Seat and nothing else ...
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BTW- I'm in the left seat on the A320 after getting furloughed from NJA & I know that I'll probably NEVER be recalled even if I wanted to; so this notion is not true in my case.
My observation & argument is strictly in the interest of safety for your operation. I hope it doesn't take a few crashes to bring this issue to light "officially".
 
You upgraded over there in 3 years? Wow, didn't realize they were moving folks up so fast...
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Yeah- but I'll be one of the most Jr. CAs (and on RSV) now for several yrs. We recently announced some drastic growth-stoppage plans to try to get profitable.
 
BuckMurdock1 said:
Yeah- but I'll be one of the most Jr. CAs (and on RSV) now for several yrs. We recently announced some drastic growth-stoppage plans to try to get profitable.
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It is really nice to see and hear about folks who got furloughed from NJA and found good jobs elsewhere. I wish more stories like yours came to light.
 

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