NJ Recalls

[KiddDynomite]

Hey G4,

The informational picketing is a little embarassing? What do you suggest we do? The EMT does not, repeat, does not respect the pilot group including you large cabin boys. The young wizard was brought into the company to break the contracts including ours. He is doing a very good job at undermining it too. He is also doing a very good job at destroying a once stellar service and has shown no sense of business accumen or one iota of leadership capability. We need to be on an offensive and aggressively attacking him to show the world what he is all about. You need to lose the idea that we're still one big happy family because we're not. This is a fight for our livlihoods and it's no time to play nice. We'll work with an EMT when we have one willing to work with us. At the moment that is not the case!

 

[pilotyip]

They are all not perfect because they do not impose the same stringent leadership and professional requirements as the military does, i.e. making all commissioned officer grade, leadership positions have a college degree, as of late.

Since we are using a military example, are you suggesting that unions use Nuclear weapons to ensure victory?

 

[KiddDynomite]

Since we are using a military example, are you suggesting that unions use Nuclear weapons to ensure victory?

Yip,

I have never seen a company that got a union that didn't deserve one. I wish things were different but unfortunately they are not. The other unfortunate thing is that it becomes a game. A game that affects many many lives and is truly unnecessary. This is what we have so must play and sometimes that means using the nuclear option. When management no longer wants to negotiate in good faith then the bombs must fall.

 

[gunfyter]

Kidd 1 Yip 0

 

[acaTerry]

What he said, with cherries on top. It is really terrific to welcome people back after such a long time. Now, maybe if the US cuts the corporate tax rate and enacts the Fair Tax and reduces regulations and eliminates the EPA...

Maybe we can follow Burger King and base in Canada. Of course I'll make sure to bring my own American bacon....you know, the real stuff.

 

[BentOver]

AcaTerry...

I think I can help solve this whole debate.....

While some guys have a chip on their shoulder or whatnot.. You have to realize that most , if not all of the furloughees ( or any seasoned pilot for that matter ), doesn't need to be advised of a whole lot.... I think what happens is guys like you, who feel they have to teach the "young guys" how it is, don't realize the breadth of experience everyone has at this point in their careers.

At my current company, every once in a while, I'll get a senior ( or junior captain) who feels the need to explain unions, company, aviation or any combination thereof..... I realize they are just trying to be helpful, but the "lesson" was unsolicitated... If I feel the need to have something explained.....I'll ask..

A lot of returning furloughees are of the same mindset... It's not their first trip to NJA, or aviation, or union contracts... They probably don't need your advice... If they want it they will ask.... But they definitely do not need someone telling them how important your next contract is, or how they should not be weak against management.

 

[acaTerry]

AcaTerry...

I think I can help solve this whole debate.....

While some guys have a chip on their shoulder or whatnot.. You have to realize that most , if not all of the furloughees ( or any seasoned pilot for that matter ), doesn't need to be advised of a whole lot.... I think what happens is guys like you, who feel they have to teach the "young guys" how it is, don't realize the breadth of experience everyone has at this point in their careers.

At my current company, every once in a while, I'll get a senior ( or junior captain) who feels the need to explain unions, company, aviation or any combination thereof..... I realize they are just trying to be helpful, but the "lesson" was unsolicitated... If I feel the need to have something explained.....I'll ask..

A lot of returning furloughees are of the same mindset... It's not their first trip to NJA, or aviation, or union contracts... They probably don't need your advice... If they want it they will ask.... But they definitely do not need someone telling them how important your next contract is, or how they should not be weak against management.

Bent,

Good points but I invite you to go read the simple surface of the original post I made. I'm not preaching or teaching anyone. I was not offering advice, I'm not Dear Abby. It was just a welcome back with a well wish and a little something to look out for. If that comes off as preachy, then the problem is with the receiver and I am done justifying myself to oversensitivity. Besides, call me too old school but I tend to listen to people who have been somewhere or done something before me. They often have something worth listening to. But not everyone can handle a dose of humility and listen to anyone else. Too much esteem-building and Ritalin in the day care centers I guess.
I talk to plenty of the furloughees in person and in different forums, and only one has been offended by the post. In fact, I've even showed it around and asked around if that post was offensive to them. Only ONE person has said that so far. Even my hippie left wing brother in law, who is offended by EVERYTHING found nothing there. So again, I'll just shrug my shoulders and move along. I can't help it if someone insists on being upset.
So far as I'm concerned its all water under the bridge.
My only regret is having been a part of the thread hijacking and I'm going to drop it here and let the thread get back on course. Speaking of which, I am betting that the Sept 28th class is far from being the last.

 

[gutshotdraw]

You know, I have been pleasantly surprised by the behavior of ASAP overall. The informational picketing is kinda embarrassing, but the whole ASAP package is much better than the Teamsters, for instance. I am tentatively concluding the following: in house unions are probably always better than outside unions, by a wide margin.

You know I love ya, right amigo?

It's absolutely time to picket. If you had asked me three or four years ago if I would walk in a circle carrying a sign, I would have called JoAnn to order the drug test.

But this guy running our company (into the ground) needs a wake-up call. The man in Omaha needs a wake-up call.

Did you READ their proposal? They would have you working for table scraps and have you paying ALL of your health care costs (which THEY get to determine) while your peer group in the profession is deciding which retirement condo to buy and whether they REALLY need to fly to age 65.

If I wasn't working my OTHER job on the 22nd (yes, I'm cultivating a back-up career), I would ABSOLUTELY be picketing in SNA a week from Monday.

You need the get used to the fact that this ain't Richie's NetJets anymore, NJI is dead, and the skinny dude with the goofy haircut wants to DESTROY your career.

 

[G4dude]

You know I love ya, right amigo?

It's absolutely time to picket. If you had asked me three or four years ago if I would walk in a circle carrying a sign, I would have called JoAnn to order the drug test.

But this guy running our company (into the ground) needs a wake-up call. The man in Omaha needs a wake-up call.

Did you READ their proposal? They would have you working for table scraps and have you paying ALL of your health care costs (which THEY get to determine) while your peer group in the profession is deciding which retirement condo to buy and whether they REALLY need to fly to age 65.

If I wasn't working my OTHER job on the 22nd (yes, I'm cultivating a back-up career), I would ABSOLUTELY be picketing in SNA a week from Monday.

You need the get used to the fact that this ain't Richie's NetJets anymore, NJI is dead, and the skinny dude with the goofy haircut wants to DESTROY your career.

I always respect your opinion, but what has Hansell done that's so bad? We work harder than we used to, and it is not as enjoyable as it was, but the job is still one of the best around. I suspect you have had some things happen that I have been spared. Care to elucidate on PM? BTW, I am also working on a backup career.

 

[BentOver]

Bent,

Good points but I invite you to go read the simple surface of the original post I made. I'm not preaching or teaching anyone. I was not offering advice, I'm not Dear Abby. It was just a welcome back with a well wish and a little something to look out for. If that comes off as preachy, then the problem is with the receiver and I am done justifying myself to oversensitivity. Besides, call me too old school but I tend to listen to people who have been somewhere or done something before me. They often have something worth listening to. But not everyone can handle a dose of humility and listen to anyone else. Too much esteem-building and Ritalin in the day care centers I guess.
I talk to plenty of the furloughees in person and in different forums, and only one has been offended by the post. In fact, I've even showed it around and asked around if that post was offensive to them. Only ONE person has said that so far. Even my hippie left wing brother in law, who is offended by EVERYTHING found nothing there. So again, I'll just shrug my shoulders and move along. I can't help it if someone insists on being upset.
So far as I'm concerned its all water under the bridge.
My only regret is having been a part of the thread hijacking and I'm going to drop it here and let the thread get back on course. Speaking of which, I am betting that the Sept 28th class is far from being the last.

Just fly the plane and don't worry about or feel the need to be anything to the other guy besides another pilot occupying the same 4x4 ft.space in the front of the plane...

To much advice giving already exists in aviation..... Point A to point B.... As easy and efficiently as possible....