new low for pinnacle

[SkyBoy1981]

I don't have to do any of that, I took a job at an airline that has single occupancy during training, as well as full 72 hr guarantee and per diem. I'm not a prima donna by any means, like it would seem you are insinuating. I just feel it's another degradation of the profession and people are just saying "oh well, it's not that bad".

So are you honestly telling me that you didn't apply to a single one of the airlines that requires you to share a hotel room during training? Not Chautauqua? Not ExpressJet? None of them? Or, by luck of the draw, did you just happen to end up at a carrier that provides single occupancy rooms and now you feel the need to put yourself on a high horse over it? Something tells me its the latter.

To the original poster, how is this a "new low" for Pinnacle? Wasn't it Pinnacle that used to not provide any sort of housing or pay during training at all? If I recall that was the reason I didn't apply to Pinnacle way back whenever I was job searching.

 

[CoATP]

Probably should get facts straight prior to releasing your knowledge. 1.) Single occupancy rooms + food allowance (about 1/2 the fine pay) but no taxes and no other deductions.

 

[AAflyer]

For anyone who says it's "not bad, it's only 5-6 weeks of your life" etc............we're not (supposed to be) kids or in college anymore. We're adults and this is supposed to be a professional field. Do you think Bank of America, Morgan Stanley, Duke Power (I'm just randomly picking companies here), basically any company, ask their employees to share a room when they send them for a seminar somewhere? And this includes brand new, college grad, 22 yr old employees.

Yes, the military has a bunch of guys in the same barracks, I know, I was in the Navy for 4 years, and it sucks. But, this isn't the military people, so that's not a valid excuse.

I don't care what any of you say about "getting off my high horse", it's insulting to be asked to share a room as an adult, like I'm back in the college dorms my freshman year. I'd even compare it to being asked to sit at the kid's table for Thanksgiving dinner.

Maybe it's cause I'm 30 now, and I've had some time to act and be treated like an adult, and to go back to less is regressive.

And you are still not paid like an adult, but that is oK? I will accept $20K my first year as along as I get my own hotel room? Do you think those companies you mentioned pay their starting employees $20K? Maybe in a signing bonus.

AA

 

[AAflyer]

I don't have to do any of that, I took a job at an airline that has single occupancy during training, as well as full 72 hr guarantee and per diem. I'm not a prima donna by any means, like it would seem you are insinuating. I just feel it's another degradation of the profession and people are just saying "oh well, it's not that bad".

You most likely could qualify for food stamps, and are probably living off your credit cards at times, however I am glad to know that is not degrading.

AA

 

[HulkHogan]

OK I will admit a single room is better than the previous no room allowance but honestly guys this really is just ridiculous. I understood other airlines that forced double-occupancy used two room suites where there was a shared living area but separate sleeping areas, maybe that is not fact after all.

CoATP- it is indeed a fact they are doing this at PNCL I just talked to a member of the Jan 3rd class a few days ago.
..
.....
ok continue defending regional airlines now

 

[Icelandair]

If they forced double occupancy on RON's it would be rock bottom.

 

[UZAInstructor]

And you are still not paid like an adult, but that is oK? I will accept $20K my first year as along as I get my own hotel room? Do you think those companies you mentioned pay their starting employees $20K? Maybe in a signing bonus.

AA

No, that's not ok either. Believe me, I've been in no large rush to take a job paying less than I'm currently making instructing. In fact, on principle alone, I resisted applying for about 6 months (hence why I'm just now getting hired at 1600 hrs, instead of the more common 500-700). But after trying numerous other routes to get where I wanted, to no gain, I realized going to the regionals is a necessary evil.

To the other guy who asked if I applied at CHQ, etc..........nope, only applied to one airline, which met my standards, to include single occupancy during training. Not everyone is in such a hurry to fly a jet they'll do anything and put up with anything to get there, hard as that is to believe in the current climate.

 

[UZAInstructor]

You most likely could qualify for food stamps, and are probably living off your credit cards at times, however I am glad to know that is not degrading.

AA

And, I don't really know why you're coming at me like this.............whether you realize it or not, we're on the same side. I'm just trying to retain some semblance of dignity to this career, and this is as good a starting point as any other. I understand you probably feel bitter towards me, assuming I'm one of the flight instructors who could care less who's back I climb on my way to the top. Nothing could be farther from the truth, and I'm insulted every day by the wages these companies are willing to pay. Sad fact is, I see no other route to get the experience that employers who halfway respect their pilots want. And management at the airlines knows this.........

 

[SkyBoy1981]

. But after trying numerous other routes to get where I wanted, to no gain, I realized going to the regionals is a necessary evil.

So when they asked "Why do you want to work here?" during the interview is this what you told them?

There are always other avenues. If you don't want to be at a regional airline, then don't apply. Then we don't have to hear you complain after 6 months on the line of how awful you think it is.

 

[CoATP]

Hulk,
Could be, the Dec. group is single occ. At Pncl before you are qualified (pass check ride) you are a candidate not an employee. In fact during the first year as a probie you are an "at will" employee or in the words of the union "an apprentice." Is the case at other carriers? Mainline as well?

 

[UZAInstructor]

So when they asked "Why do you want to work here?" during the interview is this what you told them?

There are always other avenues. If you don't want to be at a regional airline, then don't apply. Then we don't have to hear you complain after 6 months on the line of how awful you think it is.

Nope, I told em exactly why I wanted to work at that specific airline, and it was the truth. And you won't hear me complain in 6 months, I know exactly what's in my future. I'm not averse to working hard, though I will fight for a fair wage and QOL every chance I get.

 

[DoinTime]

Is the case at other carriers? Mainline as well?

Yes. Every Union Job I have ever seen in any industry has had some sort of probation/apprentice period where you remain an "at will" employee until this period is completed. Usually six months to one year.

 

[Dodge]

UZAInstructor,

Don't let AAflyer get to you. His/Her profile boasts of Saab and BE1900 time. Unless he/she was flying those sweet rides for a corporate outfit, he/she was working for substandard wages himself/herself.

 

[ReverseSensing]

I don't have to do any of that, I took a job at an airline that has single occupancy during training, as well as full 72 hr guarantee and per diem. I'm not a prima donna by any means, like it would seem you are insinuating.

I stand corrected. I incorrectly assumed you were one of those people who take a job offer, only to complain within the first 6 months about all the things you should have known about. Keep in mind that when you compare your airline to anyone else's, there's bound to be something at yours that someone from elsewhere will ridicule. If you don't believe me, post where you're going to work and let the fun begin.

You might want to get through training at least before you get too publicly smug about how smart and noble you were on your choice amongst the "necessary evil" regionals.

On the other hand, sincerely, best of luck at your new job.

 

[Nancy Pryor]

How to boil a frog

Yup I must be a newbie to the industry....I just haven’t figured out that this is just the way it is and O ya I should just be happy to have an offer with such a wonderful company. It is just like UZA said we 'adults' should not be expected to live in a dorm style environment like we did in college. And its people like you BlackBox who just accept these substandard work rules / contracts that make our industry even worse than it already is, O ya great job on negotiating no longer paying out of pocket for training…excuse me if I am not over-impressed. Just because a few other airlines do something doesn’t make it right, dumba**.

HulkHogan and UZAInstructor have it exactly right. As adults, it is insulting to have to share a room in training like a pair of 18 year old college freshmen who don't know any better. Doesn't matter if you're 20, 30, 40 50, or whatever. It's just plain wrong, and the company can easily afford to pay for single occupancy. The study partner argument is specious, because you can just as easily spend time with a study partner and still have a private space to return to when you want to study, relax, sleep or play with yourself.

HulkHogan hit the nail on the head of the other problem too - by accepting these practices, they become the norm. If you throw a frog into hot water, it'll jump right out and hop away. Throw a frog into cold water over a low flame, and it will sit there until it realizes the water temperature is slowly rising, but then it's too late to jump out. The regional airlines are boiling frogs with these practices, and by meekly accepting them it's getting worse for everyone. Who knows what's at the end of the road? Maybe flying for free and paying the regional for the privilege, just to get turbine PIC in the logbook? Sound impossible? Maybe.