New AAI ALPA Strategy: Fire SWA Haters!

[slaquer5]

shootr,

If there was no M/B we would not be having this discussion...it would go ala Morris...M/B strengthens the position of the pilots at the "weaker" carrier...not pessimistic, just realistic...anything other than preferential interviews, a type req't, and starting at the bottom is in my opinion a great deal no current SWA pilot (or employee) ever got...

You might want to review the Morris Air deal. The company wanted to interview all the Morris pilots ,it was swapa that stood up for the morris pilots.
I am thinking you do not have very much trust in SWA HQ. You will see

 

[27 driver]

History can be a great teacher: Let history show, Southwest Airlines would get rid of "troubled group". Example: TranStar/Muse. Don't become Air Tran(Star)

http://www.museair.com/

OOOHHHHH we are so scared.

 

[SWA/FO]

OOOHHHHH we are so scared.

I would be. I would want "on the list" ASAP.

With your 4,000 hours, you wouldn't even be competitive to get a call for an interview at Southwest. Talk about winning the lottery.

 

[Lear70]

Heh heh... 27 driver probably has closer to 14,000 hours by now. That's an old profile update.

 

[scoreboardII]

I would be. I would want "on the list" ASAP.

With your 4,000 hours, you wouldn't even be competitive to get a call for an interview at Southwest. Talk about winning the lottery.

FYI:


http://www.cnn.com/2011/TRAVEL/06/06/airline.industry.outlook/index.html?iref=allsearch

 

[Lear70]

Luckily, we're insulated from the majority of those problems.

The slow down in LAM flying and the issues in Pan-Asia are hurting DAL and AA and CAL, but the domestic and Caribbean markets we fly are doing well, witnessed by the 10.6% increase year-over-year traffic for a combined AAI/SWA this month.

Pretty certain we'll both post profits this year. Summer travel is strong, and pre-bookings for seasonal holiday travel is up as well. Fuel sucks, no doubt, and our revenue will have to increase to offset it. Wouldn't be surprised to see some industry-wide fare hikes starting up later this summer / early Fall.

Southwest May traffic up 10.6 pct. with AirTran
Southwest traffic up 10.6 percent in May, month that marked $1 billion acquisition of AirTran

DALLAS (AP) -- Southwest Airlines Co. said Tuesday its combined traffic with AirTran rose 10.6 percent in May, the month the airline closed its $1 billion acquisition.

AirTran Airways became a wholly owned subsidiary of Southwest Airlines Co. on May 2. The deal overnight increased Southwest's traffic by about 25 percent. Southwest, which is based in Dallas, already flew more U.S. passengers than any other airline before the deal.

The companies said paying passengers flew 9.21 billion miles last month, compared with a combined 8.33 billion a year earlier. At Southwest alone, traffic increased by 10.7 percent. AirTran's traffic rose 10.1 percent.

The airlines' combined capacity, or number of available seats, rose 4.2 percent to 11.14 billion available seat miles.

Their planes were also fuller last month, with the combined occupancy rate increasing by 4.8 percentage points to 82.7 percent.

So far this year, the airlines together have seen the number of passengers on their flights increase by 4.2 percent and traffic rise by 9.9 percent.

While the companies officially combined last month, they won't operate as a single airline until 2012.

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

A little more thankfulness and a little less entitlement would suit you well.

Don't get us wrong, we're very thankful to your mgmt for the airline they've created and grown as well as given you the contract you enjoy. We don't for a minute though believe that SWAPA has some super stellar negotiators never before seen in commercial aviation and that SWAPA is singularly responsible for the position you now enjoy. You should be thankful that Mgmt had the foresight to merge with a formidable opponent so you could start growing again, that's why you fly airplanes and they manage .

 

[Flycatcher99]

Uh, yes I can refute that, Chief. My employment was A-OK, and I was/am in the top third of our seniority list. A good place to be.

Save the cutsie derogatory terms.

Are you hard of reading? I said you cannot refute the fact that AAI pilots were in the midst of a labor fiasco, or that the picture of your overall employment, when compared with that at SWA, was not good. "Overall" means the pilot group. No self-respecting, truthful professional pilot would argue that a pilot job at AAI in September 2010 bore the economic equality and stability of a pilot job at SWA. You say that you were personally happy and content with your position at AAI, and I can appreciate that, but the employment situation (pay, schedule, benefits, etc) for a pilot at AAI was not as good as a pilot's situation at SWA. That's a fact, and no amount of spin is going to change that.

Yes, and I can see that you are also an FO, and prior to that, you were a 1900 pilot. I'm sure you are happy as a pig in poo, and wish this would go away, too. :crying: It's actually a good deal for you, but you can't see it yet. Stay tuned. Wait a few years.

What does my having flown 1900's have to do with anything? SWA pilots are not at peace with this deal, whether they flew 1900's, CRJ's, F16's, or C130's prior to SWA. I have yet to meet one that is. Some are trying to be guardedly optimistic, myself included. But I can tell you this: the mood on September 27 was meloncholic, at best, and it hasn't changed much. Opposite reaction from AAI guys.

And for you to insinuate that you have some rare intelligence that is able to see more clearly than myself or any other SWA pilot how "good a deal" this is, only shows that you are confusing the issue. This acquisition could very well become a good deal for the overall company. We shall see. But you are confusing the "deal" for the company versus the "deal" that SWA pilots are being dealt. Two interdependent, but still separate issues.

Uh, yeah. And how many years of SWA seniority and industry experience do you have? Just like to know who I'm taking advice from. :erm:

Not that it matters, but I've got over 20 years in the industry. But it doesn't take even half that to be able to sort out the nuances of this acquisition, and to be able to identify someone who is spinning the truth in a weak attempt at personal gain.

 

[Flycatcher99]

Don't get us wrong, we're very thankful to your mgmt for the airline they've created and grown as well as given you the contract you enjoy. We don't for a minute though believe that SWAPA has some super stellar negotiators never before seen in commercial aviation and that SWAPA is singularly responsible for the position you now enjoy. You should be thankful that Mgmt had the foresight to merge with a formidable opponent so you could start growing again, that's why you fly airplanes and they manage .

I appreciate your sentiment. I'm not sure where you got the idea, though, that I lack appreciation for my own position. I am extremely thankful, both to the powers that be at SWA, not to mention to God Himself, that I am where I am.

My thankfulness is not the issue, though. My point was one of entitlement, which it would seem that some have an issue with, and a humble suggestion that some of that entitlement would be better replaced with gratefulness for this newfound opportunity. And before anyone tries to make a case that SWA pilots are showing entitlement, please remember whose sandbox we are all jumping into.

Now, if this acquisition ends up bettering this company, as well as all the pilots, then I will be even more grateful to our management. Until then, this group will likely remain cautiously optimistic, at best.

 

[scoreboardII]

Flycatcher, nominated best posts of 2011.

 

[redflyer65]

but the employment situation (pay, schedule, benefits, etc) for a pilot at AAI was not as good as a pilot's situation at SWA. That's a fact, and no amount of spin is going to change that.

I have to agree. Very well articulated Flycatcher.

Too have AAI guys come on here and talk about what a great contract and future they had prior to Sept after a 95+ strike vote and many begging to be bought is pretty disingenous. Please, just call it what it is without the full out spin.

 

[Ty Webb]

I have to agree. Very well articulated Flycatcher.

Too have AAI guys come on here and talk about what a great contract and future they had prior to Sept after a 95+ strike vote and many begging to be bought is pretty disingenous. Please, just call it what it is without the full out spin.

You guys that keep posting our strike vote results obvioulsy don't understand what that really means, and are just broadcasting your lack of knowledge of the nuances of the RLA process.

And the late-night postings of a couple of supposed junior FO's on an anonymous message board will carry all of the "shock and awe" of introducing as evidence an old Perry Mason rerun.

Good luck with that, but you're relying on silly, anecdotal evidence that is only relevant to yourself.

 

[Just thinking]

The overwhelming support of the strike vote was a testament to the solidarity of this pilot group that was sick and tired of being pushed around by our management. We have repeatedly succeeded in difficult times and risen to the occasion to pull this managment team out of the quagmire into which they have so ineptly driven this bus. Our pilot group spoke loudly and with one voice on that occasion and unfortnuatley our union leadership let that opportunity slip away. We heard every excuse as to why we would not get released or why we could not do this or that to push the situation further. This pilot group has been abused by management and by various union leaders throughout the history of this company. Would it have been nice to have a management group that worked WITH the pilots to aid in the success? Our limitation to our efficiencies and productivity were managment imposed. You will find yourselves working with some of the hardest working pilots around. We are professional and work hard to take care of the customers. We go out of our way to ensure that commuting pilots and F/A's get where they are going. We are proactive in cutting off problems. We do this because we are professional pilots who are proud of what we have accomplished. Are there the usual 10%? Certainly. There always is and always will be. (In every company.)
My first reaction on September 27th was to throw up in the back of my throat. Many of us believe that we have a good product and and good route structure with good expansion opportunities. Are we looking forward to working with a management team that places VALUE in its employees/crewmembers? Of course we are. As much as every one of the Southwest team has built the company into what it is today, so has every Airtran employee. Once again.... in spite of our management team.
Your management team embraces the values and walks the walk. Ours provides lip service and will turn on you in a second.
You speak of your culture as if only the selected "chosen" ones are able to succeed in that environment. If it is a work ethic that is required and a willingness to work together to succeed in your culture, rest easy, we go that covered. If it requires a management team to provide that culture, we can rest easy because you have that covered. Why is it that you do not trust your management team at this point in time? They are the foundation of your culture that you hold in such high regard. Have they no done well by you in the past? Have they demonstrated time and time again that they will say one thing and do another? Will they smile at you, shake your hand and break bread with you and then immediately violate the contract that you just took pictures while you signed it? Your management has provided you all the tools to succeed and you have done a great job succeeding. Let the merger committees do their thing and when it all settles in a couple of years Southwest will be in a position where they could not be without the purchase of Airtran. Would Southwest still have been successful? Certainly so. As successful? Probably not. Would Airtran been successful? Probably. (Not certainly.)
Would either be as successful without the aquisition/purchase/merger/stock swap or any of the other terms you choose to use. No.

 

[redflyer65]

Why is it that you do not trust your management team at this point in time?

Trust them 100%. Gary won't let this accquisition ruin 40 years of Southwest history. If you think otherwise, you don't have your head out of the sand.

Ty,

So nothing that happened at AAI prior to Sept. matters? Ahh, okay. Good luck with that. Unfortunately you can't change history.

RF

 

[ASADFW7]

This latest round of who carries a bigger stick is not helping. Not every pilot at AAI wanted to come to swa. And not every pilot at SWA thinks the AAI pilots are seeking what is unfair. Beating each other up once again is pointless. There are two groups meeting right now trying to negotiate a solution. None of it coming from flightinfo.

 

[Ty Webb]

The overwhelming support of the strike vote was a testament to the solidarity of this pilot group that was sick and tired of being pushed around by our management. We have repeatedly succeeded in difficult times and risen to the occasion to pull this managment team out of the quagmire into which they have so ineptly driven this bus. Our pilot group spoke loudly and with one voice on that occasion and unfortnuatley our union leadership let that opportunity slip away. We heard every excuse as to why we would not get released or why we could not do this or that to push the situation further. This pilot group has been abused by management and by various union leaders throughout the history of this company. Would it have been nice to have a management group that worked WITH the pilots to aid in the success? Our limitation to our efficiencies and productivity were managment imposed. You will find yourselves working with some of the hardest working pilots around. We are professional and work hard to take care of the customers. We go out of our way to ensure that commuting pilots and F/A's get where they are going. We are proactive in cutting off problems. We do this because we are professional pilots who are proud of what we have accomplished. Are there the usual 10%? Certainly. There always is and always will be. (In every company.)
My first reaction on September 27th was to throw up in the back of my throat. Many of us believe that we have a good product and and good route structure with good expansion opportunities. Are we looking forward to working with a management team that places VALUE in its employees/crewmembers? Of course we are. As much as every one of the Southwest team has built the company into what it is today, so has every Airtran employee. Once again.... in spite of our management team.
Your management team embraces the values and walks the walk. Ours provides lip service and will turn on you in a second.
You speak of your culture as if only the selected "chosen" ones are able to succeed in that environment. If it is a work ethic that is required and a willingness to work together to succeed in your culture, rest easy, we go that covered. If it requires a management team to provide that culture, we can rest easy because you have that covered. Why is it that you do not trust your management team at this point in time? They are the foundation of your culture that you hold in such high regard. Have they no done well by you in the past? Have they demonstrated time and time again that they will say one thing and do another? Will they smile at you, shake your hand and break bread with you and then immediately violate the contract that you just took pictures while you signed it? Your management has provided you all the tools to succeed and you have done a great job succeeding. Let the merger committees do their thing and when it all settles in a couple of years Southwest will be in a position where they could not be without the purchase of Airtran. Would Southwest still have been successful? Certainly so. As successful? Probably not. Would Airtran been successful? Probably. (Not certainly.)
Would either be as successful without the aquisition/purchase/merger/stock swap or any of the other terms you choose to use. No.

Awesome post. I couldn't agree more. The only difference for me is that when I heard the announcement, I was relieved. Not psyched, not stoked, but relieved that we would finally be out from under our corporate culture of "worst practices" management.

The "throwing up in the back of the throat" began later, on Flightinfo, when I realized that many SWA pilots, especially the FO's, were jealously viewing us as a step-siblings that they were going to have to share their toys with, even though we brought our own, and couldn't care less about theirs.

 

[RLAblows]

I appreciate your sentiment. I'm not sure where you got the idea, though, that I lack appreciation for my own position. I am extremely thankful, both to the powers that be at SWA, not to mention to God Himself, that I am where I am.

My thankfulness is not the issue, though. My point was one of entitlement, which it would seem that some have an issue with, and a humble suggestion that some of that entitlement would be better replaced with gratefulness for this newfound opportunity. And before anyone tries to make a case that SWA pilots are showing entitlement, please remember whose sandbox we are all jumping into.

Now, if this acquisition ends up bettering this company, as well as all the pilots, then I will be even more grateful to our management. Until then, this group will likely remain cautiously optimistic, at best.

Very well put flycatcher, but the end statement is the confusing part for me and maybe some others. The deal is already bettering the company. Traffic has been increased because of AT. Aircraft deliveries are increasing because of AT. Listen to Mr. Kelly's hotline message about our international flying. It seems to be helping out in many ways as far as being profitable and forging the future for SWA going international. There doesn't seem to be anything negative for the company from this deal. I could go on and on, but every one of these things don't seem to matter to some, (Airtran and Southwest pilots alike) the big picture should show that all of this, deliveries, international, hiring, upgrades, etc. is a beneficial byproduct for all the pilots and employees. We are going to have to get past this ME ME ME mentality. What's in it for you? Movement, upgrades, deliveries, international flying, capturing 30% of the domestic market share, lots of potential growth. I get it. AT pilots are getting a big pay increase once we get over on the SWAPA contract, and me personally, I don't want to step on anyone's toes to get there, but no matter where I fall on the seniority list I will, because some people will always feel that we were "acquired not hired." To those people I have to say, get over yourselves "super pilots." Mergers are a circumstance in any industry, and in our industry we need to set the example, and not go down the same road the USAirways/AWA pilots have. We need to stop finger pointing at each others pilot group and start looking at the bigger picture for the company. If it's beneficial for the company it will be beneficial for all the employee groups. Let the MC's do their job and let the chips fall where they may, but stop with the demeaning and derogatory statements. If it goes DOH, relative, or (this would suck) staple I will live with it. The sun will still rise everyday and I'll make the best of it. I look forward to working with everyone on the other side.
Vaya con dios.

 

[madjack]

If it goes relative OR DOH, this will be an unpleasant place to work...that is what is at stake...a great culture and relationship with management...good luck to us all...

 

[RLAblows]

If it goes relative OR DOH, this will be an unpleasant place to work...that is what is at stake...a great culture and relationship with management...good luck to us all...

That will be your choice. you can make it as unpleasant as you want, but I don't understand what good that will do.

 

[Tripower455]

That will be your choice. you can make it as unpleasant as you want, but I don't understand what good that will do.

Sounds like something a rapist would tell his victim.